RE: Passive Rework (Full Version)

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kosmo -> RE: Passive Rework (8/31/2013 9:12:34)

i like this idea ALOT, but i know that the problem whit passives its not just the fact that they are a must and u need to invest 20 skills points into them, the problems whit passives its how to balance them whit the others class and the rest of our skill three;
right now bloodlust, adrenaline, sahdows arts (and probably dadly aim too) are totally broken, the first one is way too op, ik it has been buffed a few months ago, but that was just a mistake, because ppl continued to complain that bm was up (totally untrue but they relised that only after the class started to be spammed). the others 2 passives (adrenaline and shadows arts) are balance bracking some times, or totally usless others.
i suggest to fix bloodlust and dadly aim, and totally replace shadows and adrenaline whit a usefull passive (if this is the case i think that even emp granade and static smash should be reworked a bit)



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Passive Rework (8/31/2013 16:47:46)

they could bring back the old shadow arts! 10% bonus block, deflect, crit, and stun!



Dual Thrusters -> RE: Passive Rework (8/31/2013 19:08:26)

Hunters shouldn't need luck to be a threat.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Passive Rework (8/31/2013 20:05:11)

they dont. this just makes them more fun. so then support bounty will be reborn, tec hunter will be buffed, and a focus tank build with some support will be more threatening.



goldslayer1 -> RE: Passive Rework (9/1/2013 3:50:42)

@ED
getting lucky is fun for the lucky person. imagine what its like for the person on the other end.

solutions that are based on luck aren't the answers.



Mother1 -> RE: Passive Rework (9/1/2013 4:26:40)

@ ED

You want to buff luck when we have people wanting luck reduced, just plain removed? No thank you.

Shadow arts needs to be removed and replaced with another skill completely.



Bloodpact -> RE: Passive Rework (9/1/2013 11:09:57)

To your want of increased luck I say NO NO NO NO NO!



Chosen 0ne -> RE: Passive Rework (9/2/2013 22:03:24)

I like this a lot actually. It'll also make different classes more defined. If the devs want to remake passives I would want this to be the way they do it.



Rayman -> RE: Passive Rework (9/3/2013 0:04:18)

ED: SA Never had 10% Crit, Only block, deflect and stun.



Xendran -> RE: Passive Rework (9/3/2013 20:45:24)

About empty slots:

1. We had an empty slot in the bottom left of every tree for years.
2. It's easy to make 2 new skills for every class if you know what you're doing.
3. Blood Mage still needs to get a Blood Magic passive (casting with HP. More too it than that obviously, but that's the basic premise).



Bloodpact -> RE: Passive Rework (9/4/2013 1:18:00)

^ ikr like bloodmage's passive should be "Skills + 10% damage, 1% of this bonus damage to self" 1% dmg - 10% dmg at max
would be 2% dmg to self until you max it at which point it hits 1%.


So easy to come up with an individual passive for separate classes.



SylvanElf -> RE: Passive Rework (9/4/2013 2:04:09)

Great idea [:D]

There'd be details and kinks to work out, but a gem of an idea if I dare say so.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Passive Rework (9/4/2013 13:36:28)

its a great idea, but it would need a penalty to prevent abuse.

like if you build ur str up above 15-18 dmg ur bloodlustg is reduced by 5%.

if you have like 31-38 rez or defence, reroute is reduced by 5%.

if you have more than 15-18 str and support combined, deadly aim is reduced by 4 damage.

if you hav more than 31-38 rez or defence ur passive armours are reduced by 2.


also, some new passive ideas if this idea is put in.

for merc (replacing adrenaline), a passive reducing a debuff by 25% at lvl 36( which i think is gonna be introduced after the war? correct me if im wrong [:D])

for bounty( replacing SA), a dex and tec buff( 15 dex and tec at lvl 36)


now some skills:

blood letting: take a fixed amount of hp from the target. requires a sword( to encourage sword merc, so they have more of a chance). max: 10 hp.
improves every 5 levels.
has a 2( or maybe 3) turn cooldown.

fury sap: steal some of the opponents rage. for mage and tlm. lvl 1:10% rage. max: 20% rage.



Ranloth -> RE: Passive Rework (9/4/2013 13:41:19)

Why would stats reduce effectiveness of skills/passives? This forces everyone into one build to avoid the said penalties. You make them scale slower, not penalise it. I can always invest 4-5 stat less and get 5% more power from the passive at cost of having -1 less damage/defence. Yeah, that's not going to work.

Why are tanks bad? Why are glass cannons bad? Consider a build change if you can't beat them. Forcing everyone into a hybrid (in-between both) is killing the diversity - not what players nor Devs want.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Passive Rework (9/4/2013 13:47:26)

quote:

if you can't beat them


did i once say that? thought not. you always seem to jump to conclusions. its an idea. it can be worked on. and how does it force into a hybrid? 15-18str is not a hybrid. well if you dont know what a hybrid build is, i dont think you should be talking about them.

anyway, the numbers can be fiddled with. maybe it progresses slowly. like 1% at 1 point, then another 1% every 5 points after.

but yeah, my build is fine.



Ranloth -> RE: Passive Rework (9/4/2013 13:52:25)

I'm not jumping to conclusions. I said "if" which is the crucial word here.

And Hybrid build is jack of all trades, master of nothing. It's between a glass cannon and a tank, so it's a hybrid by definition. I don't know what you're thinking about. Also, skills shouldn't lose on power because diversity is being crippled - they should scale slower to weaken abuse but not make it worthless.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Passive Rework (9/4/2013 14:04:26)

would it make it worthless? bloodlust is an ability which relies on hitting hard. and it is unfair to other players who dont have bloodlust or are using a tanking bloodlust build against str with bloodlust. they get too much hp back. str+ bloodlust seems to get one of the highest win rates a have seen in omega( 95ish). bloodlust is the main problem, aswell as bludgeon scaling with it. or increasing ur damage with a smoke. it is overwhelming to many, bloodlust is too strong when abusing it with bloodlust and str. and to add to that, the bm class has deadly aim. a deadly combo. so it needs to be changed. glass cannons are strong, but they have ok win ratios( 85ish). abuse needs to be stopped. abuse of something, with a stat so high. it depends on the class, but abuse is too strong on some classes( not tm). is bloodlust the problem? it is fine on bounty. i think bm needs a new passive to replace bloodlust. i dont have any problem fighting them, but some ppl do. so give it a passive that increases damage done by 10% (on auto attacks only so it isnt op) at lvl 35 and a 10% enhanced rage power(fixed %) maybe give a passive that reduces the % of damage taken? they both seem very good ideas to me, but the first passive is very similar to db, but is much weaker.



Shajun Ki -> RE: Passive Rework (9/4/2013 16:16:39)

Xendran makes things simple to understand and has made very good points and suggestions, if only the team would read and consider some of them...



CN2025 -> RE: Passive Rework (9/5/2013 1:53:32)

i support and the extra skill points can go to a useless skill i do thatto throw of pyro fly users and also concussive shot



kosmo -> RE: Passive Rework (9/6/2013 5:39:49)

ed divine.
bm and bh are unbalanced whatever u use focus or strenght build(which is weaker), this because bloodlust is umbalanced itself.

right now the main problem in this game is how to balance battles whitout involving huge luck factors, making space for skill/stat diversity, a rework on passives is a great step towards it, i also think that stat and rage progression should be recalculated too.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Passive Rework (9/6/2013 13:18:19)

bloodlust isnt imbalanced. actually, you will see that focus bm and bounty can be beaten easy. its only when they start getting a little too much a little too often( every turn) when abusing str. what needs to be done, is bludgeon removed from bm and replaced with assimilate. this will make certain builds stronger, but making sure they cant do too much dmg. and focus bounty is easily beaten with a strong malf and azraels. but no need for azraels cos you can malf, then emp all their energy away with CH. orjust go glass cannon. or use an assault bot.



Mother1 -> RE: Passive Rework (9/6/2013 14:14:57)

@ ED divine darkness

Blood mage would become OP if they are giving Assimilation. Focus BM is a very flexible build already and given them a built in way to drain energy would overpower this build. It would also overpower Strength bloodmage since Strength is what makes Assimilation more effective. Even with it only doing 85% damage strength builds will still be able to pack a punch, and not only that they can reuse it for nothing every 3 turns where as Bludgeon they are limited to how many times they use it.

As for foucs BH yout solutions to beat them aren't for all. only TM and CH have Malf, and not everyone has the Azreal's gear.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Passive Rework (9/7/2013 21:20:22)

quote:

It would also overpower Strength bloodmage since Strength is what makes Assimilation more effective.


herrm. wrong! str bloodmage relies on BLUDGEON. and this skill will replace it. that isnt op. it is more of a nerf. and fireball is their only other str active and it is rubbish. so technically it is a nerf to str bm.



Mother1 -> RE: Passive Rework (9/7/2013 21:30:00)

@ ED Divine

You are giving Strength BM a way to destroy energy which wouldn't be a nerf at all especially with players who use exact energy. The fact that it doesn't cost energy either means it can be spammed every 3 turns without problem. So while power wise it may be weaker effect wise it will devastate players energy sources. Bludgeon while powerful can be blocked, costs energy, and can't be spammed where as Assimation on BM would be worse since

1 Effect can't be blocked
2 takes high amounts of energy due to improving with strength
3 destroy's energy sensitive builds.




kittycat -> RE: Passive Rework (9/7/2013 21:35:04)

maybe fireball should be reworked to drain EP by 50% of damage dealt and also inflict physical damage.



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