BM balance (Full Version)

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ED Divine Darkness -> BM balance (12/1/2013 12:50:38)

well, other classes seem to be able to drain the bm's energy that it gains away, and get their energy back, what should be done is to make it a more offensive skill.

an idea: drain a % of the opponents total energy. no cost.

1) 20% drain

2) 30% drain

3) 35% drain

4) 40% drain

5) 45% drain

6) 48% drain

7) 52% drain

8) 55% drain

9) 58% drain

10) 60% drain


This will be their drain move replacing parasite.



the move to replace fireball/ bludgeon:

blood transfusion. Convert 15% of your current HP into a % of your total energy.

1) 4%

2) 9%

3) 14%

3) 18%

4) 22%

5) 26%

6) 30%

7) 33%

8) 36%

9) 38%

10) 40%




Teserve -> RE: BM balance (12/1/2013 13:04:28)

I like the first idea, but the other might reduce BMs offensive capabilities.



Exploding Penguin -> RE: BM balance (12/1/2013 14:29:55)

How about making it so that when an enemy is affected by energy parasite, whenever they use a skill that requires energy you gain a percentage of the energy used on the skill? This would stop people from working around energy parasite by consuming all their energy as fast as they can. The return for this new effect would probably be best at 2.5 or 3x the percentage gain of energy parasite per turn (if I had max energy parasite and it was 3x, when an enemy used a skill that costs 100 energy I would gain 45 energy, or 45%).

Kinda confusing but I feel this would make it much harder for enemies to work around energy parasite much like how they worked around reroute in past phases.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: BM balance (12/1/2013 18:59:45)

teserve, fireball is a very wasteful move and isnt very 'used' so i think it should be changed.


a couple of new ideas:

make parasite take a fixed number, but restore 7 more than it takes:

every level improves the energy drained by 1, and at max it is 10 drained for 3 turns. It will also have a cooldown of 3.

and bludgeon replacement:

static edge:

Exploit a point in the targets armour, ignoring 30% of their resistance, and 50% of the damage dealt is drained from their energy. locked to energy damage. cooldown 2.

Both of these skills will be free to cast.

and heres a suggestion: put plasma bolt on BM to replace fire ball. reason for this is:

it would help tec BM.

when the original HA was around, it was passed to TLM. why cant BM get plasma bolt?

It would make tecmage more balanced. Fireball was nerfed cos of bloodlust- now there is no bloodlust.



GearzHeadz -> RE: BM balance (12/1/2013 19:12:33)

That static edge move would never go by. Why? Because its ignoring their resistance for free. It also sounds a lot like a skill I was thinking of. I call it atom bludgeon, for lack of a better name. Perhaps we could collaborate with the two?

quote:

Atom Bludgeon
Level 1: Ignores 10%/Drains 10 ep points
Level 2: Ignores 12%/Drains 12 ep points
Level 3: Ignores 14%/Drains 14 ep points
Level 4: Ignores 16%/Drains 16 ep points
Level 5: Ignores 18%/Drains 18 ep points
Level 6: Ignores 20%/Drains 20 ep points
Level 7: Ignores 22%/Drains 22 ep points
Level 8: Ignores 23%/Drains 23 ep points
Level 9: Ignores 24%/Drains 24 ep points
Level 10: Ignores 25%/Drains 25 ep points



Pemberton -> RE: BM balance (12/1/2013 23:46:28)

BMs are fine. Stop trying to make yourself OP just because you class jumped to BM to abuse it pre-passive-active update.



dfo99 -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 3:09:23)

Pemberton

no man, alot of players BM change for bh or tech mage, matt 1000 is a good example



DarkDevil -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 3:57:51)

drains 60% ?
the best idea so far about this is to drain 30% over 3 turns of the total energy but 60% ? you will change it to draining skill more than a regaining skill so it will only take 50% back instead of 1.5.

also a rule is no free skill deals extra damage , taking static smash and assimilation , it would either deal less damage or no regain or drain.

also a rule was no skill was nerfed cus of bloodlust , and bloodlust is just renamed to mark of blood and costs energy so it's still there.

you can't get something OP just because others are stronger , there are basis for balance or buffs or nerfs, you can't ignore those by any excuse.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 15:16:52)

quote:


BMs are fine. Stop trying to make yourself OP just because you class jumped to BM to abuse it pre-passive-active update.


Rofl, im not a BM. And stop being a hypocrite, you were one of the countless many who class hopped to BM. and lastly, im not crying. Im trying to achieve balance. And how does a class being OP before an update change the fact that it is UP now? Irrelevant and harsh, as you always seem to be.



Altador987 -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 15:29:46)

just curious but why are we saying bm is disadvantaged again (UP), is it just the regain skill that we're talkin about? I honestly didn't think bm's needed that much of a regain as most don't use a huge bunch at one time



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 15:39:53)

They are prone to energy drain, and have the worst energy regain skill ever. myself, i would rather have assimilate in place of parasite.

I got an idea:

Take the assimilate right now, and make it have 100% return, then give it to BM in place of parasite. It could be called transfuse? this way it will be stronger that the old assimilate and the one right now. Parasite could then be placed on TM instead of assimilate.


Post edited to combine a double posting, which isn't allowed. Please use the 'Edit' button to add to or change your posts. Thanks!
~M4B



Altador987 -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 15:50:49)

i like the idea initially but not sure how the strength would scale as a max assim for a 36 mage with 5-6 weapon damage can still take around 20 mp, and a blood mage who'd most likely (due to synergy) have normal to even a great amount of strength could then abuse that (but i can't tell as i've seen very few offensive tms that use the skill)



Ranloth -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 15:56:48)

Energy Parasite isn't all that bad. In my opinion, they could perhaps raise it to up to 20% Energy at Level 10, and make it deal 70-85% damage, like other skills with effects, i.e. Assimilation, which should be good enough as a buff.



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 15:59:13)

ok, i got an even better idea. it would scale with EVERYTHING.

before you disagree, here is what my idea is:

scales with str/tec/dex/support every 4 points till 40 tec/str/dex/support. then per 5 points till 60 then per 6 points till 72 then 7 points for the rest of the stats.

the numbers can be fixed, but i think this would be fun to use and versatile for every build, but best for more spread out builds.



Altador987 -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 16:04:28)

but what about lower levels who can't really do much with that type of build and want to be able to use the skill without it being a complete waste



ED Divine Darkness -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 16:15:30)

well, low level cant usually do anything with these sort of builds. but when you hit level 20, you would be fine with this sort of build. and as it stands, the imbalance is only at level 20 and above.



Calogero -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 16:17:33)

You may find it weird but I find Energy Parasite the most balanced Energy drain out there...
It feels UP due to Atom Smash - Static Smash - Static Grenade's rediculous high Energy removal/drain.

Not to mention I still don't get why TM's have both Assimilate and Battery Backup...



Altador987 -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 16:22:53)

i thought it was up there with static grenade as it was a tactical poison kind of move that would force the opponent to change course of action, i mean unless you're using at once you've drained a lot of mp or let the opponent do so



Mother1 -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 16:32:50)

@ calogero

All class now have an energy drainer and energy gainer. Remove Assimilate and they are without an energy drainer. Remove battery backup without seriously buffing Assimilate and TM will be left without an effective way to gain energy.



Calogero -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 17:05:46)

I know Mother1

It's just the amount % of drains and gains are way to high on 1 class, and in BloodMage's case, normal but seemishly low due to the
High Drain and gain on the other classes.

They'd have to notch the drains and gains down a whole lot before there will be any actual Energy balance in the game, If you know what I mean with that.



lionblades -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 17:12:56)

BM is weak right now. I can name 3 skills that are pretty bad on skill tree:

1. Supercharge: Counterproductive, does not stack with MoB. I have not seen a single BM use this skill, and the ones that do I have beaten easily. No synergy ultimate. Wish all the evolved classes had different ultimates than the starter ones.
2. Parasite: Theoretically good core but realistically considering that most of the players use base energy only, this skill is near useless. It even worse than assimilation on terms of damage. 22-23+34 str primary does "5" dmg. Tested and really, 5 dmg lol.
3. Fireball: Was an ok skill before passive to active update but now BL does not consistently give HP with it (MoB only lasts for a few turns). Its even weaker than plasma bolt and plasma bolt can be looped several times easily+dmg scales higher and is defensive.



Altador987 -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 17:20:52)

Well first i wouldn't say bm is weak as cyber hunter synergy has made a lot of skills a waste but to stay on subject

1: i agree they should fix this idk what to suggest maybe make it str like the fireball but i've never seen a blood mage use it
2: i think this has to do with the population of bms not really knowing when to use it strategically... but that's just my opinion
3: i believe they didn't scale fireball to plasma as in order to use fireball efficiently you need strength which is an offensive trait and works well with Mob not just for the skill itself but for however many times it's looped, as well as bludgeon, and then of course the regular attack and sidearm



Calogero -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 17:26:40)

@ Altador

But then again, BloodMages don't have passive BloodLust anymore nor the Deadly Aim which makes the gun do a hell of a lot less damage.

I've been ' Complaining ' about SuperCharge forever now, I think at the release of BloodMages I was already having second doubts about the Ultimate.

FireBall, When do you ever see it used these days? Exactly.

and About Parasite, it's like I said earlier. I find it to be the most balanced energy drainer/gainer in the game but due to other
Huge drainers/gainers out there, it feels weak. When timed correctly, you can prevent a person from healing or using that 1 skill that
would have finished you. But yea then you get Static Grenaded or whatever and gone is the strategy.



kosmo -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 17:50:29)

i belive the bm just needs to have his drains/regains in pair whit tm and bh (since it doesnt lack any other moove). i would just change energy parassite, the idea of stealing a % of the opponents energy is cool, but inaviable since it has the easiest counter ever, ur opponents just use their energy and ur done;
i would make the drain of this moove not % based, draining 9 ep for 3 turns giving back 1.5, that would be a 27ep drain and a 40ep regain, balanced if compared to other energy affecting mooves.



Exploding Penguin -> RE: BM balance (12/2/2013 18:41:29)

Energy parasite may at first seem effective but someone simply has to use up all their energy after the turn it's cast. You don't have to bother predicting when it'll come compared to static smash and static grenade, which both have overall much, much stronger energy removal capabilities. Energy parasite is better for gaining energy, and it's like the new reroute in terms of how easy it is to control a BM's energy flow.



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