RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (Full Version)

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FMan -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/20/2020 0:50:51)

Well, in my opinion we shouldn't nerf CW. The fact that this class is good for x challanges, doesn't make it good for Y.

Also the players who want a :" challange " according to them, just dont equip CW in the challanges where hes good, I dont think that closing options to the community is a good idea.

here is a way the pro nerfing players get what they want, and the players who don't want the nerf will enjoy too.



geomihai -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/20/2020 16:43:40)

100% true what FMAN is telling , keep CW as it is and if players want a challange just change class . Limiting choice by banning class or nerfing them is bad mechanic that can kill an armor. Dunno what the devs problem is with op armor (which is microtransaction btw not free content) in a game that is mostly single player. Want challange go hard mode and change armor simple, want to fell like a god with a paid armor then do just that.



BluuHorseOfficial -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/21/2020 12:14:15)

Well, Game Balance is still a necessity even though it's a single player game. I honestly don't get the argument that Game Balance is unnecessary and can be overlooked in a single player game.



TFS -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/21/2020 15:22:49)

quote:

and if players want a challange just change class .

Wanting a challenge is the reason a player would be going to the Inn in the first place :/



FMan -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/22/2020 7:02:44)

Wanting a challange is one thing, but can do it with hard mode
Or different armor. Personally, sometimes I want challanges, but most of my inn hunting is for items, and so many of the community, and some can't accomplish that without the help of CW, so gotta see the bigger picture. Hard mode challanges / changing class gets everyone happy, maybe some not 100%, but not too far from that purpose.

Also about game balance, there is a balance, CW in 2v1 or 3v1 is bad, maybe atm we don't have many cases CW won't work, but we may have in the future, so the fact that this point isn't a big weakness now, doesn't mean it won't be in the future.

Last - single player, nerfing will just create problems to the community, or may even kill the class ( which will be bad for those who spent their DC picking CW expecting for X, getting Y without having other options) why should we create unnecessary problems, if they dont exist right now , and those who want those " problems " can just go with hard mode/ other class .

P.S Im not one of the players who relay on CW, got other solutions here, but not everyone are like me, or the ones who suggest the nerf, and CW for them is the char which gets them gears, and mostly fun ( I do guilty of the fun though :v ) .




geomihai -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/24/2020 1:42:15)

Or if they are soo salty with CW needs changing do that , but keep it as V 1.0 and 2.0 so the salty one get a new nerfed one . Pretty much like Dmk . But i think the problem is that they hate the idea of others getting better armor and not playing the game as they intend us to do.... otherwise the logic behind it beats me



BluuHorseOfficial -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/24/2020 11:21:04)

quote:

Or if they are soo salty with CW needs changing do that , but keep it as V 1.0 and 2.0 so the salty one get a new nerfed one . Pretty much like Dmk . But i think the problem is that they hate the idea of others getting better armor and not playing the game as they intend us to do.... otherwise the logic behind it beats me
nobody's salty or wants to make themselves feel like they're better than others lol and people definitely don't want other people being bad and not enjoying the game. After all, those who truly like a game would want people to get better at it/enjoy it however they wish because they want one of the games they enjoy to be enjoyed by other people alike, I can assure you nobody in the past argument wants other people to use worse armors and stuff.

The entire basis behind the past argument was that there were way too many fights in the past year which were largely single-target fights which had to be beaten multiple times over to get a reward, which is something I feel Chaosweaver excels at more so than about 95%, if not all, the classes in the game. The recent Inn challenges all seem to be catered towards Chaosweaver because of how good it is at them and I guess this just makes it seem much stronger in comparison to a variety of classes? In reality, this can be remedied by incorporating more duo and trio fights into the Inn, which are something Chaosweaver struggles at and other classes are comparatively better at. As ballistik/Simeon DF said, Chaosweaver can beat any challenge in the Inn but you do need very strong endgame gear for it, while there do exist other classes that don't necessarily require that. So really, the original argument was pressing for more duos and trios than outright killing the class, which I agree with.

And as Callum said earlier on in the argument, a guaranteed stun on a glass cannon is quite overpowered in that you basically get a free turn in which you take no damage for what is a class based around dealing heavy damage while also receiving it. I agree that if anything is to be nerfed in this class, it's the autostun, but for anything else, IMO we should wait until the Inn starts having more duos and trios so everyone involved can agree on whether or not the class needs a nerf.

Oh also, Hard Mode is a pretty bad way to get a challenge, you're basically just buffing all the numbers and whatnot and I'm pretty sure fights like Ancient Duo and stuff just become completely impossible with it on, it's not exactly a good feature which is why Verly was planning on reworking it a while back. [:D]



HellsWolf666 -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/24/2020 13:23:43)

quote:

a guaranteed stun on a glass cannon is quite overpowered in that you basically get a free turn in which you take no damage for what is a class based around dealing heavy damage while also receiving it. I agree that if anything is to be nerfed in this class, it's the autostun


though if you look at it with the whole game in mind it's not that powerfull- hardly any boss outside of the inn has any stun resist and it only lasts for 1 turn as opposed to the standart 3 turns that other stun skills usually get which makes it weaker in comparison outside of the inn... not to mention that using it will consume a very valuable soulthread and the fact that unlike other classes CW can't rely on it's shield to fully block dmg or on blind to hopefully make the enemy miss- so sure 1 free turn is nice but i think it pales in comparison to the usual defensive options of other classes.




The_element -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/24/2020 15:17:05)

To be fair, the recent inn challenges we've had are from the Exaltia Tower, The Corrupted Seven and the Displaced Fates boards, which have all made ChW seem overly strong. Some of the recent challenges seem like they're really geared up for an offensive class like ChW. I don't think ChW is problematic right now, it's just really good against recent inn bosses where it's either a 1v1 challenge, has really low hp or the boss takes time to set up. I think when we return to regular duo fights, we'll probably not think of ChW as highly.



aceflashwater -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/24/2020 20:24:42)

i hope the prize will be bracer thats is stronger than legion badges in the upcoming chest reward because we don't have enough bracer, bracer is so rare



ProbablyCallum -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/25/2020 0:43:33)

quote:

Though if you look at it with the whole game in mind it's not that powerfull- hardly any boss outside of the inn has any stun resist and it only lasts for 1 turn as opposed to the standart 3 turns that other stun skills usually get which makes it weaker in comparison outside of the inn... not to mention that using it will consume a very valuable soulthread and the fact that unlike other classes CW can't rely on it's shield to fully block dmg or on blind to hopefully make the enemy miss- so sure 1 free turn is nice but i think it pales in comparison to the usual defensive options of other classes.


Not a single thing outside the inn matters in terms of the viability and power of a class except Yllmar so why would you even bring that up. The soulthread argument doesnt make sense either because the autostun is the most powerful part of its rotation so its hardly a waste. Its defensive options are insane as well. The first 4 turns of its rotation you deal 7-8 k without taking a single hit thanks to baby dragon and the autostun and then after that you use aegis to buy yourself 3 more turns and then after the death immunity ends you siphon and get a fat fullheal, Its only after that you'll start to be vunerable and run out of soulthreads but you've already killed pretty much any single target boss before that can start to happen, even exraveler.



BluuHorseOfficial -> RE: =DF= January 3rd Design Notes: Corrupted Seven: Pride (1/25/2020 9:23:11)

quote:

Though if you look at it with the whole game in mind it's not that powerfull- hardly any boss outside of the inn has any stun resist and it only lasts for 1 turn as opposed to the standart 3 turns that other stun skills usually get which makes it weaker in comparison outside of the inn... not to mention that using it will consume a very valuable soulthread and the fact that unlike other classes CW can't rely on it's shield to fully block dmg or on blind to hopefully make the enemy miss- so sure 1 free turn is nice but i think it pales in comparison to the usual defensive options of other classes.
Hardly any class besides ChW has an insane damage output like it does, so you realistically won't even need a long stun with Chaosweaver as you can shred everything just as well without it. Also, on the subject of soulthreads, there are really only 3 skills that absolutely require soulthreads, those being Gambit, Aegis, and Shred itself (Vengeance and Siphon Empowered aren't that useful imo, and while Aggression is good, I would rather use a 1 Fighting Pet Dragon to loop a DoT on the enemy), and you're able to replenish two Soulthreads with your nukes Assault and Untangle which are already powerful skills that you want to use anyway, so I really don't think the cost of one "valuable" soulthread is too much of a price to pay unless you're fighting something really, really bulky, which is honestly not that many things in either the story or the inn.

quote:

i hope the prize will be bracer thats is stronger than legion badges in the upcoming chest reward because we don't have enough bracer, bracer is so rare
Eh, I don't think Inn Challenge rewards have to keep being increasingly powerful as compared to the last, that encourages powercreep, which is bad, and imo having sidegrades is much better because, to some extent, it does encourage more versatile gameplay. Then again it's just bracers, they offer barely any stats to begin with so I'd only use it for the novelty of using it rather than for the actual stats lol



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