Berzerker is OP. (Full Version)

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Raffillia -> Berzerker is OP. (2/9/2013 10:47:36)

Alright, to start with, it's terribly OP.

That and it's spelled Berserker, with an 's'.

Let's check out a common build:

HP: 100
Dam: 25-30 + 35 (60-65)
Def: 20-24 +6 +6 (32-36)
Res: 23-27 +4 +4 (31-35)

Max Double Strike: 60-65 + 33% = 79.8-86.45 (80-87)
Max Berzerker: 60-65 + 90% = 104 - 123.5 (104-124)

Total Damage in two turns: 184-210.45 (184-211)

You can say that it's blockable, however, it isn't blocked enough.
You can say "But x skill is OP" but this is over the top. Matrix or Shields won't help and 35-42 Def/Res won't even help if they hit 60-65 the turns AFTER your probable chance of surviving.

Nerf to make it a 50/50 block chance or something else.

quote:

Well Raffilia, I can help you here then :)


the damage calculation:


A mercenary has 25-30+35 energy primary damage with a maxed berzerker.


A tm has 30-36+5 resistance and casts technician, effectively gaining 41-50+5 resistance.


The mercenary then uses berzerker.


The damage calculated is:

(25-30+35(90%))-(41-50+5)

25-30+35+32
60-65+32
92-97 Energy Damage

(92-97)-(46-55)

42-46 Energy damage


^
^
^this is the version I see.


The version you suggested is thus:

(25-30+35)(90%)-(46-55)

60-65(90%)

60-65+54-59

114-124 energy damage


59-78 energy damage.




Weapons damage only (42-46)
Strength added in with (59-78)

While berzerker is rather OP, I highly doubt that it can do 59-78 damage when my resistance is still high.

Son't get me wrong, 42-46 damage is still WAY to high when someones defenses are high, while also costing only 45 EP at max.



I was too lazy to recalculate.



King Helios -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/9/2013 10:50:21)

A Tech requirement. They almost always have an energy armor.



Dimentic -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/9/2013 11:01:07)

Tech requirement for berzerk will prolly fix it.



King Helios -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/9/2013 11:11:14)

How about this.

Berzerker Tech Requirement:

Level 1 - 26
Level 2 - 28
Level 3 - 30
Level 4 - 32
Level 5 - 34
Level 6 - 36
Level 7 - 38
Level 8 - 40
Level 9 - 42
Level 10 - 44



Raffillia -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/9/2013 11:17:30)

Tech requirement isn't viable.

To get 20-24 Res you need 56(Or maybe 57) tech points.

And from what I can tell you, that's quite easy to acquire.

Let's not forget that if they decide to fork over 44 points to tech, there's still a good 23-27+ base damage worth AND their +35/36 primaries.



Remorse -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/9/2013 11:18:44)

All they need to do is massively nerf all STR based moves calculated by a % of weapon damage.



They also need to nerf that STR stat as itslef.


Perhaps making the damage per stat invested slightly lower, enough to make the STR abusers counter-able without luck.



Raffillia -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/9/2013 20:22:06)

I'm thinking of supporting either 50/50 block and/or an str stat nerf.



RageSoul -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 0:54:17)

Nah , it's actually the bonus EP/level-up that's allowing them to do so ,and not the skill itself.



GamZ24/7 -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 1:35:51)

I do agree the berserker is OP but pls just stop nerfing tactical mercs and mercs but mainly tactical. I waisted real money on that nerfed -_- ... why not nerf the increased gun dmg all mages can do. Give mercs and tactical mercs more defense and resistance buff they were meant to be tough not weak -_- we shouldnt be able to die before round 5. It would decrease the people using mercs with op str builds. They use op str builds and op supp builds because they have nothing else to go to other than switching to a diffrent class which I think im going to save credits to switch because tactical mercs are so UNDER POWERED with out the huge str or supp builds.



RageSoul -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 1:41:36)

@Gamz24/7
You might wanna explain why Deadly Aim should be removed on both Mages then?



GamZ24/7 -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 1:49:56)

not removed but nerfed because a str build with that is just op they deal rage dmg and even more with the malf



RageSoul -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 1:56:41)

quote:

< Message edited by GamZ24/7 -- 2/10/2013 1:46:58 >

Seems that you changed it , but :
quote:

not removed but nerfed because a str build with that is just op they deal rage dmg and even more with the malf

No need to , because if it was nerfed , then STR will still be dominant due to the other builds getting nerfed as well .



GamZ24/7 -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 2:03:07)

Yeah its just str thts the problem then. For a well balanced game for every op skill there should be a counter every one can spec into if thts what they want to do.



Remorse -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 2:04:56)

no classes specifically need a nerf,

STR the stat alone and the STR based attacks ( every class has them) needs a nerf

So technically nerfing STR and STR based attacks calculated as a % of weapon damage.

Is a nerf for all but possibly a game fixing balance change.



GamZ24/7 -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 2:07:55)

Notice whats on the EpicDuel Battle Strategy forum its full of tm or mercs asking for builds I know people starting as tm are having alot of problems because its the hardest to win with.



rayniedays56 -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 3:54:58)

Well Raffilia, I believe that the way you calculate the damage is off ( I might be wrong)


But doesn't the added bonus apply to the damage of the weapon itself?

Like this:

25-30+35

35*90%
32

So, the damage is 25-30+35+32

92-97 damage


Which is still a HUGE chunk



Blitzex/Sr. Zeph -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 4:31:45)

Raynie is right, the % is only calculated by the 35 wep dmg, not str itself.

But i suggest it to be removed from the game, and replace it with another skill.
Maybe something like toxic grenade?
They dont have a poison skill so



DeathiZClarity -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 4:34:04)

^ supported, but replace berserker with toxic grenade, becuase it is the most op. they can still use strength builds, just not as op without berserker.



Raffillia -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 8:35:44)

@Raynie

Checked out a Merc's skill tree.

Doesn't say anything about -just- weapon damage. What you did say will be taken into account, however.

Checked TM's skill tree, explicitly stated only sidearm damage will be amplified. (For reference)



theholyfighter -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 8:36:41)

^it IS based on weapon damage.



Giras Wolfe -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 10:43:53)

This is simple...add 1 warmup to the skill.

The reason this skill is so attractive to people is the 2 turn kill possibility.

If we add another warmup turn on it those players will probably feel more encouraged to try other builds.

In addition to this, it should also have a tech or support requirement, like the most powerful bounty hunter skills.

Between an added warmup, the tech requirement, and the fact that is blockable players won't feel like it's always their best option, but It'll still be useful.

I think these would be appropriate fixes.



theholyfighter -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 10:46:29)

1. A 1 turn Warmup for Stun skills
2. Tech requirement for Berserker

This may fix the Str abuse for Mercs, but IMO Str BMs are still Oped...



Giras Wolfe -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 10:47:45)

^Actually, Double Strike/Berserker is much more common than Stun Berserker now. But I feel that dealing with berserker should solve the problem very neatly.



deoxy30 -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 11:29:09)

Well, increase the Energy for berserker. I think it will balance it. Since more ep will be required to add on berserker, the less health,str,dex,tech or supp will be required to do so. Like eg. max fireball for lvl 1 berzerker(32), and increasing berserker per level, make it lower, so overall, more energy will be required to add berserker. So if 45 energy required to use max berserker, make it 54 energy to use max berserker.



Warmaker04 -> RE: Berzerker is OP. (2/10/2013 13:51:13)

If the berserker is blocked in fight, the fight is pretty much done, so i dont agree its OP. and it blocks too often.
and no point. 57 tech and str still match up. even the build will be more pro.



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