Mage balance (Full Version)

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Steel Slayer -> Mage balance (11/23/2013 10:15:09)

What happened to balance in this game? Mages now have all the same skills as bounties, just weaker versions? The new static grenade is pretty much the same as assimilation, just does TWICE as much energy drain/return? And assimilation still needs a staff, while bounties can use swords for better damage and more stats. New skill, fire scythe-looks cool I guess, but its just like cheap shot except guess what? IT COSTS TWICE AS MUCH! And you have to waste a bunch of points on unrelated skills to get it, cheap shot is first tier, FS is FOURTH?!?! And CS has the extra crit chance too, AND a shorter cooldown. Battery backup isn't great since every other class now has a drain skill, you just wasted a turn to give the other guy your energy. Lets not forget the long-standing imbalance between smoke screen and malf, smoke improves with tech, which you were gonna take anyway for the resist, AND synergizes with the aforementioned OP static grenade, while malf improves with support, which you had no reason to take except for that 1 skill, and just got a big nerf anyway with crits only doing 30% armor reduction now.


OK, now that I'm done ranting, how can this be fixed?
Static Grenade- Just change it to scale with support instead of tech.
Assimilation- Either put it back to 100% gain to make it worth taking a staff, OR remove the weapon requirement.
Malfunction- Increase base skill effect by 5, maybe reduce scaling if it gets too OP at high support.
Fire Scythe- This is a big one. Since I cant think of anywhere else to put it, it kinda has to stay in fourth tier, so lets make it worth it. Either reduce the CD to 2 turns and make it cost less(1 energy per skill point instead of 2), or jump the armor ignored to 20...60%, yeah I know its big but on a 3 turn CD it should be OK, considering the energy cost.
Battery Backup- I guess its OK how it is if its timed right, really not much else you can do for it.

I haven't played the other classes enough to comment much on them yet, since everyone who could afford to switched to bounty, but they look OK on paper, fix SG and maybe we can see the other classes in action.



axell5 -> RE: Mage balance (11/23/2013 11:02:07)

fire scythe can't be blocked or deflected, cheap shot CAN. Assim isn't meant to take and give much energy thought i support the statix grenade nerf. Man, with so much tech, they can takn out many things! I agree that malf needs a buff



Ranloth -> RE: Mage balance (11/23/2013 11:10:15)

Malf seems weak because it improves with Support, whilst Smoke improves with Tech. Difference (apart from "improves with...")? Synergy.

TMs will love Malf as Glass Cannons, and it doesn't need a buff, not at all. BHs will likely have Tech in order to get some Res, and it provides nice synergy with Static Grenade (used to be EMP), Focus 5, Bot, etc. For CHs, glass cannon build is a bit lacking and some Strength is needed for effective use of Static Charge.

In the end, there's no issue with Malf nor Smoke. It's the synergy which makes Malf seem weak. Changing it to improve with Strength, Tech or Dex would be very bad idea because it'd cause abuse in many areas of the game and CHs and TMs alike would be able to abuse it. Smoke is superior due to its excellent synergy with Tech, nothing else. Give "Tech Malf" to TMs and you'll see Casters being unbeatable with even up to 150 Tech!

There is another alternative - altered version of Malf for CHs. This one could improve with Tech, because they don't have effective Tech build that could be abuseable. Plasma Armor improves with higher Resistance (overall), and Plasma Grenade is their offensive Stun skill which works with Tech. Giving them "Tech Malf" wouldn't imbalance it, but perhaps give more variety. Although, Support would seem a bit lack-luster for them, due to Defense Matrix being the only skill which improves with Support.

As for TMs, I think Support Malf if good as it is. They have Casters which don't need Malf, glass cannons which rely on high damage, and you can go for hybrid which works but perhaps not as well - but not everyone play for wins either - which may find balance between offense and defense, and take advantage of Malf.



Altador987 -> RE: Mage balance (11/23/2013 11:17:47)

i like that idea trans cy's def need something for tech



Steel Slayer -> RE: Mage balance (11/23/2013 11:20:35)

@ Trans, I know malf is weak because of synergy, thats exactly what I said :) which is why I suggested
quote:

Malfunction- Increase base skill effect by 5, maybe reduce scaling if it gets too OP at high support.
this could help bring it more in line with smoke without being a huge buff to glass cannons.

@axell5, I know FS cant be blocked, my point was that with the higher energy cost combined with it being in fourth tier, its a bit weak, so it should either be buffed, moved, or cost reduced.



Ranloth -> RE: Mage balance (11/23/2013 11:29:51)

Ah, my bad!

I still don't see as much of an issue with it - explained in the post. The only "issue" I'd see is for CHs, and I've suggested an alternative for that. Overall, I'd say Malf doesn't need a buff nor a nerf. :p I have a TM, albeit low level, and Lvl 29 CH which I've just retrained earlier to Lvl 8 SC and max Poison, and no Malf at all. ^^



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Mage balance (11/23/2013 12:14:15)

well, when i was cyber i loved using focus with support instead of dex.



GearzHeadz -> RE: Mage balance (11/23/2013 12:27:39)

Okay.
All weaker versions of bounty skills? The multi/stun moves of BH and TM both improve with dex, but the TM moves become stronger than the BH ones.
As said before, fire scythe is unblockable, and ignores 40%, while cheap-shot only ignores 34% at max.
The assimilation move is still good, if you decide to invest in the str points that it strengthens with, most just don't.
Malf and smoke are even, just increase with different stats.
The new static grenade is OP? Why? Because its free and on par with TM assimilation? The old EMP grenade took far more energy away then the static grenade and improved with the, but no one complained then because they could easily screw over the BH fighting chance by quickly draining them away.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: Mage balance (11/23/2013 12:42:44)

not to mention, mage can easily beat BH. Ask kr3p4x. his build is amazing.



DarkDevil -> RE: Mage balance (11/23/2013 15:54:57)

actually IIRC he only abuses poison bot with 40 def/ress and 110 hp , easily beaten with a strong offensive build with high hp , which is also what mages are good at so it's more like mages has the most capabilitys.

assim deals damage and gains rage while static grenade doesn't.



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