RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (Full Version)

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Mother1 -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 0:47:37)

@ rejaylob

Here is a thread that was made sometime ago by an older player with some ways on how to counter this bot. Best of all anyone can use them. Don't bump it however since the thread is old



wireclub1990 -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 2:09:43)

the bpts cheap in the respect your getting a free poison without spending the mana ....

Is it OP ? nope

Against most builds using a turn to poison which actually significantly lowers your damage for that turn will get u killed .

Anything else ?



rejaylob -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 3:35:36)

^
Most users who use this are mostly tanky ones. And Im pretty sure they are not dumb enough to use the poison if the next turn is possible for them to get killed.



CN2025 -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 4:26:01)

counter with high hp or atleast have a 2-4 field medic instead of complaining.the only reason to nerf it is if its super overpowered which its not .it can be cleansed with field medic rendering it useless plus it gains no rage since it does 3 dmg.



rejaylob -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 5:35:00)

quote:

it gains no rage since it does 3 dmg.


It actually does [&:]

And even if you can cleanse it, they can spam back. Now can u cleanse that back again too after they spam again? I think not. Remember cooldown of bot is only 3 turns and last 4 turns. And heals cooldown is 4 turns. Which will still be useless if you cleanse the poison spore.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 14:26:47)

its not op, but maybe make heal cooldown 3 again?



Mother1 -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 14:47:41)

@ ED divine

or increase the cooldown of poison to match field medic



wireclub1990 -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 16:14:04)

you missed my point you don't wanna waste a turn for tiny damage against the hardcore aggressive builds you tend to find in ED these days bot builds are weak period well if u want to win anyway this is in my experience anyway anyone daft enough to waste a turn poisoning me usually ends up dead fast and I tend to leave the fight almost maxed hp wise



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 16:38:03)

wrong @ above.

focus is strong. put that bot along with passive tanking, energy regain, and higher mid surgical and you have a str bm killer build ;)

so thats merc or tlm focus ;)



huuduy1 -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 16:44:37)

people in this forum are stupid. i guess they only play class such : BH and BM so Botanical Hazard isn't a big problem for them.How could we cleanse the poison out when we have no mana : this bot is really OP against class such as CH ( mana is big problem since ED nerf it ) and merc ( they can't regain their mana unless opponent have lot of mana )



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 16:58:41)

@above. wrong. we arent all like that. i was once a merc and this robot was no problem for me. you can even check Deaths Doom. he has class change cheevo: merc-BH-BM.

also, you are a cyber hunter level 32. i saw you in a 1v1. no malf? doesnt work. just because you cant beat this borg doesnt mean its OP. take Shego( mother1). her build isnt anything OP or an 'OP' class in ur opinion. she just has strategy. if you cant beat a focus build as a cyber hunter, you need to change your build( no offence). you have support scaling with malf so you can start, and destroy their robot damage. so it seems to me you are using CH wrong.



lionblades -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 17:03:42)

@Huuduy1
quote:

people in this forum are stupid. i guess they only play class such : BH and BM so Botanical Hazard isn't a big problem...

I am not trying to be the police, but I advise you to read this forum's rules before posting again: Show Courtesy and Respect to Others

Also, a universal counter to this bot is healing, and if you dont have enough mana try a build with generator on resistance and more stats on energy for more mana to have more heals. And thats just one of the counters to this bot.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 17:06:14)

a malf slightly offensive build counters it as well. guess that isn't his playstyle though.



Ranloth -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 17:26:46)

Energy is kinda far from nerfed. Yeah, sure, the progression was nerfed but our base EP is higher compared to back in Delta by quite an amount, it scales with our level, and only very few builds prior to Omega needed very high Energy - current base is more than enough for the majority of players, and it was rarely trained before too.

If anything, you can call it a nerf-buff to Energy. Furthermore, it's not a problem... If Energy was lower prior to Omega and was not a problem, how is it a problem now with higher base Energy? Even more reason not to train it any higher because there's no need to.

There are counters. You refuse to use them. That's not a problem with balance but yourself. High HP build has flaws? Well, so does every build. One build is not supposed to be able to counter everything. Every build is meant to have a flaw.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 17:43:27)

so true trans, so true. a big buff for builds that use default energy anyway.



Ranloth -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 17:59:39)

Some builds could manage with old base EP, which was around 50. Don't remember exactly. XD But yeah, it's higher now and there's less need to train it now than in Delta.



Dual Thrusters -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 18:17:36)

quote:

really OP against class such as CH ( mana is big problem since ED nerf it ) and merc ( they can't regain their mana unless opponent have lot of mana )


Cyber Hunters can nerf the bot using malfunction. As long as you save enough energy for heals and EMP grenades, you should be alright. ( this is coming from a Cyber Hunter since Delta).

For Mercs, you have Static Smash to regain enough energy for a heal. Plus you have a ton of offensive capabilities so your opponent can't just stack attacks with poison.



wireclub1990 -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 18:28:48)

quote:

wrong @ above.

focus is strong. put that bot along with passive tanking, energy regain, and higher mid surgical and you have a str bm killer build ;)

so thats merc or tlm focus ;)


I disagree their doing lower damage if they waste a turn to poison me effectively giving me a free shot I have bloodlust and high strength (yes bm) and an incredibly fast rage with chairmans fury the minute they poison me even if they heal they're ded the minute I rage in almost all cases. and ill bloodlust all the majority of the damage back from poison but sure if they want to make that move fine . Honestly this is the case with any build whether they heal or not in almost all cases if they haven't killed me by turn 4 their dead. Which is not easy considering I have blood lust around 35 def/res 90 hp and enough fire power to blast the tankiest of builds into the middle of next year.



Mother1 -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 18:43:42)

@ Wireclub1990

you have a build that just about counters this build so of course you would think that. Strength blood mage has high damage output and is a quick kill build. Poison works best with long battles, and since you can tear away at them with your offense this build wouldn't be a problem for you.

However for anyone else who don't use a build that counters this they wouldn't be happy since they have a harder time dealing with poison than you would.



GearzHeadz -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 21:40:29)

quote:

I really miss how the old balance threads were like...
They weren't extremely biased and 100% emotion based...and I kinda feel sorry that old players like Trans and Mother have to put up with like above this post.

It wasn't based on emotion, it was based on trying to find a viable solution for both parties, the users of the item, and the victims of the item.

quote:

In that case Massacre is OP since the only counter is an energy drainer.

I said ITEMS, not skills.



Mother1 -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 22:37:56)

quote:

It wasn't based on emotion, it was based on trying to find a viable solution for both parties, the users of the item, and the victims of the item.


While I respect your posts I kind of find it hard to believe that this solution isn't based on personal feelings.

quote:

To all who give these build counters, I feel all players shouldn't have to claim the enter structure of a build in order to stand chance against a single item. I feel that makes this item OP.
The only solution I see to this bot is a one time use, un-curable poison.


In your first post you clearly admitted that you feel people shouldn't have to change their builds to counter something. So for those who don't want to change their build you offered a solution for them not for those who have the item.



rejaylob -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 22:52:00)

@Trans

quote:

That's not a problem with balance, but yourself


Of course, this IS a problem of balance. Here's why:

If you realize further, Poison Spore can be used freely. They don't cost energy and can deal decent damage every turn. This made toxic grenade and venom strike skills to be useless now when in fact they cost energy. And the worst part is.... YOU CAN SPAM IT [8|]



Mother1 -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 23:16:44)

@ Rejaylob

It seems like you have a problem with player's tactics not balance. It can be cleansed out with field medic, and not to mention having decent HP to high HP makes this bot almost if not totally worthless.

Poison was designed to combat tank players, and it was made multi use because field medic can cleanse it out. The only change I would actually suggest for this bot would be to increase the cool down by one turn so that field medic and poison spores will be on par.



Dual Thrusters -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 23:24:20)

quote:

This made toxic grenade and venom strike skills to be useless now


These skills are still pretty strong, as long as you time them correctly. They are especially deadly when your opponent cleanses poison spores, then you hit him with either of these when their field medic is in cooldown.



rejaylob -> RE: Botanical Hazard Poison Spore (10/21/2013 23:38:36)

quote:

These skills are still pretty strong


Havent seen someone using these skills for a while when Poison Spore came out :/



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