RE: House (Full Version)

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ND Mallet -> RE: House (6/4/2012 19:16:43)

This is what happens when you allow houses to be sold with interest rates on them Now unless you want to spend well over 50$ just to get one weapon in ED, I'd vote against having houses sell for more than you buy them for.



rej -> RE: House (6/4/2012 19:26:52)

@Nd. Prices are like that because players can receive Z-tokens simply by winning battles. It has nothing to do with housing sell back prices.



Mr. Black OP -> RE: House (6/4/2012 19:34:47)

@ND
The prices here are already inflated, we spend over $15 for a fully enhanced weapon, so as long as the devs implement this and do not raise the prices it will be a step in the right direction.
As long as the devs don't raise the prices then there would be no problem. This isn't real life so inflation, deflation, etc shouldn't apply in this game. For instance, level cap players are probably only a small percentage of the community, so there is little demand for weapons but an infinite supply. So shouldn't all level cap prices go down to a reasonable amount? Even with limited items the prices are about the same. So why should they only follow economic laws when it is negative for the players?
Also I only think it's bad in AQ because you can get tokens from just fighting, ballyhoo, and 50% sell back, so you just need 200 tokens to start off with (for the tent) and your set. But in ED once you spend varium there is no way to get it back, no ballyhoo, no random varium drops (unless they still drop assault bots), and a miniscule sell back.



Stabilis -> RE: House (6/4/2012 19:39:21)

I am searching the design notes/release logs for when the map was upgraded. The house to region porting was introduced in Gamma, but there is no mention so far stating the map upgrade... was it as far as being into Delta? I do not know, but I am finding out.



ND Mallet -> RE: House (6/4/2012 19:50:44)

@rej and OP You do realize the cap for getting Z-tokens in battle is 50 if you're a Guardian right and I believe Ballyhoo counts towards that cap. Take a look at a Darkovia Mansion Estate The sellback is 14,400 and increases by 1% of the original cost every week. So in one week you get 160 Z-Tokens with no battles at all. That's 3 and one-fifth of the Token cap for Guardians. In under 2 years the sellback doubles the original price. That's over 50$ and you did nothing but sit on your butt the whole time. You probably didn't even pay 50$ to get the house in the first place. The Devs simply aren't going to keep the varium prices low so we can get a better value for stuff and they lose out on a bunch of money. AQ probably has one of the lowest incomes of any AE game, if not the lowest because of the simple fact that you only need to buy Guardian once and maybe a 10k Token package so you can abuse the housing system for free stuff(assuming you even bother with Z-token items in the first place)



Mr. Black OP -> RE: House (6/4/2012 20:07:46)

@ND
I know 50 is the cap, 50x365=18,250, which is $45.63 a year from just hitting the cap. That's not even including houses. I'm not even sure if ballyhoo counts toward the cap or not.
To reach that in ED you would need to buy 4 luxury mine suites and wait a year. That will give you $45, still slightly lower.

Also by doing this they are encouraging players to stay longer, they stay longer they are more likely to buy varium, if they buy varium then that makes up for the loss in profit.
Well that's how I see it.

EDIT: Just asked on AQ Q&A, Ballyhoo does NOT count towards the daily cap. Unless the person who answered me was wrong.

quote:


How about having a house opens your own bank, then anonymous investors go in there donating battle tokens and credits. Which you can take whenever you want. Using the tokens you can expand the vaults allowing you to get more tokens and credits. If you don't withdraw the tokens the overflow will not be kept. You can also "order" special weapons that are only accessible to you that you can get with tokens. Maybe just +1 damage or 2 more stats or something.

Gives houses and tokens a use.

Anyone?



Stabilis -> RE: House (6/4/2012 21:30:29)

@ND,

Since we are talking about AQ for some reason and level improving house inflation (interesting concept), I have accounts as old as '02 and '03 and not one of my accounts hit level 100 even when playing weekly for hours. It is a casual game and EpicDuel is an active PVP, so the differences are quite contrasting. Having Z-tokens in AQ may give you uber equipment but other guardians are in the same boat.



Lycus -> RE: House (6/5/2012 7:48:05)

I agree with Depressed Void in the fact you can't compare the two; comparing Adventure Quest and EpicDuel isn't really something that strengthens anyones argument, because the games are rather incomparable. Adventure Quest is not an MMO, nor does it include PvP. What this means, is that they can allow player to gain these things, without it ruining it for other people, without it ruining the game overall. EpicDuel however, being a PvP multiplayer game, everything one player does, can technically effect many other players. So increasing House prices will always be one of those subjects that has arguments in both directions.

You have the argument that it keeps players around, it would solve the 'pricing issues', and it would encourage people to purchase houses. Then you've got the counter arguments for those, may encourage players to purchase housing, not play for a long time, and then come back to more credits and Varium, that's not what wants to be encouraged at all. Why give people who don't play the game much, or benefit the community because of that, a reward, it's not fair. The whole of the pricing for everything, is being looked at on a whole by RabbleFroth, when he has free time, so that's already being worked on, technically this housing thing would be seen as another 'shortcut fix' which is what players keep complaining about, not fixing the route of the problem, but instead putting something else in place that may help a bit. It encourages people to buy houses, but that's no longer beneficial to the game in anyway, it's just a money farm. People would pay once for a package, buy one of each house, wait for a few months, and make a huge profit. That's not benefiting anyone but themselves, not the game, nor the other players.

Maybe gradual inflation may work, but at the same time, maybe it wouldn't. The idea on a whole has so many flaws, it could, more than likely, create more complaints, and issues than there is without it. The amount of arguments for and against it go much further than what is stated above. Since it seems like an idea that is being suggested now purely for the idea of getting free Varium for the people who are suggesting it (I don't mean any offence by that, I'm just judging on the posting fashion so far, that is the message you are giving), and it obviously won't benefit any one apart from the house buyers, which in a PvP game, where this effects everyone, it just wouldn't really work. May be there's further ideas that could solve these issues, but right now, I don't see any. That's my opinion on the matter, if you disagree, then that's perfectly fine, but this is purely based on the way in which you have all been posting.



khalidon5000 -> RE: House (6/5/2012 7:53:52)

What if you have to play for a certain amount of time a week to receive the interest for that week...



rayniedays56 -> RE: House (6/5/2012 7:58:43)

To be honest, I think the Devs have more important features to look over; like balance, bugs, and other things.



Stabilis -> RE: House (6/5/2012 8:01:33)

Yep, and dormant features like houses come after those, right now our developers are occupied with the war.



rej -> RE: House (6/5/2012 16:16:42)

quote:

@rej and OP You do realize the cap for getting Z-tokens in battle is 50 if you're a Guardian right and I believe Ballyhoo counts towards that cap. Take a look at a Darkovia Mansion Estate The sellback is 14,400 and increases by 1% of the original cost every week. So in one week you get 160 Z-Tokens with no battles at all. That's 3 and one-fifth of the Token cap for Guardians. In under 2 years the sellback doubles the original price. That's over 50$ and you did nothing but sit on your butt the whole time. You probably didn't even pay 50$ to get the house in the first place. The Devs simply aren't going to keep the varium prices low so we can get a better value for stuff and they lose out on a bunch of money. AQ probably has one of the lowest incomes of any AE game, if not the lowest because of the simple fact that you only need to buy Guardian once and maybe a 10k Token package so you can abuse the housing system for free stuff(assuming you even bother with Z-token items in the first place)


Exactly, 50 z-tokens a day compared to 22.875 z-tokens a day from most the expensive house in existence. (Few players stick with that game long enough to be able to afford that house.)
Thank you for proving my point, in a rather roundabout way.
If players were to be able to get varium from beating other players, then prices would indeed skyrocket. However, simply having progressively increasing sell back rates on houses would have little or no effect on prices



Retrosaur -> RE: House (6/5/2012 18:43:49)

quote:

This is what happens when you allow houses to be sold with interest rates on them Now unless you want to spend well over 50$ just to get one weapon in ED, I'd vote against having houses sell for more than you buy them for.


Agreed. Most of you are forgetting; AQ is a PvE game, and EpicDuel is a PvP game. Big difference. PvP has to have stricter control over currency and inflation, and PvE can be a bit more lenient.



Ez_Ease -> RE: House (6/5/2012 19:38:36)

I would buy a house if I was able to store my extra equipment in a closet or a rack for my weapons,
then I would not have to scroll through equipment that I am not currently using.



Mr. Black OP -> RE: House (6/5/2012 19:41:37)

@hyped
$11 a year max for every house you own. You can work an hour and a half on minimum wage where I live and get this. Also economic principles do not apply in this game.
Look at limited rare items as an example. They cost the same as non rare items. Even though there are a limited amount of them and the same demand they cost EXACTLY the same varium wise. If anything ED follows a more socialist economic system.
If ED ran on a free market system then inflation would be likely to occur (well actually more like deflation due to the high prices). But the devs themselves put in the prices for every weapon. If they simply do not touch the prices there is 0 chance of inflation happening because there is not an automated pricing system that raises or lowers prices based on the amount of varium people have.

What % of people in ED own houses anyways? To even get a house you need varium (unless you got extremely lucky with the arcade). If you are concerned about people buying a house then going inactive, just make it so you have to log in every couple weeks for it to raise the sell back.



Lycus -> RE: House (6/5/2012 20:52:48)

Since this has turned off-topic to talk about AQ and has started to turn into a financial discussion, I'm locking this up. As stated, there is a lot of things higher than this on the priority list, and now the idea has been put on the table, it shall be discussed when time permits. Thank you all for your input, and as I said before, I understand there's going to be opinions on both side. What was said by Hyped is extremely true, and has to be remembered.

@Mr Black Op: As stated before, the whole of the price structure is being looked at by RabbleFroth, when time permits. What you are proposing is something incredibly hard/impossible to code and includes a complete revamp of the housing system.



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