RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (Full Version)

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Exploding Penguin -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/15/2013 18:28:47)

quote:

its actually the same block chance because higher tec reduces more dex with smoke, increasing your block chance more. and a better smoke increases damage output more.


I was talking about how I countered glass cannons, not what type of stat investments they had. And honestly, about 4 more tech points for 1 more dex debuffed is no where near equivalent to just investing into dex when trying to get highest block chance.



ValkyrieKnight -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/15/2013 23:57:27)

@ Devine Darkness

Tech Mage isn't OP
Bounty Hunter Isn't OP

Azreal is what makes them OP. They're easy to count without it.



Scyze -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/16/2013 1:06:24)

@ValkyrieKnight,
Yes!



EpicIsEpic -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/16/2013 4:19:55)

@ValkyrieKnight
True that.



Mother1 -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/16/2013 5:43:47)

@ valerie

Funny thing is I don't actually have too many problems with these players. I can beat them about 50/50 myself even with the azreal's gear. and personally myself when this gear comes out I might get the gun but as for the aux I have no need for it. But hopefully by then balance will have changed to the point where this item will fade just like the azreal's borg and infernal intridicitor did.

But on another note when I was coming up the azreal's borg or azreal's aux wasn't my bane (This was because they wasn't made yet). The bane to me back in the day was the assault bot. back then it made fighting jugs almost impossible. It was bad enough that they had varium advantage but that bot made and debuffs me and my partner used almost worthless.




Necromantres -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/16/2013 6:41:23)

quote:

db gone, massacre nerfed, whatnot. they hav aleady recieved their share of nerfing man


oh really? let's talk about the IA nerf, how many was it nerfed before it was balanced?
Or even better let's talk about Mercenaries...how many times were they nerfed? How many times did the poor merc losed to BH. How many months were mercs the UP class (still up to debate)?
You should be thankfully you aren't stuck with a class were even an experienced player struggle to win fights like i was back than (not that i didn't enjoyed a bit, made me fight for something)



Ranloth -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/16/2013 6:46:36)

Amount of nerfs doesn't mean class is balance nor shouldn't be nerfed anymore. Necromantres has given you the perfect example of it. End result? It was balanced perfectly - has great power but not as abuseable.

The only change needed is to debuffers. I'm pretty sure BHs aren't OP unless they use Smoke and/or Azrael's Will. Without either, are they strong? With one of them, are they strong? With both, are they too strong?

What needs to be done is move Smoke + Malf from "Stat/4" to "Stat/5", so it matches the Omega standards after HP has went down, our total stats were reduced and defence was nerfed. HP change being the most crucial one since it has nerfed defensive builds as a whole. I'm pretty sure that after debuffers would be altered, BHs nor TMs (glass cannons) wouldn't be as overpowered as people say. BHs have Tech builds which empowers Smoke, givse you Resistance and goes great with Focus 5, not mentioning low chance to get deflected and Azrael's Will if you have it. That's called synergy and a combo, not whole class being overpowered.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/16/2013 14:13:26)

quote:

You should be thankfully you aren't stuck with a class were even an experienced player struggle to win fights


you do realise i hav a merc? thankful? no.

and trans, i dont agree with 5 stat progression. 4.5 seems reasonable.



Ranloth -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/16/2013 14:26:08)

Merc? Struggling to fight? That'd be your build, not the class' fault. Mercenaries can compete quite well.

We're lookinga at a nerf, not lowering it by -1 or -2. You get +10 more at 40 <stat> and +25 at 100 <stat>. With 4.5, it'd be +10 for 45 <stat> and 113 <stat> for +25. And with 5, it'd be +10 for 50 <stat> and +25 for 125 <stat>

I'm not looking at a VERY minor change, it won't do much but lower it by -1 or -2 in most cases which does almost nothing. With /5, you're losing -3 with moderate Tech and -4 and above with high Tech. Unlike PB which needed a tiny nerf (from /4 to /4.5), Malf and Smoke need their power reduced where it's at least noticeable. At all levels, not just specific range.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/16/2013 14:37:05)

errrm, im fine with the class. im not struggling. it is easy to master. i was just proving a point to necro



Ranloth -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/16/2013 14:45:30)

You =/= everyone. Not everyone are using your build nor your class. Likewise with items (cores). Any class should be able to beat it, with some builds struggling due to weaknesses but not to the extent where everyone are struggling or getting a hard time.



Necromantres -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/16/2013 15:40:59)

i was talking about the past merc, now it's quite fine. I told you an example that it doesn't matter how many nerfs the class had ,that doesn't assure balance.
You don't want them nerfed because you do fine with them, i also do but other one no.It's like saying str/supp mages aren't a problem if you have shadow arts (back when they were OP), not everyone has it, not everyone use it.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/17/2013 14:44:13)

but str/support mages are fine.



The Basic Instinct -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/17/2013 15:47:17)

Once again... Read my first post. I specifically said that the build was Overpowered, NOT the class.



kittycat -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/18/2013 1:33:33)

Well maybe a good way to address this is to as your strength increases, deflection chances and block chances increase slightly in favor of your opponent(s). for support, once you reach the advantage of 20% more, the remaining goes to the opponent :)



Mysterion. -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/18/2013 4:13:30)

The build isn't OP.
There is a difference in Fast builds and OP builds.

OP builds are TLMs with surg and poison bot and BHs with poison bot and a good EMP (Good example is Imagine Dragon for TLMs and B O N U S for BHs.
High STR-Smoke BHs are fast, not OP.

Learn the difference.



Scyze -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/18/2013 4:16:53)

The build Imagine Dragon made isn't that great when you stop them from using Surgical Strike. I've never lost to someone who uses it when I use Static Smash.



Mysterion. -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/18/2013 4:34:30)

^ For you not maybe, but all builds have a counterbuild, apparently yours is theirs.
When you can reach 90%, it pretty much sums it up.

Players skill count in this, yes, but 90% isn't only skill, its the build aswell...



Scyze -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/18/2013 7:17:46)

@Mysterion.,
I'm confused...



Mysterion. -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/18/2013 8:14:25)

^ What do you not understand?
Every build has its weakness, your build is Imagine Dragons build weakness.



Scyze -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/18/2013 8:29:06)

@Mysterion.,
So her build is weak against me or is my build weak against her?



Mysterion. -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/18/2013 8:43:14)

^ Really?
I think i'm perfectly clear..

But yes, i meant that your build is good against hers.



The Basic Instinct -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/18/2013 9:57:04)

I completely disagree about the poison bot with the Surgical Strike. I don't really believe that it is impossible to beat those guys. If anything it should be very easy as long as you have a good Field Medic.



DanniiBoiixD -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/18/2013 11:03:22)

Imagine Dragon's build isn't even better than the regular 5 focus tlm build ss and IA.



VanitySixx -> RE: Op Bounty Hunter builds (7/19/2013 3:28:33)

Bounty Hunters are not even overpowered. As I said numerous times before, Glass Cannons and Azrael's Will are overpowered. If Bounty Hunters were overpowered, why did Edward Cullen go about 45-50 wins 100% as a mercenary a week or two ago? And finished off the boards at I think 92%? I have yet to see a bounty hunter get all those wins at a high percentage like that.

My level 30 Tactical Mercenary was around 85% on the boards 4 days ago with around 145 wins in 1v1. My main account, which is a bounty hunter, jumps around from 65-80% in 1v1 and 60-85% in Juggernaut. If you ask me, Bounty Hunters are not OP. But here's why most people believe so,

Bounty Hunters are by far the most luck given class in the entire game. Shadow Arts with even a level 1 stun grenade can stun most people. Smoke boosts with Tech so high tech = Deflections as well as a high smoke for higher damage. Shadow Arts also enables us to block +10% more and if you want to add the Ninja core along with it, +14%. But here's the thing... Bounty Hunters are able to get all of these things to increase luck, so alongside Azrael's Will and Glass Cannon they'd have to win by typical luck.

Bounty Hunters do NOT always have this luck. Some battles can be unlucky and sometimes a BH can have an entire unlucky day. I've seen Bounty Hunters jump around 60-85% all over the boards. From pro Bounty Hunters to lower level, luck matters a lot to us. But if you notice one thing, the people with Azrael's Will and Glass Cannon are basically unstoppable if a Bounty Hunter is having some serious luck.

To sum it all up, Don't blame the Bounty Hunters! Blame Azrael's Will and Glass Cannon.



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