RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (Full Version)

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s0u1ja b0y -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/17/2014 6:36:53)

The reason for no balance is everyone wants a 80% win ratio or higher. Balance is equal chance to win as to lose( a 50% win ratio). Also, people complain because there specific build is weak against certain ones, which is supposed to happen. You're not supposed to be able to just steamroll everyone you face. Plus the game is a bit more balanced than people give it credit for. If you take more than 2 seconds on your build you can find different combinations that are successful(successful= 50% or greater win ratio). Build copying happens because people don't want to take the time to make there own. There are more than 2 tm builds( i have 4 good ones). Does anyone really want balance? Balance could be fixed, but no one wants to be a loser which it makes it harder than it needs to be. Everyone are mostly the flavor of the week class or classes, giving feedback only on those classes. Usually 2 classes are completely ignored because no one wants to lose. If people didn't only complain but instead offered changes that can benefit everyone not just them, balance can be achieved.



Xendran -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/17/2014 14:20:17)

quote:

Balance is equal chance to win as to lose( a 50% win ratio).


This is completely false. Balance is an overall balancing out of the builds of every class, not every build having a 50% victory chance against every other build.



Altador987 -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/17/2014 14:37:47)

quote:

Balance is equal chance to win as to lose( a 50% win ratio).


sorta... i think a more precise definition would be 50/50 chance of winning or losing with each battle, meaning a win or loss isn't guaranteed also on xendran's point i'd simply say the balancing of each class and it's synergy rather than a specific build as some builds might naturally fare better than others (for numerous reasons) but of course said build with a balanced skillset and synergy would also have certain disadvantages as well



edwardvulture -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/17/2014 19:25:46)

@Gearz and Xendran
Not gonna lie, that suggestion would make the game a lot more complicated. I, for one, would not appreciate that. It is introducing way too much variables.



GearzHeadz -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/17/2014 19:33:10)

Variables that we were already used to having. It would be very small passives anyways.



edwardvulture -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/18/2014 16:42:01)

Someone asked for a definition of balance. Mine is:
There should be a counter to every build incorporating every stat and all the skills.



Remorse -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/18/2014 17:16:04)

^ Agreed
I just poated a suggestion for classification and where we lack in counters.



edwardvulture -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/19/2014 15:40:18)

I was talking to Gearz in-game and I think we agreed that the end of Delta was balanced for varium players. Is that true? I remember seeing a huge variety of builds back then. (well, a lot of times in the game as compared to now)



Ranloth -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/19/2014 15:44:32)

Yeah, the very late Delta was actually pretty balanced. It was no different to now, when some classes had their OP builds and you'd mostly run into either: Casters, high Tech BHs or high Tech TLMs. The minority were other classes, although there was a few more BMs because they were a bit better than they are now.

But that was only for Varium players. We're getting close to that balance now, in Omega, and it's fair for everyone - not just one group of players.



Remorse -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/19/2014 15:45:03)

^ Definitely not
Delta was horrid in my opinion.

Classes may of been competeing but all of variety consisted of hard to counter effortless builds and was the reason why I quit.
Enhancements were brocken, non variums struggled. No it was a teriable time



GearzHeadz -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/19/2014 16:25:34)

I didn't agree to that.



edwardvulture -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/19/2014 18:16:40)

nvm.... I just saw this skip to 8:01 lol to the 10 level difference, I don't recall having that much of a level gap was possible.



toopygoo -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/19/2014 18:55:59)

hey adward, that was a challenge, not a 1v1 battle.



edwardvulture -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/19/2014 19:01:10)

lol, I didn't notice.



Dual Thrusters -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/19/2014 23:18:11)

Ah, the when the Delta Knight Armor was the best armor for tanking :)



dfo99 -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/26/2014 12:40:40)

unballanced is when a class (like bm for example) can't be used for nobody, because sure will lose constantly



GearzHeadz -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/26/2014 12:47:45)

I went BM recently and I had to say I had a pretty decent build. It could take on BHs and some TMs, as long as I got a lil luck on the TMs. So it isn't impossible, but it is quite difficult.



noremako -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/26/2014 19:19:04)

The problem is, there is always one build that has either perfect synergy with skills and weapons, or there is a build that simply dominates any other build through sheer power. I really hate to see the lack of uniqueness throughout EpicDuel, always being one build for a class that rules which ruins the point of experimentation.

The two solutions I see is to either make all skills equal in power to each other, to allow all builds to be balanced if actually put into consideration, or to allow skills to have certain synergy and power between them, as to allow multiple functional builds that all have similar power, but not to have one build that combines the strongest skills. Both solutions are rather dramatic and very difficult to determine, however. Any improvements possible?



s0u1ja b0y -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/26/2014 20:29:41)

Or give classes certain boosts like tms get extra deflection chance or make build bonuses like maxing top skills in skill tree gives you 2 percent field medic boost



Pemberton -> RE: The Next OP Class:Why balance will never be perfected (1/27/2014 7:28:03)

I agree with noremako. The bigger problem with epicduel besides balance issues is the lack of variety or builds/ classes that can compete/ have fun.
The game is basically copy class copy build and win. Balance update? Well wait for the new OP class and build lol.



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