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=Lore= The AQ/Warpforce Archiving Thread

 
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8/22/2011 9:35:21   
Elryn

Custodian (DF)


As you walk along the dark corridors of the Grand Library, dancing fireflies lightly guiding your way, you turn left on a bend and come up to a clearing amongst the bookcases, a pedestal erected in the middle. Upon the pedestal lies an old oblong book which the fireflies, in their own sleepy, light ways, seem to take interest, gliding past you and dancing around it. Seeing as nothing other than the all too present bookcases, you approach the book. Nearing the book, you realize it is much larger than first thought. Three feet long and two feet wide, you feel strangely the book to be great as the oldest tree in the forest is largest, all bound in leather and iron. Forged or carved, you do not know, such is the intricacy of the ironwork. They converge on the front into a circle donned with a familiar symbol. The insignia of your homeland.

The book is locked and shut tight. Looking up, a worn key tinged bronze upon a thread hangs. You look tentatively at it for a moment then grab it. Turning the key in the lock, you hear an audible click and the book opens. Light flashes and blinds. All in an instant, a flood of stories, tales and lore rush through your mind. A story you recognize as one of your youth. An old tale, but told differently. More fully, more detailed, as if told by someone who first witness it. The story of a farmer who bears the same name as a town you never wonder much about. A detail account of the growth of a small village which you come to realize is the description of the old part of your home town. So many tales, so much lore, so much...

You open your eyes. The twilight of the Grand Library is just as it was mere moments ago, or what you believe was moments ago. The book under your eyes is empty. The damp and gentle fireflies' glow fills empty pages, bound to the book's spine. A tinged of disappointment creeps into your thoughts. Perhaps what happened moments ago had been nothing but an idle dream. You are about to turn when a feather drops gently into your sight. White with a long, soft tail. A metal point freshly ink. You peer at the book again, it glows in a soft moonlight glow. It waits.

What tales will you archive?



Greetings and welcome to the AQ/Warpforce Archiving Thread.

This thread is used to archive and preserve forum lore of the games AdventureQuest and Warpforce. Has a dev revealed new interesting information on in-game lore? Quote it here so that it may be kept. Players may quote and post said lore in this thread as long as they follow the quoting format and guidelines outlines below:

  • Basic quote

    N.B. Quotes must come from a reliable source. To this end, please quote only staff (exlcuding context).

    First, include the date at which the post of the quote was made. Include a bit of context on the post. If you can, link a screenshot of the post in question.

    Example of a basic quote :

    quote:

    27th July 2010: Geo on DF in-game time (I edited a lot of extra info out of this quote).

    quote:

    Keep in mind that time in DF does not match up to real lief. With how the game is set up, with most areas being scaled, new players can choose to go anywhere they want to start. They can do the storyline in any order.

    What that means is that everything's happening right now, is all kind of happening at the same time or in a relatively short amount of time. While Akriloth is in the east setting farms on fire, Thursday is being haunted by her nightmares, while the gnomes are besieged in Popsprocket, Teral is brooding by the fire in Hunter's Paradise. With a story as large and all encompassing as DragonFable is telling, it akes years to get all the players out there, to get the base line down for al the orbs (while including some cool side-chains as well)*

    *Note though, with a story as large and encompassing as DF is, we do sometimes overlook stuff. Especially with new team members coming aboard (/waves at myself and Alina) and other team members moving to different projects (/waves at Cysero).


  • Special cases

    Quote and context:

    In the event that a staff quote alone is incomplete (i.e. If a dev is answering the question of a player and his answer is unclear without reference to the player's question). The same guidelines as above apply. Additionally, quote both the staff quote and the context in order, identifying each poster.

    quote:

    Kalanyr, [date]. On Xyphos Celestin

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: SmashBrawlerX2

    Where does Xyphos stand in all this? Is he also an Archmage?(In the Warlic sense) If he is, ive often wondered why so powerful a mage was missing from the final battle with the devourer. IIRC he wasn't there when Beleqwuaya disincorporated himself


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    He's an acquaintance of Beleqwaya's. Yes. His specialty is not precisely appropriate for the magic that was being worked.



    If you are unsure or have any questions about archiving, you can always me and ask.


    Now, enough chatting, on with the archiving :


    From the Potential of the ArchMagi threads and the discussions than ensued there over 2 years ago from the current date (August 22nd 2011) :

    The opening post

    quote:

    A recent conversation about Kalanyr's NPC Kalanyr, made by Kalanyr, for Kalanyr, piqued my interest in the capabilities of an Archmagi. Kalanyr told us that:


    quote:

    Unlike certain other mages my native ability to regenerate mana is limited to my natural capacity.



    Now, this little fact caught my interest. Despite his limitations as a human like the rest of us, he's mastered devastating powers of both Nerfing and Buffing, and trained creatures that can slaughter us if we make even the smallest slip against them (see Sarah the Nerfkitten, and you'll know what I mean). It seems reasonable to assume that since the only difference between him and us right now (aside from the obvious KoO title, awesome weapon and the ability to summon missles of all things out of nowhere and reduce a giant down from monstrous to handlable) is his Archmagi abilities. Now ask yourself--if Kal is THAT awesome as an archmage, how strong could we become? Obviously, expecting us to get nerfing and buffing abilities would be [put as politely as possible] utter silliness. But even so, what are your expectations? Could we one day stand on even ground against titanic foes once beyond us with these powers? Or am I reading too far into this?

    Discuss!



    On the matter of the ArchMagi/archmage distinction

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Kalanyr

    Ahh we have a nomenclature problem. In current speech the term archmage refers to any extremely powerful magic user, this title stems from a group of powerful mages in the past who were known as the Order of ArchMages, who were destroyed in the same coming of The'Galin that made the Eternal eternal. Warlic is the an archmage of the first kind, Kalanyr and Beleqwaya are the last two members of that Order and it is the secrets of that order they will teach.



    Enlightenment about the work of an ArchMage and on Kalanyr's and Beleqwaya's specialties

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Kalanyr

    Hmmm. You want to undertand the basics of our fields of research hmm ?

    Very well.

    To start with as you all know LORE (like many other worlds) is permeated with energy called mana, on LORE this energy has an elemental affinity for one or more of the 8 primary elements. A spell is a "template" or psychic construct for channeling this energy through to produce a desired effect as opposed to dumping elemental energy in your face.

    A Mage studies the fundamentals of magic, learning both how to manipulate the mana of the 8 primary elements in a basic fashion, as well as learning some basic techniques for adjusting the form of a spell on the fly.
    A Wizard progresses beyond this level by learning advanced techniques for manipulating mana attuned to the 8 primary elements, at this stage some Wizards choose to dedicate their study to one element of magic becoming a Pyromancer or Dynamancer etc.

    An ArchMage knows that most of the above is a gross simplification.

    Mana in its natural state has both no elemental affinity and all of them, it is the raw energy that seethes in the Deep Void, the stuff from which the world is made, it only acquires an elemental affinity because the structure through which LORE was created is based on the 8 primary elements. Knowing this it becomes possible to channel mana without the elemental taint, which allows for spells that have no elemental type instead being the raw energy of Creation and Uncreation that exists in the Void, manipulation of this energy is Beleqwaya's specialty, because mana naturally tends towards this form it is "simple" to channel this energy into walls of force for a powerful defence, dangerous bursts of power, making for quick and highly destructive attacks or a strange creature of pure mana or use the skills of manipulation acquired to destroy an enemies gathered mana, it is also possible to exploit the unstable nature of mana to make the surrounding mana revert to its natural state losing its elemental affinity althought this technique results in a great deal of raw energy it is uncontrollable and can harm the caster as much as much as the target.

    Likewise an ArchMage knows that the templates for forming a spell aren't truly necessary they are merely a mental construct for channeling the power in a safe way, Kalanyr's focus is in this area, he believes that although the templates are technically unnecessary they are useful because the structured nature allows for fine-grained control over the spell allowing for increased mana efficiency if one has the knowledge to properly refine a template, as well as studying the astral construction of the spell templates to allow for on the fly changes to the element of a spell or to increase the power a spell has although such on the fly changes intefere with the fine construction of the template and cause an increase in the amount of mana needed to form a spell, this knowledge can also be used to channel energy to disrupt the templates through which opponents cast their spells reducing the power and accuracy of an enemies magic.

    However before an ArchMage can learn such skills he or she or it must spend time as an initiate revising and perfecting the knowledge he has already acquired, as part of the initiation one of the first tasks undertaken is revising the Elemental Orb spell and updating it to something suiting the power of an ArchMage, to channel energy into a basic shield that defends against Melee and Ranged attacks, and to learn the mental excercises that allow them to call on the knowledge of previous ArchMages to bolster their insight and power.

    And Beleqwaya and I have been discussing some things recently that we would like to put into practise, but it would take a truly advanced student to learn them and we'd need certain research materials gathered to put our theory into practise coincidentally the research materials we need could only be gathered by someone with the power of a truly advanced student so that should work out well for us everybody involved in the end.



    About the Mage and the Wizard

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Kalanyr

    What a normal Mage or Wizard does is draw directly upon the elementally aligned mana that permeates LORE that is why most spell templates concern elemental energy since the system they are designed within assumes that mana is naturally elementally aligned.



    About elemental magic

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    The elemental magic of LORE is a manifestation of the Elemental Lords.



    A debate ensued over the archmage/ArchMagi terminology and us joining the order where Kalanyr said this

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    *Shrug* The Order is dead. Only its knowledge lives on, the way the title is used honours those who once held it and so I have no wish to reclaim the title exclusively for the use of ghosts, if the term passes into use as meaning a mage of great power, I am not displeased.



    There was some debate on the abilities of an ArchMage based on Kalanyr abilities where he posted this

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    Not all of my abilites spring from being an Archmage. Some of them spring from being a Knight. Others spring from being a Sidhe. Some of them from areas of study I have pursued as an Archmage that are not related to being an Archmage, I have after all been an Archmage since before the Eternal was the Eternal. Some of them spring from being much much older than you are and having a relatively short attention span. Still the human potential for growth never ceases to amaze, I see so many a fraction of my age who have in mere years surpassed me in areas I spent decades on, its almost like some cosmic force likes humans better than the rest of us.



    More on Warlic and other things

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    OOC - Actually Warlic is the only magic user with an infinite supply of mana. Most of the others are like Kalanyr or worse off (like needing potions or to drain mana from others or rest or healing from Moglins to regain their Mana).
    quote:

    Warlic is not nearly old enough to have been a member of that Order and neither Beleqwaya or Kalanyr were in a position to take students until recently, so there have been no new Archmages in a very long time indeed.



    On Xyphos Celestin

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: SmashBrawlerX2

    Where does Xyphos stand in all this? Is he also an Archmage?(In the Warlic sense) If he is, ive often wondered why so powerful a mage was missing from the final battle with the devourer. IIRC he wasn't there when Beleqwuaya disincorporated himself


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    He's an acquaintance of Beleqwaya's. Yes. His specialty is not precisely appropriate for the magic that was being worked.



    On Beleqwaya and Kalanyr

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    You are. Beleqwaya and I go back over 5000 years.



    A list of skill the Archmage class might have that we came up with during the discussions

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Bob Almighty

    Bob Almighty’s list of archmage skills deducted from the information given out:
    Beleqwaya's will include (3 of which are available through AMR series):

    --Defense buffs (at the sake of an MP cost)
    --Burst offense spells (Possibly Void damage)
    --Summoning guests formed from pure mana
    --Destroying mana of spell casting creatures
    --A difficult-to-control offensive spell, forcing a conversion of an element to mana, causing an output of energy so great it could potentially harm the caster as welll as the target.

    Kal's would include:

    --Element changing of a spell
    --Highly advanced metamagics at the cost of increased mana cost (though likely not as ineffiecient as Mage's Empower)
    --Effects which reduce an enemies ability to cast spells

    It's interesting. But before the specification between the 2 schools is made, you will first of all learn:

    --Applying basic elemental magics like the Elemental Orbs to a level appropriate for encounters of your level [Elemental Orbs with a MASSIVE buff]
    --A basic mana-constructed shield [Defense Boost, likely not passive]
    --Stat boosting skills [something like Ancestor Spirits from Berserker, with MP cost and immediate effect, no turn charging messing around]



    It was ask if Kalanyr was a deity and talk about the sidhe's homeland

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    Given the state my home is currently in, no I don't. I miss what was but returning home wouldn't restore that, still in time things may change and I'll probably feel the yearning to return then.

    And no, diety isn't the right word, and definitely not as the term is used on Lore or Caelestia.



    This comes from the book in-game The ArchMagi : History Revealed. Though it is in-game, it is note worthy and will remain here for now

    quote:

    The ArchMagi - History Revealed

    written by:
    Beleqwaya Melamin


    Years ago, in a time beyond the memory of
    mortals, there existed many different
    forms of magic. However, time and trials
    have withered that knowledge, and many
    of these ancients forms were lost, with the
    dead being the only ones that still keep
    the secrets.

    However, there are records of a very
    powerful sect of Mages that distinguished
    themselves above others in ancient times.

    They roved the lands of Lore, seeking new
    magical techniques, and teaching others
    how to grasp and channel the flows of
    energy around them.

    Their continuous journeying around Lore
    made them grow in popularity, especially
    since many of the mages that the trained
    grew into powerful mages themselves.

    However, as they grew in fame, they took
    a name to themselves and began to hide
    their secrets further and further within
    their own guild. They stopped teaching
    young men and women how to channel
    magic, and instead focused on learning
    ancient and hidden arts and practices.

    Eventually the outside world knew of only
    two things: the name of the mystic group,
    and that they wielded powers beyond
    imagination.

    This group called themselves the
    ArchMagi, and they were determined to be
    the most powerful group of Mages in
    history.

    After the ArchMagi turned their guild into
    a secretive order, they realized that they
    still had to increase their numbers by
    training and introducing new mages into
    the guild. Failure to do so would cause
    their order to dwindle, and so hiding
    themselves away forever would be folly.

    However, they no longer wanted anyone
    who was not an ArchMage to know of any
    of their hidden arts. Instead, they began
    teaching only the basics of magic crafts to
    prospective mages, while offering any
    talented mages a position in their guild.

    So powerful and respected were the
    ArchMagi, that kings and lords often
    enlisted their aid. Records exist of large
    sums of gold and artifacts, worth a small
    kingdom in itself, being paid for the
    services of the most powerful of the
    ArchMagi.

    The power was expensive to buy, but a
    single ArchMage on the battlefield could
    turn the tide of battle.

    However, at some point, over a thousand
    years ago, there exists an abrupt end to
    any records of this group and of any
    accounts of dealing with others as well.
    At this time, there are mentions to some
    great force, but no details are ever given.

    It is believed that it was at this time that
    ''The'Galin the Devourer'' visited Lore, and
    the devastation that was wrought brought
    about a cataclysmic end to any powerful
    groups that attempted to stop the
    unstoppable.

    Regardless of what happened, it appeared
    great damage was done.

    Centuries passed like seasons after the
    destruction of Lore. Something had
    cleaned the world of much of its life. But
    not all of the life was wiped out, and some
    of the ancient knowledge that was
    physically recorded and stored in secured
    places was recoverable.

    Civilization had slowly been brought back
    to reign, and cities had once again sprung
    up. Guilds and groups arose to lead and
    govern. And magic returned. Magic had
    not died, but it had been weakened
    considerably. Many mages had either fled
    or died fighting.

    The return of magic to its original strength
    was championed by a few strong mages -
    young in their years, but powerful. They
    were not well known, in fact most had
    never been heard of, but their strength
    could not be denied.

    The people of Lore referred to this type of
    mage as an Archmage, since the
    individuals showed the strength of the
    group previously known by that name.

    It was at this time in history that the name
    ArchMage deviated from its original
    meaning, and was replaced by the title
    Archmage.

    The ArchMagi had hidden their knowledge
    very carefully and spread out. As more and
    more years went by, their stories were not
    told, and slowly the name they held was no
    longer associated with them at all.

    The ArchMagi were no more, and from the
    ashes of their glory had risen nothing more
    than a title. A title of power, knowledge,
    and high respect no doubt; but a title
    nonetheless.

    Gone was the passing of secrets and spells.
    Gone were the musings of the Masters.
    Gone were the lessons of the acolytes.
    The memory of the ArchMagi had vanished.

    But while the ArchMagi had been forgotten,
    to someone who looked hard, lore of them
    could still be found - despite the difficulty.
    Records of this group were mostly in some
    long forgotten tomes buried deep within the
    earth, dusty archives of the oldest libraries,
    and with the elusive Drakel scholars. These
    scholars were not particularly fond of giving
    out information, and even if they did they
    offered very little.

    It was from these buried records and
    accounts that the existence of the
    ArchMagi, information of some of their
    spells and structures, and the accounts of
    devastation were learned.

    One particularly interesting letter was
    located. It was obviously hastily scrawled,
    and found on a reading table in an
    otherwise empty tomb that had been
    sealed off.

    The letter was unauthored, and undated,
    although it appeared to be ancient.

    ''This vault, and all others, must be sealed,
    although most accounts have already been
    destroyed. Today, the ArchMagi of our
    time will be finished. We could not save
    ourselves or anyone else. But we did
    discover a way to preserve the true
    knowledge of our group, although the
    chance of success is small. Small pieces of
    information will be very spread out - but
    only as much as can be left without
    drawing any but the proper person. For
    the ArchMagi to return, the long-lived
    mages must seek and share both
    knowledge and power together.''


    While little is known about the artifacts that
    are found around Lore from ancient times,
    they are known to possess significant
    power.

    One of the ancient structures that the
    ArchMagi crated were called ''Focus
    Sites''.

    Focus Sites appear to be the only
    structures found in various places in Lore
    that all have the exact same architecture,
    and do not change in their construction or
    decoration at all.

    How to use these Focus Sites has not been
    re-discovered as of yet, although other
    information has been learned.

    The Focus Sites were large stone
    platforms with steps coming up the center
    of one side. The top of the platform had
    intricate runic designs engraved deeply
    into them.

    As well, the sites have been found to be
    protected with a number of long standing
    magical enchantments around them. The
    enchantments are still very powerful, but due
    to their age they can eventually be
    bypassed by a mage of enough skill.

    The purpose of the sites is simple. The
    platforms channel natural convergences of
    magical energy, and were able to focus this
    flow into one spot - allowing the user to
    draw more power for highly complicated
    spells, and to sustain them longer.

    The prospect of finding the
    knowledge of such a powerful group
    is a goal often considered
    unattainable by all but the most
    dedicated scholars, despite the fact
    that the discovery of any of their
    wisdom would be a discovery of
    monumental proportions.

    Maybe the secrets of these times are
    lost for good, or maybe luck may aid
    in finding it. Whatever happens,
    should any of their hidden spells,
    tomes, or techniques to operate their
    devices be learned, it will be a
    discovery of unseen magnitude that
    will be talked about for ages to come



    A revelation on the powers of the KoO

    quote:

    [12:53] Kal_Sleep: And I can call on the power of The'Galin , that doesn't mean he'll grant me *all* of it.
    [12:54] Kal_Sleep: oh crap
    [12:54] Kal_Sleep: I didn't mean to say that
    [12:55] Aelthai: Kal ... yeah. Careful.


    In the Potential of Archmage thread, he adds this

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    Remember that because I can call does not mean that I will or that you are obligated to answer especially given that I am not even a communicant and there was one present there. And since I had not meant to reveal that at all I will say no more on the topic.



    More about Falerin

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    Falerin wasn't always a deity. I don't know the whole story, but he was once a human on the world of Caelestia that would have preferred to be an elf and somehow persuaded a deity to change him into one. It was afterward that the war began that lead to the ascension of several beings including Falerin. He became an elf before he became a god.

    The only example I know of in AE of a character that has had their race magically or divinely changed (other than certain changelings who can change their genetics at will) happens to be Falerin. He does not have Gray Elf as a sub-race. He IS a full blooded gray elf.




    From over a year ago of the current date (August 22 2011). I once asked Genoclysm about demons and he made the following observation. Note that this is not canon, but merely an observation of what can be seen in-game which is still quite interesting

    quote:

    Demons:

    I seem to be one of the few that have researched this, even among my team members. It just wasn't thought about much in the past I guess. In combing through everything in AQ and the other games that have been called "demons," I have found that in all cases at least one of two definitions apply consistently.

    The first and simplest is a native of one of the surrounding planes of Lore other than the material world itself. This would include the elemental realms, Heck, and perhaps even the Ethereal Realm. The greatest example of this are the Brilhado. Their race originated in the elemental realm of Light.

    The second definition gets a little complicated. It's easiest to point out the examples first. There's the fire demons, ice demons, forest demons, and the demon spectre that I can remember off the top of my head. Except for the Demon Spectre, all those examples's descriptions state that they are creatures that have been somehow corrupted and transformed into monsters with strong negative feelings being involved. The fire and ice demons' descriptions specifically states an elemental spirit caused the transformation. Looking through these "transformed demons" and fitting descriptions together however I could, I found that they all seemed to fit when considering the fire and ice demon descriptions as nearly complete and the others as missing information. Basically elemental spirits, most likely demons of the first variety themselves, find a host with a vulnerable mind, posses the host, and then transform the body to something more suitable for their purposes. I guess in the simplest way you could say the second variety of demon is a type of the first that are body snatchers.

    The first kind is extremely broad in definition. What this seems to mean is that demons as a whole are not one race, nor even one species. What gives them the designation of demon boils down to the location of origin for whatever kind of being they are. There's not much more to it than that.
    ~ Genoclysm





    Lord Barrius, June 2011. On the matter of Golden Plate's sweeping and elemental lean

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Lord Barrius

    Light/Dark? Maybe, maybe not. It's undecided at this point because no one is working on that particular revamp at this point in time. It hasn't been discussed very much.

    It will be swept, like Berserker and like everything else. I honestly think people need to stop fretting about these sorts of changes, because let's be honest....was Nemesis more useful before I changed it, or after? I think most of us know the answer. So how about a little bit more faith, eh? :P


    Radagast, June 2011. On the Golden Plate

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Radagast

    Actually, overpowered is a 'most definitely', considering that it's got a power level of an item over 60 levels higher than it is (if we count from its full powered state), and that's without updating its attack power to conform to the minimum allowed for its current level. Check the armor spreadsheet for more details


    Chii, June 2011. On the Golden Plate

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Chii

    A fully defensive armor, as you might think, eschews offensive power in favor of defense. The difference is that recent armors are based on formulaic standards, while armors of the past--such as Golden Plate--were based on estimation and gut feelings, sometimes yielding results which were contrary to their intent (such as how Nightmare Plate had significantly higher offense and defense than the Golden Plate when it was first released).

    At present, if an armor fully sacrificed all attack power and tried to have maximum defense modifiers and the lowest possible resistances, it would have the following:

    Offense: 332% base and random, 634% stat
    Resistances: 74% each
    Defenses: 47 each

    If it had minimal defense, it could have 66% on all elemental modifiers, which might seem semi-decent aside from the fact that a fully offensive armor could soundly thrash it in offense and defense. When an average armor is expected to have 51% on its focused element at that level, 66% is significantly worse than average.




    Chii, June 2011

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Chii

    But yes, quite a few items are fully post-sweep now and there are a few which are on older post-sweep standards.




    Date unknown. Suspected a few years from current date (August 22nd 2011). Falerin on the species of lore

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Falerin

    They do.... Drakel are genetically close enough to Dwarves, Humans, Moglin, Elves, Orcs and Dwarves to interbreed and produce fertile offspring. The Moglin are the only more distant race. They ARE HUMAN. In a way this parallels the idea of metahumanity from games like shadowrun, or the concept of the humanoid races of Star Trek.

    One might think of it something like this:

    Homo sapiens spp.
    Homo sapiens var. ulgathi
    Homo sapiens var. elani
    Homo sapiens var. draconi

    Credits to Lkeas




    Lord Barrius, June 2011. On the issue of breeds and species in AQ

    quote:

    I certainly wasn't aware of any "boundaries" on interracial breeding. I certainly wasn't assuming any. The canonical truth of so many aspects of the in-game world are not rigidly established, written down, or agreed upon by the team as a whole, so it's safe to say that anything which falls into a categorical grey area will typically be played according to the writer's own interpretation at the time of writing, and future material will tend to follow along with that prior writing in an attempt to reinforce it.

    Prior canon material seems to suggest that there are little to no boundaries between the various breeds, so it's likely that this trend will continue in future writing among our team members. As diverse as our writing team is, with so many different styles of writing and such diverse and varied opinions, we like to keep our world open and free to bend and shape to the will of our stories. It lets us play with almost every aspect of the world and make it more fun to explore.

    Besides, last I checked, 'twas a fantasy setting, and sometimes weird things result from a fantasy setting. Draklin is certainly quite weird. :P



    Attributed to Lkeas, taken from her Archive. Other relevant quotes with unknown dates follow. NOTE, however, that these are technically deuterocanonical, and may or may not be part of main canon (especially since some were from Truth or Maxwell). Credits to Archmagus Orodalf for taking them from the archive.

    Ojo: On free will:

    quote:

    Oh and by the way I will accept but one definition for violation of free will.

    The complete obliteration of volition.

    If you can still choose no matter what the negative consequences you are threatened with you have free will. End of story.



    quote:

    There exist puppet universes created solely for the aggrandizement of their deity with no sort of other pupose. In such universes Free Will is very much nonexistant. Such universes tend to implode in the very opposite case. The introduction of free will tends to be rather destructive to their order in the long run and accelerates the decay into entropy. Free Will is not therefore a neccesary part of creation. A creator ultimately is the final arbiter of their creation it is more or less simple.


    Maxwell: On Viridium

    quote:

    Viridium is an energy in subspace. The Network uses subwarp and transwarp drives to travel the universes creating armies for the devourer. When Viridum comes into contact with oxygen it turns to a metal like substance, it also becomes toxic to those who have come into contact with pure energy Viridium. Not every Network agent is hurt by this metal of course. Examples of some characters in the AE universe who would actually be hurt badly if cut with a Viridium blade who are NOT Network members are the Huntress and Atlas Maxwell.


    Falerin: On the Cold

    quote:

    Even in so far as the cold is not thamaturgical and nature your assessment is more or less correct. The cold is used to magnify mental processes. Magnifying competitive processes can inhibit existing ones. However the one thing the cold does not actually do is abrogate free will. Not ever.



    Falerin: On sin and purity

    quote:

    I incidentally also agree with you about the sinful bit. Lore has no concept of sinful the way that some Terran religions do. Creation is however corruptible by nature and free will will always corrupt. The question is not a striving for total purity. It is a striving for NET purity overall.



    Falerin: On free will

    quote:

    The violation of free will in a world that has free will as a basic structural element from without unravels the very fabric of the world. Free will is so intrinsic to the nature of the universe that its alteration will destroy the universe.



    Maxwell: On Epsilon (this may no longer apply)

    quote:

    Epsilon was created from the blood and bones of the Cor-Dem.


    It is possible that this is what Dhows meant.

    Falerin: On Death

    quote:


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr
    By the way no you haven't faced Death, you've faced The Reaper, which is to Death as Aquaas is the Water Lord, a mere projection into the realms of mortality to accomplish some goal (in this case the harvesting of souls). Death is a personification of a force it exists in a realm outside of mortality (The Void) the Reaper is its method to reach out and meddle where it deems it needs too. Even if Death could stop The'Galin why would it ? If its the personification of the death that even gods may die The'Galin is absolutely no threat to it (there'd be almost nothing thats a threat to a being of that magnitude), it has no reason to fear him and hence no reason to interfered with another being carrying out its role in the cosmic play, and if its merely the personification of mortal death The'Galin dwarfs its power by orders of magnitude. Either way Death ain't helping you.

    I seriously question that Kal. In fact I have very real reason to question that. Not only about the comparative level of Death but also about how he will interact with players. It is quite possible to have a universe where death does not exist. Death is an introduced force. If any force is primal it is Uncreation as death is merely the uncreation of life. Whereas uncreation can also uncreate matter, essence, existance, even time.



    Falerin: On Drakel

    quote:

    Dragonspawn? The Drakel are Dracomamalian. They are not Dragon "spawn" though they do share common ancestors with the dragons. They also share common ancestors with the Humans, Elves and Orcs.



    quote:

    The Amilani and the Silari are both Drakel Species. They merge with the primitive forest Drakel to become the Drakel of today. As for the Amilani being ancestors to the Aquatic elves this is likely metaphorical in the same way that the description of them being Giant Fish was metaphorical. It refers to the Drakel influence on their development.



    Falerin: On Elves

    quote:

    The Elani (Elves) are actually a much younger race then the Drakel. Though compared to the humans they are an ancient Race. They were NOT by all apperances alive during the last coming of the Devourer however.



    IRC Chat. September 12 2011. Falerin on Ryuusei

    quote:

    [19:43] <Elryn> I was not aware that Ryuuseihad been on Terra.
    [19:43] <~Damsel> O_o
    [19:43] <&Falerin> Oh yes... he lived there for most of his life
    [19:44] <Elryn> He came there after VespiriaI resume?
    [19:44] <~Damsel> hey if Shay can split thatmany times, I'm sure Ryuusei could pull it off once
    [19:45] <&Falerin> The evidence that heactually ever resided on his home planet issomewhat scant actually
    [19:45] <Elryn> Oh?
    [19:45] <Elryn> Hmmm...
    [19:45] <&Falerin> as near as can be toldRyuusei was raised on terra by the Twains
    .
    .
    .
    [19:54] <Elryn> But mainly, that what you said about Ryuusei.
    [19:54] <&Falerin> Oh certainly thats readily said numerous places
    [19:54] <&Falerin> including in game really




    From the Elements of Uncreation thread in December 2010 :

    quote:

    Kalanyr

    Most Wizards and Mages don't manipulate raw mana, they manipulate mana that has been imbued with elemental energy *before* they manipulate it, most of the mana that is found on Lore is imbued with elemental energy (often times more than 1) from the action of Creation itself.

    Manipulating Void energy is hard (though not impossible, Beleqwaya's magical area of focus is the manipulaton of mana particularly in its raw form), and a simple spell like Fireball does not use Void energy to Create Fire. Finding it isn't precisely easy either considering that when it interacts with Created things it tends to react with them in ways that covert a chunk of both what they reacted with and itself into something else.

    Kalanyr -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 12:22:05)

    Harm is energy without elemental alignment. Its usually a property of things that do not come from Lore, that aren't from a world with a compatible elemental structure (eg if a sword was aligned with Night energy and it came to Lore it would most likely end up as Darkness), and that don't obviously fall into a Lorian classification ( a sword of fire is a Fire weapon, a stone club is an earth weapon)*. Some specifically focused Lorian items deal harm damage by artificially inducing an "elemental" alignment with something outside of the element structure, eg becoming Anti-Zard element. Some Poisons deal harm damage by causing an internal breakdown in tissue rather than elemental interactions, these poisons actually occur relatively rarely in nature, but see fairly common use by sentients since poisons are generally only used when normal tactics prove ineffective.

    Void energy is more complicated, its the raw stuff from which all things spring, its both elementally aligned to all elements, hostile to all elements, and unassociated with elements. Raw mana is void energy which is why it does void damage. Being able to make use of void damage safely usually implies some kind of exceptional power or careful focus (many trigger weapons make use of void damage safely by creating a reaction with something that essentially generates very small amounts of void energy). Manasplosion is a very unsafe use of Void energy, failing or badly damaging the caster if not carefully managed. Archmage Research is a more refined version which causes a smaller and more controlled amount of damage to the caster (it also doesn't consume all the mana available to the caster).

    The reason why things that are resistant to Void are usually resistant to Harm is because things that are resistant to Void are usually resistant to everything to some extent (ie the resistant to Void and Harm both flow from some kind of generic resistance property), while there are exceptions it should be noted that most such creatures are usually strangely related to Lore's cosmology in their own right , Void Dragons are descended from Lorians dragons who natural possess high elemental affinity attuning to Void energy instead, which has had several strange effects on their physiology and their psychology.

    *There are a few items and beings from other worlds that possess such exceptional power that would up being aligned to Void rather than Harm, but they are very very rare.

    [Also from an meta perspective some things are currently immune to or heavily resistant to void and harm simply because we don't want you using flat %ile draining things which have a bajillion HP and are Level >You, strangely we feel that being really powerful shouldn't be a disadvantage to a monster. Several such creatures will lose their resistances once we've dealt with %ile effects (no we don't plan on killing all of them some of them will end up similar to Assassin's Creed or the Guardian Dragon where the %ile damage done is limited by a level comparison).

    Very few things will resist Void (Void Dragons are pretty much the only thing I can think of off hand), but similarly there will be very few sources of Void damage, mainly from triggers on creatures that have a wide variety of elemental variants or from things that harm the user. More than that will resist Harm, although usually to a lesser extent than they resist elemental damage. ]


    Jakau Ryuu -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 12:57:05)

    @Kal: Now you've got me wondering something...
    You said raw mana is void energy. Does that mean that, in theory, a conduit could be created between a particularly powerful mage's mana supply and the Void itself, allowing for a constant influx of mana? Granted, that would likely be extremely risky to the mage doing so, were it an option, but would it actually be possible?




    ________________________________________

    Kalanyr -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 13:18:29)

    Theoretically possible. On the other hand I'm unaware of a safe place to watch that from, so I'd really rather no one tried it.

    Even in theory it probably wouldn't be good for the mage in question though, even the small controlled amount of raw mana generated and used in Archmage Research causes damage to the caster, dumping the entire void worth of magical energy into a mage's mana supply carries the further risks of doing the equivalent of dropping the Elemental Plane of Water into a 20 Litre tank.




    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 13:20:21)

    So, doing such a thing would be worse than being hit with a sponge soaked in nitroglycerin?

    So, how can we go from the Void to Uncreation? What defines Uncreation?




    ________________________________________

    Kalanyr -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 13:31:21)

    The same way you go from Void to Creation. Which in the case of most beings is not at all. It takes immense power to safely use Void energy as a weapon, using it directly for creation or uncreation is harder still.

    I don't think I can answer the second part, defining Uncreation without reference to Creation is difficult, and describing it with reference to Creation is inherently circular. This is probably a poor explanation but Creation is making something from Void energy, Uncreation is returning the thing to Void energy. Even thats a poor version of a poor explanation since when you create something you also create its potential for interacting with other things (a potential for having a history if you will), when you Uncreate something you remove the thing and that potential (so the thing never existed). My apologies for the poor explanation.




    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 13:34:11)

    It's not that bad. In fact, it was quite enlightening, if simple. It explains how The'Galin/Omega works about. It might have been explained earlier, and I might have missed it, but it gives me a more solid idea of how one could go about Uncreating.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 13:50:23)

    But surely that isn't entirely accurate? There are different degrees of Uncreation, as Falerin Ardendor has said; there is the mere destruction of an object at one end and the complete eradication and removing the object and its potential at the other. How does this fit in? Merely returning part of the object's structure to the Void?

    And, to address the original question, are there "elements" of Uncreation? And HOW is it that you cannot answer the second part? You are a Knight of Order! We contemplated going to you instead of Ryuusei in the Bizarre Flecks madness. :P




    ________________________________________

    Jakau Ryuu -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 14:01:28)

    There's also the fact that Absolix was apparently Uncreated into existence - which rather goes against Uncreation's "erasing" effect, doesn't it? Your explanation covered the main portion of Uncreation, while explaining where exactly the Created matter goes... but there's clearly a "creating" aspect to Uncreation, just as there is a "destruction" aspect of Creation.

    In regards to the "Void conduit" response - I figured as much. That would get messy, even if the mage attempting it managed to set specific conditions and limits on the conduit, such as refilling only on draining their natural mana reserves and only regenerating a certain amount - I imagine gaining mana in any way other than accelerated, natural regeneration (which I suspect is the process induced by both mana potions and moglin healing magic) would be, at the very least, excruciatingly painful.




    ________________________________________

    Kalanyr -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 14:17:17)

    I sad it was a probably poor explanation. And yes that extension to the explanation is as correct as the explanation was.

    And to address the original question, the best answer would be it depends on how you look at things, in one sense there are no elements of Uncreation (there isn't unFire), in another every element of Creation is equally an element of Uncreation, you Uncreate Fire as much as you Create it.

    It's difficult to explain multi variable calculus to someone who only has the mathematical knowledge of a 5th grader. It doesn't help that even though I've studied the metaphysics of Lore on and of for several millennia that they do not come naturally to me. So add to that the problem of a native English Speaker, trying to teach the above to a Spanish person in Spanish. Also Uncreation and Creation have not been something that I've made a formal study of , my experience with such has usually been more practical in nature.




    ________________________________________

    Kalanyr -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 14:22:39)

    It is worth noting that even Ryuusei considered Absolix as an experiment (if you can use creation to "destroy" things (see Fireball) then why can't you use Uncreation to uncreate the absence of something? ), and he's much more studied in Uncreation than I am. My explanation is certainly neither perfect nor complete.




    ________________________________________

    Jakau Ryuu -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 14:27:01)

    No, the explanation worked quite well for the part of Uncreation it was describing. I'd actually been wondering where the matter went when Uncreated - now I know.

    The only problem is that Uncreation itself seems to be a mystery for anyone not either a deity (or in Ryuusei's case, served as a vessel for the God of Uncreation, whilst serving him for a long time beforehand), or themselves born of it. And there's certainly no way we're getting definitive answers on Uncreation from Ryuusei - he's just as cryptic as Fal is.




    ________________________________________

    Lectrix -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/12/2010 15:03:28)

    Simple: They absorb Elements instead of Creating them, and in the process, they produce the opposite Element. If you absorbed all the heat from something, it would turn to Ice; if you removed the Darkness from something, you would end up with Light.

    Hmmm... my theory doesn't seem to work with Water/Energy or Earth/Wind though




    ________________________________________

    RedEyedDrake -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/13/2010 0:31:19)

    Thank you for providing an explanation for how harm interacts with everything else, Kalanyr. You also brought up the point that beings that resist void also resist many other things and that beings come into being by having void undergo creation. Those two statements seem to support eachother. If they resist what "everything else" came from then it's reasonable to assume that they whould resist "everything else" aswell. However, there is evidence against the statement that beings come into beings by having void undergo creation. Cartwright stated that beings come into being by having primordial matter undergo creation. He also stated that Absolix came into being by having raw chaos undergo uncreation. Seeing as how Absolix ended up classified as void-powered whouldn't that mean that the void is actually the above mentioned raw chaos rather then the primordial matter? Also, all beings that come into existence in the void are created from the same raw chaos Absolix came from, right?
    Also, you stated that every element of creation is equally an element of creation. But aren't the eight elements all merely shapes of the power of creation while the void is the power of uncreation? I whouldn't call the eight elements and the void compatible like that.




    ________________________________________

    Kalanyr -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/13/2010 7:00:40)

    [ I admit to being confused by your post. To the best of my knowledge primordial matter = raw chaos = void energy. ]




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/13/2010 7:09:08)

    Then The Deep is a reservoir of Void Energy and Void Elementals?




    ________________________________________

    Falerin -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/13/2010 7:23:09)

    The Deep was described as a reservoir of primordial creation left over from the creation of Lore. That would suggest that it is in fact a rather chaotic mix of all sorts of energies likely both elemental and not including potentially Void as that is the raw stuff of the universe. However it is aligned for the purpose of creation so it is not pure void.




    ________________________________________

    RedEyedDrake -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/13/2010 10:30:05)

    Kalanyr, if I may presnt you with a quote from "Absolix Rising":

    ???: Your plan will fail. Absolix was not designed to be your plaything. My son is more than that. He is uncreation perfected, creation not from the primal matter, but from very chaos itself.

    So yeah, I admit I didn't remeber the exact terms but this makes it quite clear that primal matter and raw chaos are not the same. Wich brings up the question of wich one of those two is the void. There is evidence for both, as stated in my previous post. Said evidence for the former hypothesis (void=matter) comes from your deduction about void beings resisting many thing and by extention harm because they resist void while evidence for the latter hypothesis (void=chaos) comes from Absolix being a void creature while also being born from the above mentioned chaos.




    ________________________________________

    Kalanyr -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/13/2010 11:11:01)

    [ I'll have to check with others (unless Fal wants to clear the matter up) but the only thing I can think of is that the primal matter thus referred to is the stuff now in the Deep (and in almost everything on Lore) which was used in the creation of Lore (and thus most Lorian beings came from that), and that Absolix is uncreated directly from Void energy/raw chaos. ]




    ________________________________________

    RedEyedDrake -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/13/2010 11:12:40)

    Very well then. Thank you for your time, Kalanyr.




    ________________________________________

    Falerin -> RE: Elements of Uncreation (12/13/2010 11:19:50)

    Kalanyr's understanding is as far as I know correct.



    Credits to Archmagus Orodalf


    From the Bizarre Fleck Mostly Harmful War Thread in April 2011 :

    quote:

    Falerin -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 9:54:39)

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Dwelling Dragonlord

    @Mordred: Yeah, I blame Falerin personally. He said that we only saved Beleqwaya, because his wife would not have it that he passed away. We did not know that Maxwell got stuck in the Void, but well ... Falerin got omniscience! He should've known and told us, so we could've prevented this from happening.


    Omniscience is not a property of Falerin nor of any Caelestian or Lorian deities. Omniscience negates free will.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 9:55:52)

    The funny thing is, Loco had "Omniscience" as one of his powers.




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    Falerin -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:00:36)

    I can claim I have ultra toasted salt bagel powers.... but that claim by itself is not enough to actually open a deli.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:01:27)

    It wasn't a claim. During the quest,
    quote:

    You have contained the Power of Omniscience!


    Since the game itself told us...

    Eh, whatever. We've misunderstood the game before.




    ________________________________________

    Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:01:48)

    @Falerin: Thing is, Loco didn't claim anything. ^See above.^




    ________________________________________

    Falerin -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:09:26)

    Ah that. Well things are relative. Limited omniscience is a property of many or most deities. True full omniscience however means you already know the outcome of every event that has happened and that will happen. If you already know all things no one can act in a manner contrary to that knowledge. That someone knows the outcome means you are forced to act in accordance with their knowledge. You can never truthfully be a free agent.
    spoiler:

    Tholeon Webb is a long enemy of Eldron in particular and of Falerin secondarily. He was one of the causative agents of the Farpoint's directives against chronomancy. During ... well the time frame is gray.... At some point in Caelestian History Webb appeared in Caelestia and familiarized himself with its mechanics. He then reappeared in the distant caelestian past and manipulated events and the heroes of Caelestia into altering the fabric of Caelestian time, the changed events prevented Eldron's mortal family from being formed as per normal and in effect both removed Eldron from his role and altered the events leading to one of the major gods wars, causing several deities changing portfolios and Falerin never leaving his old portfolio to become god of evil. This lead to a Caelestian future that was entirely post apocalyptic end; with most sentient beings dead and long gone. The heroes upon seeing this venture back into the past to undo the damage. Webb was defeated and history sent back on its prior course but in any case Dhows caused (and always had caused) several major events in the history of Caelestia. He is a pivotal figure. His arrival in fact is among the events that caused the Caelestian powers to pay more attention to their borders and start looking outward.

    Eventually an abridged version of Dhows' Caelestian involvement will be placed in game in some form.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:11:44)

    Besides, I would expect Falerin's ability to perceive to be limited on Lore...




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    Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:15:47)

    So Loco has limited omniscience like us?




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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:24:24)

    spoiler:

    So Tholeon did a Tirlerion... The names are so similar. Tholeon/Therlion/Tirlerion/Telierion/Taleron...

    If Webb's history will be in-game, will Eldron's, eventually? I think this is the second time I'm asking you, but I really want to see what Aslyn meant and how Mythron became Creator of Elves...


    And the question is still "Is Dhows a deity or not?"




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    xehanort -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:26:58)

    Personally i take omniscience to mean that you know all that is happening in the present, AKA that if someone does something you will automatically know about it only moments after they do it.

    Simply put, if you do something, the omniscient person WILL know about.
    However, the future is out of their grasp, they only know everything that is happening NOW.

    Say that you murder someone, even if the omniscient guy is halfways across the galaxy when it happens he will still know almost instantly that you just killed someone in cold blood, but he did not know you were going to do it before it happened.

    That's how i perceive it anyway.




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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:28:18)

    Absolute "omniscience" would be knowing everything. Knowing "everything" MEANS everything, including the future, past, the never-will-be's, the might-have-been's-- Everything.




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    Falerin -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:30:52)

    Define deity within strict parameters, and I might be able to answer; but if someone defined differently I may not be able to answer or the answer may completely reverse. In Caelestian, terms no. He has followers and emulators but not worshipers and his power is not at all related to such.




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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:33:54)

    "Reverse." Teehee.

    Strict parameters:

    Hmm. This is a hard one.

    Strict parameters (attempt two): Dhe Ehm, Extra Greater Power, Greater Power, Intermediate Power, Lesser Power, Demipower, Avatar/Semidemipower.

    Is Dhows one of these?

    Strict parameters (attempt three): Of the same class as Falerin, Lorithia, the Elemental Lords, etc.

    Also... I believe you said that the HoC and the Epsilon were unrelated, but just for confirmation:

    Is there a link between the Auric Key/Engine of Creation and the Alpha or Epsilon?




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    xehanort -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:35:11)

    Absolute omniscience yes, that is true.

    Limited omniscience could very well mean exactly what i described though.


    ...Defining what a Deity is is easier said than done, what is the difference between a god and a mortal who just has enough power to match an actual god?
    Where is the line between Deity and Really Flipping Powerful Mortal?
    I for one would like to know where the line between the two goes.


    Also, i think Semi-demipower is supposed to be Quasi-Deity...




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:36:25)

    Hence we have the aforementioned labels for deities.




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    Falerin -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:39:39)

    In so far as it can be said that there is an absolute ceiling to the power a mortal being can have a demipower breaks that ceiling and a deity demolishes it. Many deities gain power from their worship. This is not universal but it is part of the definition that is central to a the system.


    Orodalf the rankings you give are not terribly relevant as they are positional. To my knowledge no pantheon recognizes Dhows as a member.

    Attempt 3 is meaningless. What defines the similarities between the listed entities can either be membership in a pantheon, level of power, level of authority, level of recognition, mutual agreement, or any combination of these.




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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:42:41)

    Hmm. I thought as such.

    Auric Key/Engine, though?

    So the Caelestian definition is a being who gains power by worship and is officially recognized by the pantheon?




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    Falerin -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:45:46)

    Er... more or less. Foreign deities are a more complicated matter. Foreign detiies are recognized by their power and the recognition of their own pantheon if Caelestia recognizes that pantheon as valid (i.e. has diplomatic relations). Where no diplomatic relations or recognition of the beings claim exist a being that might from every other sign appear to be a deity will to the Caelestian pantheon be an usurper not a deity.

    The references to "Hands" of Creation are not accidental but the relationship is not necessarily linear or straight forward. No further comment on the Engine of Creation will be forthcoming.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:49:02)

    You're still dodging Auric Key/Engine of Creation. Hmm. We have yet to find out as to what's going to happen to said Engine...

    So a being from within Caelestia that usurps a deity isn't a usurper (e.g., Falerin)?

    What is the Lorian definition of a deity? Is it the same as the Caelestian one, albeit a little less strict in terms of usurping?

    And is Dhows correct in believing that, without the Avatars' hold on Lore, the elemental boundaries will break?




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    Phrixus -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:49:14)

    Can anyone post or PM me an image of the Ghost knight House guard or perhaps just a Ghost Knight from the quest??

    I'd be very grateful.

    Edit: nevermind, its been added.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:50:20)

    @Phrixus: http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/6141/ghostknight.png

    @Fal: Also, was the Lady in the Special Mission Lolth? (Just for confirmation purposes)

    If we were to define a deity as something that exists outside of time, Dhows would pass... and It also passes as having a specific "portfolio" as the Master of the Shadowscythe. Hmph.




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    Falerin -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:52:32)

    The Avatars are Primal Representatives and avatars of the Elemental Lords. Dhows likely means that once they are killed off the lords have no choice but to respond... likely by direct manifestation, possibly of a direct Avatar possibly more... in either case such a thing is most likely to be destructive. It is however the elemental boundary collapse that he most intends to use. That is not directly caused by the avatar falling the avatars fall is just an agent of and part of the process. Falerin's reverse entities already demonstrate such things in action.

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    So a being from within Caelestia that usurps a deity isn't a usurper


    Falerin's portfolio is not the same... Dralen Ath was never ascended and the one Dralen Ath betrayed, and who Falerin eventually turned out of Caelestia too was not a Caelestian deity originally but a locally accepted and tolerated foreign interloper.

    That said... even in simpler cases of usurping power and taking a portfolio directly... recognition is the key....

    If accepted and victorious an usurper very quickly becomes a deity. If not... not.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 10:55:04)

    Then the boundary collapse is caused by the direct manifestation? I thought you said such a happening would be able to be contained if all Eight were to manifest at once?

    Define "Primal Representative."

    "Not." Heheh. It works like it does here on our more Prime Terra, then. Official recognition is what clinches it.




    ________________________________________

    Falerin -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War- Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part XIX (4/20/2011 11:00:16)

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    Then the boundary collapse is caused by the direct manifestation? I thought you said such a happening would be able to be contained if all Eight were to manifest at once?

    Define "Primal Representative."


    Theoretically in that instance such "MIGHT" be contained as they self balance. Emphasis is on simultaneously, theoretically, and might. How likely that simultaneous manifestation is or whether it would even be possible to orchestrate remains a very open question.

    Primal Representative - 1) any form, object, being, device, sample or representation of a deities power directly and identifiably evident in the world; 2) (syn) Avatar


    Credits to Archmagus Orodalf



    From another of the Mostly Harmful War threads in April 2011 :

    quote:

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:01:53)

    WOWOWOWOW Dhows tagged my thread. Creepy as anything, Fal.

    @Fal: Am I correct in believing that Tjeli has been preserved in a pre-Reset state?




    ________________________________________

    Falerin -> RE: =AQ= Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:04:19)

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: RedEyedDrake

    So Edward becoming an avatar of Death had nothing to do with him being a child of Balius?


    Of course it has something to do with him being a Child of Balius. That is how it got close to and selected Edward. It does however have nothing to do with Genetics. Same with it going from Edward to Cenara.




    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:05:08)

    @DD: Because Tumultu is not a hive-mind. He's not just physically separate from what he willingly and yet unknowingly gave up. He's spiritually and mentally separate from the other half of him. For all purposes, the other half has become a being of its own.




    ________________________________________

    Jamiie -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:05:37)

    My heads hurting trying to keep up with reading this! Let alone posting my own questions. 0.o




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: =AQ= Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:05:49)

    You mean specifically in Death's case that the Avatar's choices had nothing to do with genetics, yes? The Avatar does get passed, though, if the father/mother is Avatar at the time of conception/birth?




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    The Balancer -> RE: =AQ= Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:08:02)

    what! no rewards besides house items! what kinda crap is this!




    ________________________________________

    Rhowena -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:08:12)

    Hmm.. if Dhows is capable of imitating the form of others, and apparently of doing decent impression, should we be getting paranoid?

    There's also a bit of dialogue from Flecks I I've been wondering about... Could this become relevant to present events, or should I look elsewhere for things to nitpick?
    quote:

    Diviara: Don't mention it. Amilara and I know this Lore well enough. It was where my wife... where she...
    Cartwright: ...Where she died. Yes, I remember. The Network found it easy to hide here, given the quantity of undead who reside here already.




    ________________________________________

    Falerin -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:10:06)

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    WOWOWOWOW Dhows tagged my thread. Creepy as anything, Fal.

    @Fal: Am I correct in believing that Tjeli has been preserved in a pre-Reset state?


    Tis a question without any real or adequate answer. The capital of Tjeli remains as it was at the time of its casting into the sea. The rest of it is an ice wasteland. Events described happened more than 5000 years ago... which would antedate Mechquest but you will find no Tjeli on the Lore in MQ I suspect. How do you describe chronological events that occurred before a fixed point that itself altered its own past.... which is what the reset did? It is impossible to date them relative to an event that occured in their own future.. or is that did not occur.... but the future is not fixed...


    @Rhowena: Oh its definitely relevant. It was a foreshadowing... but me thinks you can find even more compelling presages in Cartwright and Diviara's statement... very close to there... about sources of corruption being trapped.
    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    You mean specifically in Death's case that the Avatar's choices had nothing to do with genetics, yes? The Avatar does get passed, though, if the father/mother is Avatar at the time of conception/birth?





    And the Avatar chose to go. Avatar can chose their host. They can certain chose whether or not to forsake them. It is a fact that other than truth there is no known fragmented insane Avatar.

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: The Balancer

    what! no rewards besides house items! what kinda crap is this!



    The cost of failure.




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    megakyle777 -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:18:33)

    quote:

    Hmm.. if Dhows is capable of imitating the form of others, and apparently of doing decent impression, should we be getting paranoid?


    Yes. Yes we should. Hopefully the inevitable bird puns will help clue us in though.

    Unless... He's making the bird puns to make us think exactly that?




    ________________________________________

    Rhowena -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:18:35)

    Mysterious dark presence = Dhows, yes. Would I be correct in guessing that it was specifically a trapped fragment that was absorbed by Dhows Prime at the end of Mostly Harmful?




    ________________________________________

    Falerin -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:21:20)

    Would you like scones or some other pastry Rhowena my dear?




    ________________________________________

    RedEyedDrake -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:22:07)

    .......*does the evil monkey point at Fal's pic*




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    Mordred -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:22:31)

    ... Oh, may the Lords help us... We're sconed. :P Yes, that was an atrocious pun.




    ________________________________________

    Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:23:35)

    @Falerin: How do the other Annunaki perceive Truth?

    @megakyle777: Hey, you've missed it.




    ________________________________________

    Falerin -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:24:07)

    I am sorry the pastry reference may be lost on the less initiated. I mean to say you are 100 percent spot on in your assessment on all counts.

    @DD

    As entirely insane... and somewhat dangerous.




    ________________________________________

    majesticstar3800 -> RE: Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:24:25)

    Dhows has a forum?
    Cool.




    ________________________________________

    Falerin -> RE: =AQ= Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:26:17)

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Mordred

    @DD: Because Tumultu is not a hive-mind. He's not just physically separate from what he willingly and yet unknowingly gave up. He's spiritually and mentally separate from the other half of him. For all purposes, the other half has become a being of its own.


    Making Tumultu and his other half more like Falerin and Ardendor than like Dhows.




    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: =AQ= Bizarre Flecks Mega War - Mostly Harmful Conclusion! Part X (4/20/2011 15:27:38)

    @Falerin(Dhows?): That would be the case with my L&L... Although, I've had the idea before Dhows(you?) killed you(Falerin?).

    This conversation could get... difficult... Although, I have no idea why Mordred Tumultu came up in all of this...

    I wonder, where did "E" take Ardendor?


    Credits to Archmagus Orodalf



    From the ''What the devil is Kathool?'' thread in November 2010 :

    quote:

    AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (Full Version)

    All Forums >> [Artix Entertainment Games] >> Artix Entertainment General Discussion



    Message

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/13/2010 7:31:29)

    DragonFable has recently released an "explanation of the Elemental Orbs' origins" quest. The problem is... it's confusing.

    MQ vs. DF:

    Kathool claims that the Orbs are the Dragonheart Shards from 5,000 years ago, prior to the Reset, but according to Lord Valorus, they were created only 1,000 years ago, in a time of elemental struggle, when the Shadowscythe threatened to cover "this land" with a corrupting darkness, possibly destroying Lore in the process. From where did they come?

    AQ vs. DF:

    While the history here gets... confusing, because the two games are on separate timelines, one can still draw usefulness here. The questions are... What happened to the Prime Orbs? According to AQ, the Towers were built to gather and keep safe the Prime Orbs, while in DF, they were for these Orbs coalesced only 1,000 years before. Furthermore, why is it that the two great wars in this region are set off by 100 years? Are they of any connection?

    A final question... why does Valorus speak of the Avatars in DF as though they were the only ones?

    ________________________________________

    Avantir -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/13/2010 14:00:00)

    The ShS came from the Darkness realm.

    On the topic of the elemental orbs, I think the Dragon Heart Shards were turned into the Elemental Orbs by the Avatars. The Avatars are the Elemental Lords representatives I believe.

    I think the differences of DF and AQ are separated by the Titans of Battleon. There may be some similarity, but not that we can speculate on.

    And before anyone says anything, I believe that the Titans of Battleon did split the timelines. Cysero said it would, and since it involved the time traveling Phone Booth, could have caused the split before DF began.

    MWhat really strikes me as curious is the fact that the war over the Elemental Orbs, the ShS invasion and all that happened 1000 years before DF. That's during the Reset. DF is supposed to begin just after the Reset ended. I don't get it.

    One last thing, Kathool never said that the Dragon Heart Shards existed 5000 years ago. He just said that they became the Orbs.

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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/13/2010 14:17:04)

    The ShadowScythe are not from the Realm of Darkness. The Lords are not at war and never were. That much, at least, is very clear.

    The Dragon Heart Shards DID exist 5,000 years ago, as they are part of one of MechQuest's central storylines.

    If the Shards were "turned into" the Orbs, then why did Valorus use the word "coalesce?"

    quote:

    co•a•lesce   
    [koh-uh-les] Show IPA
    verb, -lesced, -lesc•ing.
    –verb (used without object)
    1.
    to grow together or into one body: The two lakes coalesced into one.
    2.
    to unite so as to form one mass, community, etc.: The various groups coalesced into a crowd.
    3.
    to blend or come together: Their ideas coalesced into one theory.
    –verb (used with object)
    4.
    to cause to unite in one body or mass.


    Yes, what happened in the quest "Titans of Battleon" DID split the timelines, but they were already separate prior to the quest. They had simply converged for a time; what happened with the Phone Booth simply split them again.

    And where, pray tell, does it say that "DF begins just after the Reset ended"?
    ________________________________________


    Avantir -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/13/2010 23:09:43)

    Ah... I see you have not purchased the MQ Artbook. No matter, here are some quotes.

    quote:

    3007 - MechQuest
    ? - The Celestia Incident
    The Universe is 50% Reset.
    Data Error
    The Universe is 95% Reset
    4995 Years Later - DragonFable
    5 Years Later - AdventureQuest
    Later - AdventureQuest Worlds
    ??? - StickQuest?


    Pretty much confirms in my opinion that DF started right after the Reset.

    And my bad, they're from the Plane of Darkness.

    quote:

    The Shadowscythe are ancient alien invaders from the plane of darkness.


    That's a portion of a large paragraph.

    Let's not get into a debate about the Titans of Battleon please. I was just saying my opinion. You don't have to believe it.

    As for the coalesce...

    Looking back over it, that makes more sense. They merged DragonHeart Shards with their own element to form the Elemental Orbs.

    Also, I was pointing out that Kathool didn't know. He thought. I do play MQ and have obtained the Metal Element.

    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/14/2010 6:59:46)

    The thing is, Titans of Battleon was more or less explained in the Codex of Deeper Mysteries.

    Plane of Darkness =/= Realm of Darkness. The Lord of Darkness would not send his own against those of the other Lords. If they are traitors, then mayhap they are from the Realm of Darkness.

    As for this one:

    quote:

    3007 - MechQuest
    ? - The Celestia Incident
    The Universe is 50% Reset.
    Data Error
    The Universe is 95% Reset
    4995 Years Later - DragonFable
    5 Years Later - AdventureQuest
    Later - AdventureQuest Worlds
    ??? - StickQuest?


    It says that DragonFable takes place 4995 years after 95% Reset, no? 4995 is not "right after" in my book.

    ________________________________________

    Avantir -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/14/2010 15:01:39)

    DF has been confirmed by staff to be 4995 years after MQ. The Celestia Incident, 50%, Data Error and 95% are all in between.

    While this does not mean that DF is directly after the Reset, by the way that the book does not mention 100%, I can assume the Reset was cut off by something. What, I don not know. Perhaps DF, perhaps not.

    And sorry for my mistake about the plane/realm of darkness.

    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/14/2010 18:14:55)

    I realize that that has been confirmed. The things is, the book writes it oddly. Furthermore, it is possible that the Reset was never meant to be finished or never finished, hence little hiccups like Kathool and Kordana.

    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/14/2010 18:39:02)

    Let me dispel the dragonheart shards bit. Kathool knows them as dragonheart shards. They are the same as Prime Orbs, only in a different form. then we have the Reset, which was 5% incomplete. Kathool is part of that, wheras the shards were reset, or "un-made." 3995 years after the Reset is nearly completed, the Avatars coalesce the Orbs. 1000 years later, after Kathool awakes, he recognizes their power as those of the shards. All that's new is their form.

    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/14/2010 19:15:32)

    They can't be the Prime Orbs, though. The Prime Orbs existed since the creation of Lore(on); they weren't made a thousand years ago.

    ________________________________________

    Avantir -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/14/2010 20:28:45)

    Oh! Sepulchure said in the Spy quest chain that we had only found one of the real Orbs, and we left that one in the hands of a mercenary.

    The DragonHeart Shards became the Orbs that we have found, but the Prime Orbs were created by the Avatars, as seen in the latest Stone/Nature Orbs Saga quest.

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    Mordred -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/15/2010 1:14:49)

    @Arch: Are you sure? *scratches head* The latest quest in Willowshire would disagree.
    @Avantir: No, not at all. He said we only actively searched for one Orb; the Light Orb. All the others, we've happened to find by chance. Seppy was merely saying that we aren't even acting like we're concerned, otherwise, we would have actually started looking.

    ________________________________________

    madman 13 -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/15/2010 2:24:41)

    Ok, anyone who played MQ's planet Yokai would know that a dragonheart shard is just that: a shard or fragment of a whole object of unknown description. Therefore the shards could be what the orbs were coalessed out of. Kahool in DF is somewhat reclusive, and only rose near the end of the chapter. Maybe he never saw the orb in the traditional sense, and merely sensed the pressence of the shards used in making it.

    I find it interesting to note that Warlics super weapon and the orbs either have similar properties, or were made of the same thing

    I would hypothesise that the super weapon in MQ is actually the elemental orbs in a different from, and that the reset partially cancels them out, whereby they were re made 1000 years before DF. This allows the orbs (as dragonheart shards) to be around when Kahool was still on the surface, but could be made thousands of years later as well.

    ________________________________________


    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/15/2010 6:33:58)

    @Mordred: The latest quest in Willowshire would agree. The Prime Orbs:

    quote:

    Now there were certain powerful objects held by the temples, which represented the power of the Gods encased in mortal form.

    These pieces were considered primal remnants from when the elements were newly encased in enchanted gemstones, cut by the elemental lords themselves into spheres.

    These gems were known as the Elemental Orbs, and while many lesser orbs were created to emulate their power, none rivaled the power of the original greater orbs.


    The Prime Orbs have existed since the creation.

    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/15/2010 16:43:58)

    That does not in any way say they've existed since creation. Also, the Willowshire Orbs are the Prime Orbs. See, it's conflicting...

    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/15/2010 16:48:47)

    When has it been SAID that they are the Prime Orbs?

    The above passage STRONGLY implies that they have existed since the beginning. "These pieces were considered primal remnants from when the elements were newly encased in enchanted gemstones" - If they are remnants, they've existed since a certain time, which is stated to be when the elements were newly encased in enchanted gems. Furthermore, that passage tells of a time PRIOR to 1,000 years ago, meaning that the Primal Orbs have existed before 1,000 years ago.

    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/15/2010 18:24:55)

    That does not imply since creation to me. 1,000 years is not shot down, either. It could go either way. Also, evidence suggests that they are the Prime Orbs, as when Warlic could no longer sense the Fire Orb, he said he'd have to ask fiamme to coalesce a new one. The Avatars don't go making inferior orbs, they make the real deal.

    ________________________________________

    stealthwings -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/15/2010 18:28:52)

    Where was it said that the avatars do not make non-prime orbs?

    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/15/2010 18:30:40)

    Evidence suggests that they aren't the Prime Orbs. As I said, the passage above tells of a time PRIOR to 1,000 years ago; it describes one of the first comings of the Devourer.

    (Plus the above.)

    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/15/2010 18:32:13)

    It would seem that we cannot reach an agreement. Maybe a staff member could enlighten us?

    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/15/2010 18:33:30)

    I doubt it. The staff are... reluctant to let things go. Heh.

    I remember that Geno, however, believes that the Orbs in DF are not the Prime Orbs. Whether that opinion has changed, I don't know.

    ________________________________________

    Falerin -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/15/2010 22:35:03)

    The Orbs seen in AQ and in DF are both very important and powerful artifacts after their own right.

    I can also state that I was consulted on Kathool at some length and am familiar with the storyline there pretty well and think that is a cool one that leads to even cooler things down the line.

    Beyond this I can confirm only that they are materially different (made of different matter). If I can travel between realities I might acquire both for instance.

    I cannot and will not confirm if they are substantively different. There are clues and may be more. Certainly the story about the elemental avatars creating the orbs, or that they come from before this creation, are both nods to possibilities.

    Though I would not put absolute fact statements on matters that go into areas even more grey then just faithfully recording history. These are issues of mythoi and faith as well. Different cultures and people record very similar, or even the exact same events, radically differently.

    Heck, even very less complex and less controversial events such as accidents and crime scenes will have three people seeing the same events with each of the three recalling distinctly different happenings.

    Evidence suggests that, generally, the truth will be at variance with all three of them, to a degree.

    Worse where the timeline is not sacrosanct, this gets very difficult to the point of impossibility what is original has no meaning when time is fluid.

    Which segues nicely into the second point...

    As to the offered, somewhat offhand, opinion about Titan's I can provide enlightenment.

    The divide was not created by Cysero but it was definitely effectively enforced by him. A moment of realities converging on each other and growing close enough for convergence had that closeness artificially amplified and then effectively eliminated by alterations to the time streams.

    Pointing out that a time machine was involved so that the change could occur anywhere in time is an almost religious non sequitir. Such a belief cannot be falsified. You could argue that he traveled back before creation and even if the alteration that split the two occured there it could be argued they were still "originally" the same until something was done to split them. Time is not always linear either and that complicates thing immensely.

    When time travel undoes the very foundations of the previous condition in paradox it more then stops being the original condition.
    The very original condition was uncreated.

    Opinion that is not dispelled by actual fact and which is prefaced by "lets not discuss this" on a discussion forum for speculation about just that sort of thing goes beyond opinion and strays close to either willful ignorance or fanaticism. Neither are very helpful to conversation here.

    There is considerable evidence that the time lines of AQ and DF are fundamentally different, at their very core. It goes at least as far back as the reset... At least is relative though... time travel IS involved.

    I could even see someone arguing, not without evidence, that DF is what the MQ universe looked like after the reset re-patterned it after a convergently and conveniently close universe...

    I am not verifying that at all and I think other evidence suggests that is poor explanation including remnants of mecha and the ShS on AQ's version of Lore. Then again.... travel between worlds and places was not unknown to that universe.

    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/16/2010 1:33:45)

    Thank you, Falerin. This helps greatly. Until time passes, we cannot say for sure yet. We will have to wait and find out more about this matter through Sepulchure, I guess. But, fundamentally, it's possible that both sides of our discussion are true, thanks to time travel... At least, I think that's what you meant... Time travel is so confusing...

    ________________________________________

    MestreLipe -> RE: AQ, DF, MQ, STORY - What the devil is with Kathool? (11/16/2010 11:53:53)

    I was kind of confused when I started reading Falerin's post. Maybe because I can't understand english so well at all (I'm brazilian), but I could understand that he says that when the universes got so close, the could be an event that was internalized in different ways by both sides, so that's why Kathool (that survived the Reset) and Valorus disagree about the Orbs.

    Them too, are different, like I'm different from me-of-other-universe. Think that they are essentially the same, but different between them, and on the meaning that they represent for others.

    ~S.
    Credits to Archmagus Orodalf



    From the Void Energy thread in March 2011 :

    quote:


    Void Energy (Full Version)


    All Forums >> [Artix Entertainment Games] >> [AdventureQuest] >> AdventureQuest General Discussion



    Message

    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> Void Energy (3/19/2011 10:09:06)

    I'm sure we've heard the term thrown around a bit here. We know that it's found in the Void, and that it yields to all Creation and Uncreation(making the Void the metaphorical "womb" of the multiverse, no?). But how does it go from pure energy(not Energy, the element) to Created and Uncreated matter? Is this a secret of the gods? Further still, can Void energy do other things besides being used to Create or Uncreate everything and to blast your opponents into oblivion?

    Speculate and discuss!




    ________________________________________

    Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 10:12:47)

    It can twist those who dwell for too long in it into grotesque forms, while also causing something I'd like to call "Void Madness"*.

    So, my observations would say that it can deform reality and creation.


    *See Pellow Village.




    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 10:15:23)

    Well, perhaps it's not that the energy actively corrupts and twists, but such creatures and organisms we've seen to come into contact with the Void are incapable of handling the Void energy, and their bodies and minds are twisted in an effort to cope. But yeah, guess Word of God would help. :P




    ________________________________________

    Vipm1 -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 10:20:18)

    Possibly the gods created Void energy as a last resort against some unspeakable foe. A hail mary of sorts. But, eventually people found it and tried to use it for there own purposes.




    ________________________________________

    Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 10:20:24)

    @Mordred: Of course they are. They meddle with the "Clay of the Gods", the "Clay of Creation" if you will.

    Let's not forget that the Void also serves as a prison to the most dangerous of defeated monsters in all of creation though ....

    Perhaps the Void Energy also cancels their powers to prevent them from fleeing that place?




    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 10:26:27)

    Yes, the Void is a prison of sorts, so either the Void energy prevents their escape, or it attempts to instill enough power into them over time to make them kersplode. The latter has mixed results, as can be seen with the super Void baddies, such as Shadow Mistress Elizabeth. :P

    @Vipm1: Seeing as how Void energy is a direct tool of the gods to Create(and Uncreate), I doubt that.




    ________________________________________

    Vipm1 -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 10:28:55)

    Well I would say lots of them have kersploded b/c of Zfraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaag or whatever being the only one there. Also, what does the void look like? Zfraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaag is on a beach so I have no idea.




    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 10:33:22)

    Well, actually, there were many monsters in the Void. However, they've been temporarily disabled to test some Champion Elite Bosses.

    The Void in DF and AQW is all purply. However, in AQ, it seems to be compromised of various bits of Created and possibly Uncreated matter.




    ________________________________________

    Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 10:39:44)

    Perhaps it's purple to reflect on it's chaotic nature? The Void could be considered to be raw chaos.
    Chaos on itself is not chaotic, until you add it to order. Thus explaining why the Void tends to corrupt those who enter/tap into it's power.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 11:56:18)

    Perhaps that's the secret of the Engine of Creation.




    ________________________________________

    Mordred -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 11:58:29)

    Void Energy? Yes, it would be possible. Maybe the Engine transforms Void energy into the elements and workable material for the Avatars?




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 12:06:08)

    Here:
    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    [You go from Void to Uncreation] the same way you go from Void to Creation. Which in the case of most beings is not at all. It takes immense power to safely use Void energy as a weapon, using it directly for creation or uncreation is harder still.


    Using Void to Create/Uncreate is very difficult, Kal says. :P Perhaps it is the secret of the Engine, then. Mayhap we'll learn more next week, when the last Novus quest is released and The'Galin presumably gets the Engine.




    ________________________________________

    Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 12:12:08)

    @ArchMagus Orodalf: Taking one of your quotes of Kalanyr.
    quote:

    Raw mana is void energy which is why it does void damage. Being able to make use of void damage safely usually implies some kind of exceptional power or careful focus.


    So, in fact all what mages and wizards do is mimicking the elemental lords. "Creating" "Forming (existing) elements out of raw mana.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 12:13:33)

    Well, no. The question was regarding the conversion of Energy to Matter. Magi and Wizards convert the Energy from one form to another, no? o.0




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    Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 12:16:06)

    Raw mana is void energy which is why it does void damage.

    Oh, the'Galin + Engine of Creation = Creation of Uncreation = Black Hole = Dooming the universe




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 12:49:09)

    Yes... and?

    Also, The'Galin is a deity with only the universe's best interests at heart. There's nothing wrong with him getting the Engine. >>




    ________________________________________

    Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 12:51:05)

    @ArchMagus Orodalf: I know that, it's just that they make it sound like it's a bad thing. Perhaps he's got fed up with all these new planets he has to monitor and has decided to put an end to creation (as in the creation of NEW planets).

    Oh, about the mana. If raw mana is void energy it falls within the discussion of this thread.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 12:58:13)

    Yes, but I'm bringing up the point that Magi and Wizards aren't using Void Energy to create Elemental Matter; they're merely aligning Mana (Void Energy) to an element, making it Elemental Energy (not Matter). The question that Mordred is trying to answer is in terms of changing Void Energy into Elemental Matter.




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    Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 13:09:23)

    quote:

    But how does it go from pure energy(not Energy, the element) to Created and Uncreated matter? Is this a secret of the gods? Further still, can Void energy do other things besides being used to Create or Uncreate everything and to blast your opponents into oblivion?


    Hm, would Absolix count as a (sort of) god being a being uncreated by the'Galin?

    Oh, already changed that a while back.
    quote:

    So, in fact all what mages and wizards do is mimicking the elemental lords. "Creating" "Forming (existing) elements out of raw mana.




    ________________________________________

    Atomix -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 14:51:14)

    Well some monsters get into there by Death stealing their soul maybe.

    Or, the baddies get taken to the void as a punishment?




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    black knight 1234567 -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 15:25:11)

    Void is near impossible too capture. Too capture both uncreation and cretaion is near IMPOSSIBLE. Only person I cna think of the top of my head that can do that is Scor- oops, worn game :P I mean the Mysterious Stranger from what we saw he can do.




    ________________________________________

    Kalanyr -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 17:52:38)

    Most Wizards and Mages don't manipulate raw mana, they manipulate mana that has been imbued with elemental energy *before* they manipulate it, most of the mana that is found on Lore is imbued with elemental energy (often times more than 1) from the action of Creation itself.

    Manipulating Void energy is hard (though not impossible, Beleqwaya's magical area of focus is the manipulaton of mana particularly in its raw form), and a simple spell like Fireball does not use Void energy to Create Fire. Finding it isn't precisely easy either considering that when it interacts with Created things it tends to react with them in ways that covert a chunk of both what they reacted with and itself into something else.


    Also many of the creatures and objects encountered in the Void are not imprisoned there, some are merely lost travellers, some are travellers on their way to elsewhere, the Void serves as both the gateway and pathway between worlds in many senses, some aren't real in the way you would understand it, they come from worlds that never existed, from times that have not yet been, or that no longer can be or that are long past.




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    Jakau Ryuu -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 21:07:30)

    Is it wrong of me to find the discussion of the Void & its energies to be so fascinating?

    @Kalanyr: Would an extremely talented mage be able to "blend" elementally-aligned mana with unaligned mana/Void energies? If so, would it simply be a multi-"elemental" spell with a non-elemental component, or would the Void energy have odd effects on the elemental portion of the spell? (Or, is this an actual mechanic of metamagic - infusing the spell with Void-energy in a controlled manner to increase or alter its capabilities?)

    It kind of surprises me that we haven't seen anyone try, as one would think that even that simple fireball would be a lot more devastating if the caster had partially drawn on Void-energy to cast it - either due to having that same energy provide a second layer of damage, or said energy having some sort of indirect effect on the fire. That said, the infused-fireball would probably be exponentially harder to perform than the unaltered form, even if itwere to be done, but it seems to be the sort of thing that would have been at least attempted at some point.




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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 21:26:58)

    Hmm. So, if Wizards and Magi use Mana in that way, why is a nearby planet with a magical core needed?

    @Above: Consider the fact that most Magic-users can't even combine the elements in a single spell. Forget about trying to use Void and an element. :P




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    Jakau Ryuu -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 21:58:28)

    @ArchMagus Orodalf: Indeed, it would be quite the task, but I can't help but think that someone would have attempted it at some point. If can occur to one person, after all, it can occur to others, and wizards & magi are often portrayed as an inherently curious lot.

    Regarding your question, my own guess would be that the core is needed to help hold on to ambient, elementally-aligned mana, otherwise it would disperse and/or decay. Mana seems to be a finicky, unstable substance from what we know of it, so it's possible that it can only hold together in meaningful quantities when relatively near other samples of itself, and even then the large quantities may need to be contained, i.e., Lore's (usually) sealed core. In that respect, mana almost seems to be a hybrid of gas and energy (as science defines it).




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    Mordred -> RE: Void Energy (3/19/2011 22:34:35)

    Actually, I suspect in appearance and its effect on matter would be like that of plasma.




    ________________________________________

    Kalanyr -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 3:57:09)

    A Mana Core is not strictly speaking necessary for performing magic it just makes thing many many times easier, for many magic is either impossible or significantly reduced in the effects it can achieve without a mana core.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 7:13:53)

    Yes, there was talk of Magic being severely inefficient without one; but how does it make it things easier? And is it necessary for the core to be Elemental, as Lore's is?




    ________________________________________

    Kalanyr -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 7:22:24)

    A Mana Core provides large amounts of mana in a small area, in space mana is much more thinly spread (and frequently more raw, though there's still some elemental alignment going on from various effects) which makes it harder to gather and use.

    As to the second, I have no idea but I suspect so, outside of the Lorian Cosmological setup the concept of a Mana Core is meaningless, and within it its unlikely you're going to find anyone or anything with both with the capability of creating a non-elemental mana core and the world view necessary to even conceptualize a non-elemental mana core, so for practical purpose the answer is probably yes all Mana Cores are elemental.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 7:27:06)

    So is that how Vanatia's Staff or the Unaga Staves work? Do they carry around compressed Mana Cores? o.0 And how is the Unified Electromagnetic-Gravitational Force related to magic, and why may it be used to its full efficiency without such a Core? How is it related to Void Energy, and what is the difference between Void Matter and Void Energy?




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    Kalanyr -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 7:45:59)

    Only in the sense that a Lantern is a compressed Sun. Thats not something I've studied. That either, though my tentative theory is that its essentially magic aligned with Energy from various cosmic forces and that its not used to full efficiency , it seems limited in its capabilities compared to the magic that is available to a Lorian Wizard , nothing/everything/perception/random fluctuations in the probability field of something that is both potentially everything and the negation of everything.




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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 7:57:17)

    What a jumbled response. :P So the difference between Void Matter and Energy can be between everything and nothing. Heh.

    Yeah, UniForce seems to be technomagic...

    So, how do Kalanyr's magics function, since he's not from Lore? We've never seen him in combat; would his magic show up as Elemental or Void/Harm?




    ________________________________________

    Kalanyr -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 8:18:38)

    He usually uses Lorian magic on Lore.

    His native magic (both the stuff innate to him as a member of his race and the stuff he uses more like a Mage) is largely elemental in nature and maps well enough to some of the Lorian elements (and not exactly elements) that it would show up that way.




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    Leon~o -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 8:33:28)

    Wait...mana seems be like pure energy and it is considered Void energy in it's untainted form

    So why does the Void Dragon (Ugly ones) who are supposedly immersed in Void energy a abomination that sucks in matter?

    Maybe Void is separated similarly like Matter and Anti-matter

    Would explain why there is Harm and Void (Opposite matter cancels each other out so I guess that's why Void attacks hurts so much)




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    BlacKitten25 -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 8:58:54)

    Harm is simply damage that is not aligned with any element while Void is, something like the energy and essence of creation itself; pure chaos.

    So that's why just a single ArchMage is said to be capable of turning the tides of the battle. Channeling pure, raw mana and blasting it at opponents. I'm excited for the ArchMage class.




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    Leon~o -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 9:38:01)

    @BlacKitten25: Then what is Harm?

    Everything we've seen so far bar Void has had a elemental affinity, and note, ArchMage Research does Harm damage, not void.

    Well, Harm aside, what do you think of the Anti-matter theory? The Void Dragons does have max weakness to everything so I guess we are it's equivalent of what Void is to us?




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    Mordred -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 9:42:08)

    ArchMage Research does Harm damage because you don't want Void damage. In most cases, it has to be severely penalized, whereas Harm is not penalized as much.

    I'll say my theory again: Void <insert creature here>s live in the Void, and have direct exposure to Void energy. I think that they absorb it slowly, and their bodies change in order to try to accommodate the chaos within them. Their bodies reflect the energies they now have at their disposal. So, Void energy does not inherently twist things into looking grotesque, but the creatures naturally try to change.




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    Kalanyr -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 9:51:51)

    Dragons are great big elemental energy capacitators Void energy is .... not exactly elemental energy ... filling a dragon up with it has some ... strange... effects.




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    Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 10:08:08)

    @Kalanyr: What of "Void Madness"*?

    Oh, would Vartai also qualify as big elemental energy capacitators?


    *See Pellow Village.




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    Leon~o -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 10:14:39)

    @Mordred: Harm is a 100% modifier to everything, Void is a 200% modifier to everything bar a few exception

    A Void spell at half the power of a Harm one would do the same damage...so what is Harm? Why have 2 neutral elements?

    Kalanyr's vague answer is....vague xD

    @Dwelling Dragonlord: Oh right, Pellow Village's inhabitants had their emotions separated from them, I guess the Void gave them shape to exist independently?

    Speaking of DF, The Creatioux and the Decadere is where I got my theory of Anti-matter analogue from




    ________________________________________

    Jakau Ryuu -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 11:04:52)

    @Dwelling Dragonlord: Two things:
    -First, I'm not so sure that Kal' can account for DF's Void as well as he can for AQ's variant.
    -Second, I'd hazard the guess that the Vartai would also qualify, but to a lesser extent than would full dragons.

    Regarding your "Void Madness" question... my own theory takes Mordred's into account and expands on it a little. I suspect that their bodies aren't the only things reshaping themselves to account for the unbridled chaos - the mind as-is can't handle being in an environment like the Void for too long. So, in its attempts to shift to better grasp and function in the twisted surroundings, it changes to a point where the being would be considered "insane" by normal standards... but for a being with long-term, nigh-unbroken exposure to the Void, it's perfectly normal, as what works on Lore, doesn't necessarily apply in the Void.




    ________________________________________

    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 11:55:13)

    Hmm...
    quote:

    in space mana is much more thinly spread (and frequently more raw, though there's still some elemental alignment going on from various effects)


    So does that mean that outer space is much like the Void? If so, that explains why Alien Zards look so much like Void Dragons. :P

    Leon, Kal already explained the difference between Harm and Void for us.
    quote:

    Harm is energy without elemental alignment. Its usually a property of things that do not come from Lore, that aren't from a world with a compatible elemental structure (eg if a sword was aligned with Night energy and it came to Lore it would most likely end up as Darkness), and that don't obviously fall into a Lorian classification ( a sword of fire is a Fire weapon, a stone club is an earth weapon)*. Some specifically focused Lorian items deal harm damage by artificially inducing an "elemental" alignment with something outside of the element structure, eg becoming Anti-Zard element. Some Poisons deal harm damage by causing an internal breakdown in tissue rather than elemental interactions, these poisons actually occur relatively rarely in nature, but see fairly common use by sentients since poisons are generally only used when normal tactics prove ineffective.

    Void energy is more complicated, its the raw stuff from which all things spring, its both elementally aligned to all elements, hostile to all elements, and unassociated with elements. Raw mana is void energy which is why it does void damage. Being able to make use of void damage safely usually implies some kind of exceptional power or careful focus (many trigger weapons make use of void damage safely by creating a reaction with something that essentially generates very small amounts of void energy). Manasplosion is a very unsafe use of Void energy, failing or badly damaging the caster if not carefully managed. Archmage Research is a more refined version which causes a smaller and more controlled amount of damage to the caster (it also doesn't consume all the mana available to the caster).

    The reason why things that are resistant to Void are usually resistant to Harm is because things that are resistant to Void are usually resistant to everything to some extent (ie the resistant to Void and Harm both flow from some kind of generic resistance property), while there are exceptions it should be noted that most such creatures are usually strangely related to Lore's cosmology in their own right , Void Dragons are descended from Lorians dragons who natural possess high elemental affinity attuning to Void energy instead, which has had several strange effects on their physiology and their psychology.

    *There are a few items and beings from other worlds that possess such exceptional power that would up being aligned to Void rather than Harm, but they are very very rare.

    [Also from an meta perspective some things are currently immune to or heavily resistant to void and harm simply because we don't want you using flat %ile draining things which have a bajillion HP and are Level >You, strangely we feel that being really powerful shouldn't be a disadvantage to a monster. Several such creatures will lose their resistances once we've dealt with %ile effects (no we don't plan on killing all of them some of them will end up similar to Assassin's Creed or the Guardian Dragon where the %ile damage done is limited by a level comparison).

    Very few things will resist Void (Void Dragons are pretty much the only thing I can think of off hand), but similarly there will be very few sources of Void damage, mainly from triggers on creatures that have a wide variety of elemental variants or from things that harm the user. More than that will resist Harm, although usually to a lesser extent than they resist elemental damage. ]




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    Leon~o -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 13:00:40)

    @ArchMagus Orodalf: Yay for huge explaining text :D

    Last thing before I go to sleep, if space is similar to the void than how do we cast magic effectively in the void?

    Do you mean it lacks mana or the mana exists in raw form? (Both are bad for casting magic right?)




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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 13:02:02)

    You can't cast magic effectively in space (or, at least, Lorians haven't figured out how to, though the Unaga apparently have). That's the whole reason why the WarpForce has to rely on Technology more than anything else.

    I believe Kal said that it mainly exists in a spread out, raw form above.




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    Leon~o -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 13:06:28)

    @ArchMagus Orodalf: Oops, I meant how do we cast effective in Void, I messed up the wording xD

    I was referring to how you were saying space and the void were similar




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    Kalanyr -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 13:24:48)

    The areas of the Void you fight in are usually not the true Void, they are little areas that are stabilized for various purposes. The time you actually went into an area of the true void in pursuit of Beleqwaya, you had help.




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    Leon~o -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 13:27:47)

    @Kalanyr: I was wondering why the Restoration journey needed special protection xD




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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 20:03:36)

    So... how does the Ethereal Realm factor into magic?




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    alexcyr115 -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 22:36:47)

    What makes divine magic different from other magic?




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    Mordred -> RE: Void Energy (3/20/2011 22:56:45)

    What? What do you mean by divine magic?



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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/21/2011 6:33:14)

    Falerin once said that there are several types of magic: Non-elemental, Elemental, Metamagic, and Divine Magic. I don't have teh quote, and teh thread went teh kaput. =.=

    But the difference is presumably that there's a God behind Divine Magic. :P




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    Mordred -> RE: Void Energy (3/21/2011 6:36:41)

    No quote is necessary. I figured it just meant that a god was behind it, but wanted confirmation. Thanks!

    No, I doubt that Divine Magic solely deals with Void energy. I think that if the Lords cast some magic, it would be considered Divine. Void energy probably is much easier for a god to use in magic than for a mortal, I suspect.




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    black knight 1234567 -> RE: Void Energy (3/21/2011 6:53:31)

    Jakau's arguement is VERY intresting.
    But blending elemntal mana + Void would probably end up un-creating th elemental magic possibly leaving un-stable Void.




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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/21/2011 7:05:53)

    Speaking of which, a few more questions:

    Why does the Reaper (Lorian) claim that the Void is HIS Realm? And why is combining the elements in magic so difficult that only Tralin can do it?




    ________________________________________

    Kalanyr -> RE: Void Energy (3/21/2011 7:40:08)

    Because the little area you're playing around in *is* his realm. If I built up a tower and set up shop in it and claimed all the ground in a kingdom sized area around it, I could call it my realm without implying I owned all of Lore or all of the Multiverse.

    *eyebrow raise* I think you may need to state what you mean by "combining" the elements since I can think of several spells that are within the realm of a mage who hasn't even mastered his art that have more than one element in them.




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    black knight 1234567 -> RE: Void Energy (3/21/2011 8:25:22)

    He means void + element, I highly doubt its possible.




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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/21/2011 15:08:41)

    No, I mean what Tralin does.
    quote:

    Tralin was something of a wonder in the school of thought, a generalist of the highest caliber, his specialty lay in heretofore unique and fascinating combinations of spheres. Tralin was said to be able to even combine elements that normally opposed in his complex magical rituals.


    Oddly enough, this makes it seem unusual that Tralin can accomplish such a feat.

    One more question:

    BACON.

    What is Bacon? It plays less of a role in AQ than DF, but it still exists. In AQ, we have Bacon Spellcraft, which deals Void damage. In general, though, what is the nature of Bacon, and what has it to do with Void?

    In a DF thread, we were talking about why Void "Elementals" in DF were weak against the "element" created by the supposed "Chickencow God." My hypothesis was that Bacon is merely a type of Void Energy primed for Creation, like the stuff in the Deep. Is this correct?




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    alexcyr115 -> RE: Void Energy (3/21/2011 19:30:07)

    It sounds like Divine Magic is spells cast by gods, but why would the nature of the caster change the nature of the spell?




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    ArchMagus Orodalf -> RE: Void Energy (3/23/2011 20:42:29)

    One more, Kal: How is the Moon connected to the Void? o.0



    Credits to Archmagus Orodalf

    < Message edited by Master Samak -- 8/20/2018 18:16:50 >
  • AQ  Post #: 1
    8/22/2011 22:19:37   
    ArchMagus Orodalf
    Member

    I already sent you a PM about this, but Falerin's quote should be attributed to Lkeas, as I took it from her Arkhive. Other relevant quotes with unknown dates follow. NOTE, however, that these are technically deuterocanonical, and may or may not be part of main canon (especially since some were from Truth or Maxwell).

    Ojo: On free will:

    quote:

    Oh and by the way I will accept but one definition for violation of free will.

    The complete obliteration of volition.

    If you can still choose no matter what the negative consequences you are threatened with you have free will. End of story.


    quote:

    There exist puppet universes created solely for the aggrandizement of their deity with no sort of other pupose. In such universes Free Will is very much nonexistant. Such universes tend to implode in the very opposite case. The introduction of free will tends to be rather destructive to their order in the long run and accelerates the decay into entropy. Free Will is not therefore a neccesary part of creation. A creator ultimately is the final arbiter of their creation it is more or less simple.


    Maxwell: On Viridium

    quote:

    Viridium is an energy in subspace. The Network uses subwarp and transwarp drives to travel the universes creating armies for the devourer. When Viridum comes into contact with oxygen it turns to a metal like substance, it also becomes toxic to those who have come into contact with pure energy Viridium. Not every Network agent is hurt by this metal of course. Examples of some characters in the AE universe who would actually be hurt badly if cut with a Viridium blade who are NOT Network members are the Huntress and Atlas Maxwell.


    Falerin: On the Cold

    quote:

    Even in so far as the cold is not thamaturgical and nature your assessment is more or less correct. The cold is used to magnify mental processes. Magnifying competitive processes can inhibit existing ones. However the one thing the cold does not actually do is abrogate free will. Not ever.


    Falerin: On sin and purity

    quote:

    I incidentally also agree with you about the sinful bit. Lore has no concept of sinful the way that some Terran religions do. Creation is however corruptible by nature and free will will always corrupt. The question is not a striving for total purity. It is a striving for NET purity overall.


    Falerin: On free will

    quote:

    The violation of free will in a world that has free will as a basic structural element from without unravels the very fabric of the world. Free will is so intrinsic to the nature of the universe that its alteration will destroy the universe.


    More incoming. You can comb the Arkhive yourself, if you'd like. All from Lkeas's work.

    Maxwell: On Epsilon (this may no longer apply)

    quote:

    Epsilon was created from the blood and bones of the Cor-Dem.


    It is possible that this is what Dhows meant.

    Falerin: On Death

    quote:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr
    By the way no you haven't faced Death, you've faced The Reaper, which is to Death as Aquaas is the Water Lord, a mere projection into the realms of mortality to accomplish some goal (in this case the harvesting of souls). Death is a personification of a force it exists in a realm outside of mortality (The Void) the Reaper is its method to reach out and meddle where it deems it needs too. Even if Death could stop The'Galin why would it ? If its the personification of the death that even gods may die The'Galin is absolutely no threat to it (there'd be almost nothing thats a threat to a being of that magnitude), it has no reason to fear him and hence no reason to interfered with another being carrying out its role in the cosmic play, and if its merely the personification of mortal death The'Galin dwarfs its power by orders of magnitude. Either way Death ain't helping you.

    I seriously question that Kal. In fact I have very real reason to question that. Not only about the comparative level of Death but also about how he will interact with players. It is quite possible to have a universe where death does not exist. Death is an introduced force. If any force is primal it is Uncreation as death is merely the uncreation of life. Whereas uncreation can also uncreate matter, essence, existance, even time.


    Falerin: On Drakel

    quote:

    Dragonspawn? The Drakel are Dracomamalian. They are not Dragon "spawn" though they do share common ancestors with the dragons. They also share common ancestors with the Humans, Elves and Orcs.


    quote:

    The Amilani and the Silari are both Drakel Species. They merge with the primitive forest Drakel to become the Drakel of today. As for the Amilani being ancestors to the Aquatic elves this is likely metaphorical in the same way that the description of them being Giant Fish was metaphorical. It refers to the Drakel influence on their development.


    Falerin: On Elves

    quote:

    The Elani (Elves) are actually a much younger race then the Drakel. Though compared to the humans they are an ancient Race. They were NOT by all apperances alive during the last coming of the Devourer however.

    Okay, this was Kalanyr essentially confirming that the powers of AQWarlic are the same as those of DFWarlic.

    In response to:

    quote:

    Warlic could really just cast a large AoE attack on the waves , but nooooooo he decides that the players can handle them 1 at a time :c


    Kalanyr says

    quote:

    Or perhaps he doesn't want to overload on Mana and blow up Battleon ?


    < Message edited by ArchMagus Orodalf -- 8/27/2011 8:14:12 >
    AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 2
    12/28/2011 17:46:24   
    Elryn

    Custodian (DF)


    Uhg... That first post seems so terribly long. Best I start making multiple posts. Eventually, things will have to be classified when enough lore is gathered.



    From the new Potential of the ArchMagi thread's discussion in August 2011

    Kalanyr states that is it is possible to shapeshift using Metamagics

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Elryn

    Here is a quote that might help you, extreme wizard :
    quote:

    Metamagic, as its name implies, is magic used to alter magic. At a very basic level, it can change structures of spells. Class Skills learned as a Mage (e.g., Focus Spell, Empower Spell) are types of metamagic. On a higher level, one can call the magical foundations of the world a “spell,” and metamagic can change the structure of the world. The bizarre flecks, for example, have this sort of metamagical effect on the world.


    It seems that on a high level, metamagics may be used to change the magical foundations of the world. Seeing that the effect the bizarre flecks have, I wonder : Can metamagics be used to change one's shape (shapeshifting)?


    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Kalanyr

    Sure, same way the bizzare fleck's change reality, but that's like cutting steak with a gingerbread cutter, so I wouldn't recommend it unless you're really good, or you don't require a functional body to live.



    Chii on ArchMage's abilities

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Chii

    Try and imagine coming up with 20 abilities that are all "click, boom" without any of them overlapping. You betcha there's some strategy here.



    Chii on Archknights and Knights of Order

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Chii

    ArchKnights have nothing to do with nerfing and buffing. You're thinking of Knights of Order, a completely separate entity.




    Other quotes

    July 12th 2011, Kalanyr on ArchMage class quests

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Kalanyr

    The last quest for a skill is against a level 120 quest. The guardian only bonus quest ... is as always above that by a fair margin. Pray.



    July 9th 2011, Eukara Vox discovers an idea for pet

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Mystical Warrior

    What I'm waiting for is a pet that will go well with my character page...A white-yellow colored pet

    Really... *makes notes*

    < Message edited by Eukara Vox -- 7/9/2011 15:12:22 >




    From the Awethur vs AntiGuardian thread, July 2011

    Chii on Awethur and Ghin

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Chii

    It quite possibly depends on how long Awethur was given to recharge. As you can see from the first time you confronted him in the tomb, Awethur is quite capable of annihilating his opponents, but he was quite taxed by the endeavor. Meanwhile, the AntiGuardian defeated Warlic, at least three guardians, Zephyros, Robina, Eselgee and you with little apparent effort, but he was already at the peak of his power. Awethur might well have become similar in stature if left to his own devices long enough. After all, apparently he found a way to bind the Reaper to the Blade of Awe...


    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Chii

    AntiGuardian's all about the offense, while Awethur is a bit more balanced between offense and defense. The trick to surviving Ghin is not to die. Really, that's the trick! Ghin isn't prepared for a prolonged battle the same way Awethur is, and not having his prey fall down and die instantly is enough of a surprise to give you the upper hand. Of course, you wouldn't survive his initial onslaught if it weren't for the UltraGuardian Plate, which was clearly outside his realm of expertise .



    Chii on adventurer no-drops

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Chii

    Adventurers may eventually be given the option to permanently swap their non-drops as well. I can't rule it out, at least. I will say however that the game was never intended for a person to play adventurers for several years at a time. We try and make it friendly enough to do so (hence a lot of policies such as not considering equipment gaps filled if the only items there are guardian-only), but if there were no incentives to upgrade, well...




    From the Horsemen Four thread, November 2010

    Falerin

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Falerin

    I can say that a horseman was introduced unquestionably at the end of War's actions and he dripped with contagion... in fact I needed both an antiviral antihemilinthic and antibiotics after just breathing the same air as he...

    ...er given that fact perhaps some orange juice next dear assistant... loading on vitamin C could not hurt...


    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Falerin

    quote:

    Which one was sending the B.U.R.Ps every two years up until this point?


    Like Miss Tayaken Spelling... I answerth Mu.

    quote:

    Ok the horsemen death isn't the local guy we owe countless favors to.


    This is a non sequitir actually... Though it is in a sense both true and false....

    Death the Reaper is to Death the Horsemen roughly as Mayhem and Carnage were to War.



    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Falerin

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: RedEyedDrake

    When exactly did you awnser my question about the identity os the B.U.R.Ps' sender?


    Mu was the answer because your question was broken. Archmagus Orodalf has indicated why...

    Also why sources conflict... because it is not a singularity but a duality you are dealing with.

    I will now further clarify my points as seemingly obvious bits are being missed.

    Before this event three horsemen have been seen... Famine is the last to be seen, and will be seen for the first time with this event, bringing the total to four.


    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Falerin

    Strictly speaking death the horseman is... ugh... there is no way to clarify without giving too many spoilers. So I am afraid I must let the contradiction stand. You have both seen Death and not yet seen Death.

    quote:

    Or who sends the B.U.R.Ps once and for all (both is a legitimate awnser to this one, I agree. But I want a decisive one.)


    If wishes were fishes we would never go hungry.


    You will have your answer soon enough.... though it has been strongly implied already.


    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Falerin

    Eh... something of the sort though not quite... Death is a complex matter given just what Entropy..that is to say Sleep... that is to say Rest.. that is to say Demise... that is to say Change... that is to say Thanatos represents.

    And even once one knows him fully they know Death not at all...


    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Falerin

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    Sleep and Death were different deities in the Greek pantheon


    They are in Greek aye... but even the ancient Greeks recognized there was something of sameness about them...

    Hypnos and Thanatos were identical twins in Hesiod and in most other recounts. Even when they are not twins they are half brothers.


    You know keeping souls is not what powers death. He can use them or send them on their way to their reward or to their punishment. He can use their bodies and souls as servants. Souls and Bodies are useful but that is not what powers death... or else no world would have reincarnation... and some do...

    What powers death is not keeping the dead... What powers death is the act of dying....


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Nex del Vida

    Yeah, I think that has been a pretty widely accepted theory for a while now. Death is basically using Lore as an infinitely renewable resource, powering himself up as much as he possibly can. However, his eventual motives are difficult to say. It is my opinion that each Horseman wants to end Lore in his own way--War wants to tear it apart with conflict, Famine wants to starve it away, Pestilence to destroy it with illness, and Death to... well, kill it. What confuses me is that it seems that each of the other Horsemen is basically a feeder to Death... so how is it that he is considered equal to them? It would seem that he is the most powerful of them, simply by design as well as in practice. The discovery of their true motives and backgrounds is the reason I want this saga to continue.

    quote:

    ORIGINAL : Falerin

    That is too simplistic.



    August 27th 2011, Kalanyr confirms that Adventure Quest's Warlic has powers similar to Dragonfable's Warlic

    quote:

    In response to:

    quote:

    Warlic could really just cast a large AoE attack on the waves , but nooooooo he decides that the players can handle them 1 at a time :c



    Kalanyr says

    quote:

    Or perhaps he doesn't want to overload on Mana and blow up Battleon ?



    Edit : Provided the proper format is used, I should just let others posts there quotes and keep them so. This is a collaboration after all.

    *Elryn thumps his head for being silly*

    < Message edited by Elryn -- 9/8/2012 22:05:50 >
    AQ  Post #: 3
    4/26/2012 15:59:22   
    ArchMagus Orodalf
    Member

    On Dhows:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin

    [WordOfGod]
    The firstborn is a shadow

    [/WordOfGod]


    On the Shadow Universe:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Lord Barrius

    I'm not entirely sure how a device [the sensors of the Starship Centerprise] capable of recognizing the genetic makeup of a creature whose very existence was almost entirely purged from every record in the universe could even exist, but presuming it could, I suppose that it could recognize such a thing. The only other way (and indeed the traditional way of knowing) is to have someone with sufficient expertise in the field of shadow magic be able to identify it.

    [...]

    Not just him [it was not just Dhows whose "very existence was almost entirely purged from every record in the universe"]. The universe itself. There's a reason it stayed secret....records were destroyed after the last major conflict quite some time ago, and I can count on my paws the number of people who even knew the place existed up until this point.


    On Falerin Ardendor's staff:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin

    My staff is not sentient. I have owned sentient weapons they are a pain in the rear. I have several friends that are sentient weapons. They too are pains in the rear.

    So no the staff is a tool. Little more.

    The stone itself however.... is called "The" Decahedron

    Proper Article


    On the power of names:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin

    Dhow does not have a name. True or otherwise. He has assumed several aliases and titles. He is not hiding it he was never given one because he was not a being. The connecting thread to all of the fiction that you have mentioned is that names have power. This is certainly true in Diane Duane's young wizards series where language and in particular the spoken and written language known as "the Speech" which is the language of the Wizards not only describes things but defines them.

    Consequently in Duane's fiction speaking a true name not only gives you power over those whose name is known but also:

    • Altering a true name and speaking that in the Speech actually can change a being and redefine it.
    • Even accidentally misspeaking or writing a true name while casting as spell has the affect of definitively claiming that "alteration" is now the true name with all of the changes that that implies. If that is allowed to proceed the thing renamed is changed. Many lesser beings including younger wizards do not really have the power to resist being renamed in such a way and must protect their name from all but their most trusted friends to minimize the risk but even doing so not do so; and even the fundamental powers/deities such as the Lone Power are subject to such effects.


    The cosmology I assume for this mythoi is similar but more pragmatic. Many people have many names. They may have a true name as in some of these systems but for most individuals a true name is not even known to themselves. However there is the assumption that communication be it words or music has the power to shape and define. A factor that may play in to the Trumpha defining the word as boring for instance.... This is also why metamagic works as it redefines and reshapes the language of the spell or of mana and magic itself.

    Consider a teleport spell. One of the things one must label, name and define in a teleport spell is where you want to go. There are as many ways you could do this as their are grains of sand on an infinite beach. I could define the mountain as a fixed point in time and space. I could define the mountain as a certain elevation above see level at a certain latitude and longitude. I could define the mountain as a certain hut on its apex that I previously visited. I could define the mountain relative to those mountains around it. I could define the mountain by looking at where I want to go and while picturing the destination in mind clearly using a pronoun "THERE". All are names for the mountain and all have utility for different persons.

    In general in the last version with line of sight is safest to the caster because their mind body and what not is very clear what they intend. This is a reason why teleporting to an unknown location is much harder, in addition to risks attendant on the otherside the definition of where you want to go is more ambigous.

    Say you chose in your teleportation spell to define your destination as a certain height above sea level but the map you are working from added and extra zero throwing your height off by an order of magnitude. As you plummet to your "fatal death" on that mountain top you will no doubt consider yourself "cursed".

    Say the editor thought the trailing zero was an error and he omitted it. Now when you teleport you are only a tenth as high as you should be. When you are teleported inside the mountain if you are very lucky you end up in a cave or tunnel. If you are even more lucky the atmosphere there is breathable. In far more cases what occurs is you teleport inside either solid rock, or if you manage to pierce the mantle, magma. The results of this are plainly fatal. Either your cells squish down so your molecules evenly mix with the stone...rendering that body very dead. Or worse... one or more sets of the particles attempt to occupy the same space simultaneously. In which case neither will continue doing so; potentially quite explosively (thus what happens when the TARDIS transports inside of stone in The 11th Doctors first series, and given what the TARDIS is that has a very negative effect).

    Since all of these things are names, and labels that declare our intention it becomes apparent why we would want a "Name" for Dhows.

    Spells often involve rituals that speak and define what you want to change and how. A pseudonym or alias wont work nearly as well, and a false name or assumed name that is someone elses will likely affected the original individual not the one you intend.

    There are bodies of magic in classic D&D, and presumably an equal number on Lore that only act on beings and not on things. The need for a name it is implied for certain that in having that name Dhows is recognized as a being and not a thing.

    So yes in essence the effort is to recognize what Dhows has already done to himself with a christening, which consequently strips him entirely of the claim that he is a non-being and from there...

    You do the math.


    On Shadows:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Lord Barrius

    A shadow cannot normally survive in Lore unless it attaches itself to a body (with ElBhe being a unique exception). BUT if certain conditions exist, such as several large gaping holes where sealed gates used to be, then the magic of the shadow universe allows the creatures to survive within that gate's area of effect without attaching themselves to a body.

    They assume a variety of familiar forms because they are effectively "shadow selves" of those types of creatures. For example, a shadow werewolf likely has a corresponding werewolf on Lore that he is "bound" to, as a shadow self. But shadows can take any form they wish outside of a body. They just tend to select a form that matches their corresponding self due to restrictions placed on them by the universe itself.


    On Shadows:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Lord Barrius

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Traveler

    So every shadow creature is the shadow double of an actual creature on Lore. Interesting.

    Are the shadows still linked to the creatures they mirror? Are they affected by what happens to those creatures? For instance, if the Lorian creature a shadow is based on dies, does the shadow dissipate?

    Or are they related to the Lorian "originals" only in the moment of their creation and lead completely separated existances afterwards?

    They are bound to their other self. They weaken if their other self is weakened or vice versa while in the shadow universe, and they die if their counterpart dies. This is why most shadow creatures seek freedom from their realm....it frees them from these restrictions, allowing them to gain power on their own, and more importantly, to avoid having their fate bound to another person.


    On shadowstep:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Lord Barrius

    The method used by most shadow wielders is commonly referred to as a "shadowstep". It is precisely what it says: an individual melts into a pool of shadow and their physical body appears to "vanish", at which point they emerge from another shadowed location as if they had teleported. What is actually happening is that the shadow is functioning like a portal, allowing those with expertise in the field to "jump" from location to location pretty much instantaneously.

    Of course the technique is very limited for individuals with limited understanding or expertise. Ninjas and assassins, for example, know virtually nothing of the shadow universe or how the magic works, but are granted access through a long-standing agreement with LB's order. Those among his order would be the really "knowledgeable" ones and could make it work much more fancy for them (like using a shadowstep to go from one end of Lore to the other, instead of close-range shadowsteps like ninjas and assassins).

    Shadow magic in general has existed for a very, very long time in Lore. Most people stuck to Light or Dark magic to achieve similar effects, but shadow magic essentially became the pinnacle of both. But at their first onset, the techniques were generally unrefined and very dangerous. An improperly done shadowstep could mean that someone gets permanently lodged in a wall or something. It wasn't until things got organized under LB's predecessors that techniques became refined, and it wasn't until LB himself reformed the order later on that the techniques became available to other groups, such as those above. Such techniques are generally not trusted to just anyone, and they carry a cost.


    More on Dhows:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin

    Dhows has no other self...


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Lord Barrius

    He was born before the shadow universe began its grand attempt at shadow puppet theater.


    < Message edited by ArchMagus Orodalf -- 5/9/2012 21:06:09 >
    AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 4
    5/24/2012 17:06:47   
    Elryn

    Custodian (DF)


    A bit more on ArchMages.

    From the Potential of the ArchMagi I thread years ago:

    Kalanyr on Beleqwaya's research

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    Actual ArchMage Research represents Beleqwaya's notes on Mana Manipulation, the topic on which he earned his entry into the order of ArchMages, it is merely a pale imitation of the skills that Beleqwaya could teach and it reveals nothing of my specialisation, which is metamagic.



    On Mages

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    Silly Halo3, haven't you learnt yet that ancient lost secrets always trump modern ability ? Not to mention that those you call Mages appear to have based almost their entire set of abilities on some notes I haven't seen since I was inducted into the Archmages.



    On himself

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    I am not human, agelessness is a inherent property of my race. I would say it is a natural property but there is very little about us that is natural.



    Falerin

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin

    I have an understanding of many things. I am capable of doing much that an ArchMage does and possibly even education as one. Education generally does not count as interference so I could technically do so with impunity, though recent extensions of my service to Lore have freed me somewhat in regard to what I may generally may do anyway.



    Falerin on Caelestia

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin

    It is an entirely different plane of existence. A separate reality. It has its own nature deities and its own creator deity too. Two of them if one wants to be technical actually.



    Traveling through realities

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin

    Travel between alternate realities is far easier then you seem to think especially for individuals of my potentiality. I am quite well traveled. </ic> Alternate realities and travel between them in fact is a major part of the upcoming Bizarre Flecks saga.


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    Indeed, stepping between the worlds is easier for some of us than others. There are several of us travellers on LORE at this time. Of the Knights neither Aelthai nor myself are native to LORE. And many of the members of the Network who remain on LORE are not native to this reality either.



    Kalanyr on himself

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    Beleqwaya is Lorian. I do not hail from Caelestia. I differ from someone native to Caelestia in the same way I differ from someone native to Lore and that someone native to Lore differs from someone native to Caelestia, it is hard to quantify such things in terms that can be easily understood, some realities are very difficult to tell apart from an examination of a native.

    And from the ''What is Kalanyr thread, 2008
    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Kalanyr

    Kalanyr is a planar wanderer from outside LORE (in the magical plane travelling sense not the Sci-Fi one) he's an Archmage and reasonably competent at pretty much anything else you could name, he's lived a very long time even as elves reckon things but he's never really focused on anything in particular (except magic to some extent but even that only for decades at a time here and there). He's not an elf though, he's a nature spirit from outside LORE, and he bears a certain resemblance to elves as a result.

    He also thinks you have good fashion sense if you like his robes.



    AQ  Post #: 5
    8/28/2012 3:09:10   
    Cataclysm
    The fanciest of moustaches


    Via Alina, on Necromancy, 8/28/12

    quote:

    [00:00] <Alina> In AE's necromancy, it involves the spirit orbs.
    [00:00] <Alina> The pan-Lore lore on that was recently clarified.
    [00:00] <Cataclysm> So that's canon for all of AE's timelines, AQ, DF, MQ, and AQW?
    [00:01] <Alina> Yep.


    I'm going to put this in AQ, DF, and MQ's, since it's already known for AQW.
    AQ DF MQ  Post #: 6
    12/2/2012 13:02:39   
      Dwelling Dragonlord

    ArchKnight AQ / OOC / L&L


    Artix, 11/28/2012 20:13:59

    quote:

    I.) The Slugwrath name
    This is not actually the correct surname... the actual name is never allowed to be spoken. The real name is a secret and merely speaking the word would bring about unended horrors. As a venomous joke, a word that is similar to the actual name, "Slugwrath" is used throughout the games.

    II.) Order of the Games
    Remember, we build our games backwards. Mostly to be crazy and odd. Here is how the timeline goes
    1st MechQuest (5000 years in the past)
    2nd DragonFable (5 years in the past)
    3rd AdventureQuest (Current)
    4rthish-itgetsweird.... AQWorlds (All of the timelines merged into one due to Galanoth slaying the Eternal Dragon of Time. So, also current.)

    III.) Drakath's Story
    Drakath is by far the most interesting character in our universe. His Father is indeed the evil King/Kingadent Slugwrath who was overthrown by the warrior who is now known as the good King Alteon. As a deposed Prince, Drakath was bitter and believed the throne was rightfully his. So he formed the Darkwolf Bandits and attempted to take back his Kingdom by force. His terrible acts lead him to serving the DoomKnight Sepulchure. This made for an exceptionally odd combination if you know Sepulchure's backstory. Sepulchure used Drakath as a tool to recruit a cast of villains who previously served Drakath's Father (Xan, Sekduat, the Ospray Cove Pirates, etc.) Let it be known that Drakath had many opportunities to give up his thirst for power and side with good -- and destroy all of the forces of evil in the process. One of the many chances he has included the missed romance between himself and the Ranger, Robina. There is no small irony that if Drakath had followed his heart, and it had lead to marriage... he would have likely ended up as King due to Robina's secret double identity as the Princess Victoria. (I do not think this story has ever been told... if not, I hope it is one day.)


    Ultimately, when victory was in the grasp of the evil forces, Drakath betrayed Sepulchure. The horrifying sequence of events that followed turned Drakath into Dragon of Darkness (which was supposed to line up with his role as the Darkness Dragon in the classic AdventureQuest) Drakath was killed. Well... he should have died. Something else happened. You will not find out exactly what until the end of AQWorld's overarching storyline. But he was "chosen" and became the Champion of Chaos.
    AQ DF AQW  Post #: 7
    12/21/2012 7:17:16   
    ArchMagus Orodalf
    Member

    NOTE: Some of the following material has been expurgated, so don't bother trying to find the original thread.

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 12/19/2012 16:32:25

    The`Galin's father? Clearly the Helifino winds have corrupted your mind as Galian has been dead for a very long time... far too long for him to just be brought back as undead.

    Then again...

    There IS someone who uses that name in a future quest just not one that has anything to do with Frostval.


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 12/20/2012, 16:22:27

    Necromancy tends toward darkness above all other elements and is indeed the normal form. There are some odd exceptions to this, generally either very powerful necromancers., or very powerful mages who understand enough of the underlying principles of magic to mimic necromancy in other ways. Undead themselves however can definitely be multielemental even if the magic used to bring them back to life is Darkness.

    The reasons for necromancy tending toward darkness are diverse and will be explored in the future rather fully. Among other reasons are: Guilt by Association and the fact that the Mythos of Lore specifically says that it was the Darkness Lord who introduced negative life to the Lorian system for the first time. This war will not explain these things in too much detail but they are a topic of much discussion and several of our authors are very interested in this area. Myself, and LB, especially have considerable interest here.

    In other words. Necromancy is not a form of Cryomancy. A necromancer is a mage who specializes in magic that manipulates life force. A cryomancer is a mage that specializes in cold based magic. But mages can have multiple specializations and powerful magics can emulate off element magical effects or create the same end result via a different path.

    A weak analogy can be made to travel. I can travel from my home to new york city in a hundred different ways. All of those ways lead me to new york but each has its own challenges benefits and liabilities.


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 12/20/2012 22:53:28

    The Brilhado Lich's necromancy is darkness based however, just like most necros.

    Its being however is contradictory in that a light based demon was reborn in darkness... but spirit ane light are only as related as spirit and darkness... The Hadeni being pointed at here... Frigidere not withstanding...

    Well that and that she serves the Lady of Light... but many darkness based undead actually do... not so oddly really knowing the backstory


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/3/2013 11:06:50

    Paladins are not necromancers at all.

    What has been said is that necromancy is magic that effects life force (more correctly this is actually spirit energy) and that healing is likewise magic that effects lifeforce (spirit energy). It is two sides of the same coin. Therefore in a sense the healing magic of a paladin can be considered a form of necromancy. However to go with other things said elsewhere a paladin's healing is focused entirely in a positive spirit direction. A necromancer's magic is in most all cases (with very very limited exceptions) focused in a negative one.

    As LB said this will be clarified very much as part of both the coming war and whatever releases we do subsequent to it.


    Forsaken are not Undead.

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/12/2013 15:58:26

    All Lorian Zombies are of the variety introduced by Kabroz. They are beings who are alive, technically, but whose mind, will, and or soul has been extracted. I.e. More like a Voodun Zombi than a George Romero Zombie. They may well be on borrowed time but they are not undead in the classical sense at all.

    In other news. A forsaken being too is undead only in this second not really quite undead sense, and we will be eliminating the term undead as applied to Forsaken too. It is a misnomer.

    I will not give more specific clarity then that because as LB indicates active discussion is ongoing and specific details may change. Our purpose however is to make our terms unambiguous.

    Which is also why it was made clear recently that Hadeni, also are not correctly undead. (Though Hadeni are closer than zombies. Hadeni are at least negative anima).

    While the creation process to make a zombie may have some similarities to necromancy it is almost assuredly NOT necromantic.


    On the nature of simulacra:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/12/2013 16:04:34

    Golems are artificially created beings with positive anima.


    On the nature of life, death, and positive/negative spiritual energy (aka "anima"):

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/12/2013 16:19:28

    Life and Death exist on an axis. Undeath can be examined linguistically to mean not dead. But it has been defined from a necromantic perspective to mean "Weakly negatively alive". At the far end of the Negative and Life axes would fall the Hadeni. At the Far end of the positive and life access [sic] most other beings in the Lorian system. If we were to use axes at all, and there clearly are spectra here, My own assumption is that there is just a regular set of coordinate axes. Dead at one End Living at the other and Positive and Negative. With things that were never alive to begin with falling in the dead center at the origin. This does allow that there are things that are neutral in terms of anima but still alive or dead in terms of life and death, or things that are netural in terms of life and death but still possessing an anima. Sentient Weapons of most types probably fall into the latter category (though arguably some might fit the former better).


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/20/2013 11:36:48

    Undead and necromancers can be multi-elemental. But for all intents and purpose they are effectively tied to Darkness as strongly as the Paladins are to light.

    It bears noting that Light and Dark are not elements in the classic sense at all indeed Light is merely a form of energy. A primal form but a form. Darkness in that sense is merely the absence of light. But I have repeatedly denied that Darkness in this sense is a mere nil. It is an actual negative.

    What light and darkness represent elementally and to all beings is inately tied to the anima concept we have noted repeatedly and the spirit orb concept we have noted before.

    All that is evil is not dark. All that is light is not good. But all that is negatively anima IS Dark at least in part. And all that is positive anima IS Light at least in part. (Capitalization is deliberate).


    Correcting misconceptions:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/14/2013 9:50:29

    Here's an interesting tidbit for you however. People have some wrong ideas about a few other related things in game. For instance the Moglin Dewlok. Dewlok, has no necromancy whatsoever and was never a necromancer.

    Frigidere's "Zombies" were undead, but they are in the category of being we will be renaming to avoid ambiguity.

    So yes Frigidere's zombies are ALL examples of Undead being rendered non-undead again by expert necromancy. Reversing necromancy entirely is something Zorbak, and in Drakath's case (Diviara) are among the few necromancers with the knowledge or ability to do.


    Falerin discussing *spoilers*

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/14/2013 10:17:13

    Most of the order of the mantle are skilled necromancers in general, but few are as skilled as the two you name [Dark Madder and Diviara].
    They order is after all mimicing Erebus who is a master, but Erebus is also an odd duck. A very very odd duck. His necromancy works in a manner different than any Lorian necromancer. No necromancer on Lore or in this system could fully copy him regardless of power, only emulate. His necromancy is.... a spoiler.


    No further comment on either section I am afraid. As both questions are highly relevant to future events. [The second section is the question of the link between Positive/Negative anima and Creation/Uncreation as demonstrated by the Bizarre Flecks.]


    Clarification on the Cold and Tytoa:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/14/2013 12:42:29

    The Cold is a psychic attack. One can focus such via any number of things. However I think it should be reasonably assumed that what the Tytoa actually breathe is substance that acts as a neurochemical and thus amplifies emotional effects. I.e. they are not breathing the Cold per se. They are breathing something that both mimics the cold and that makes its application int more traditional sense exceedingly easy. From an outward and casual inspection however, this would look very much like them literally breathing it.


    Random fact: "Revenant" is the term for "Holy Undead".

    Spirit Orbs, the Shield of Lorithia, and the Orb of Creation:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/20/2013 (multiple posts)

    It [the concept of Spirit Orbs] has been mentioned in these threads and in several other ones recently on the topic of undeath and necromancy including where the Hadeni and Frigidere were concerned, and implied in game and elsewhere. However their nature and presentation in AQ is different from that of AQW in some ways that very much matter. We are a different world. They are none the less clearly interrelated concepts.

    All of my answers concern AQs representation of them and say NOTHING about their representation elsewhere especially in AQW where they are a critical part of things at the moment.

    Tralin was given two devices by Lorithia. One was the Prime Creation Orb. The other was the shield of Lorithia. Events in game have lead some to conclude based on dialog they are the same they are not.

    One of them was a greater spirit orb. One was actually an orb of Creation energy itself.

    Spirit orbs integrate elements as part of creation and direct the flow of life directly.

    They might be best undestood as orbs of elemental life. But as this thread and elsewhere has made clear. Life can go in multiple directions. And these orbs can direct life in much the same way.

    [...]

    The Shield of Lorithia does does reverse magic... but only very specific magic...
    And magic the Brilhado in paritcular as light demons are concerned about.

    The shield of Lorithia is a Greater Spirit orb... so it very directly can reverse Necromantic effects in the broad sense though it would depend on interactions with the Prime Orb of Light and Darkness for this... Or else a greater source than either... like say A Prime Creation Orb...

    Even in the lesser sense however it can reverse Necromancy or Healing as it manipulates anima directly.

    [...]

    It [the Shield of Lorithia] depended upon it [the Prime Creation Orb] for its great efficacy.

    I was not stating it did not help your argument. I was stating it would not help your understanding. Since it does contain unreliable elements of narration AND...

    It is not even clear those two segments refer to the same object. What if the former is referring to the creation orb and the latter is very much to the Shield Itself...

    Furthermore, even assuming they are the same:

    Even in the absence of the Creation Orb... the brilhado in particular and necromancers in general might not like him having the Shield of Lorithia. But the latter is far less of a concern to the Network as a whole, who largely acted under Ryuusei Cartwright's imperative. One manipulates the fabric of life and death. One is essentially channeled Raw Creation of the sort lost at the deep.

    Neither is something they want in Tralin's hands... only the latter is something the Network as the whole were concerned about... but the Network necromancers... not so much


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    I understand. The Prime Creation Orb can reverse certain magics (hence Tralin's using it to reverse the Drakel magics), and the Shield of Lorithia can be used to manipulated anima and defy necromantic effects (which, as you said, the Demons were concerned about).


    Your last approximation was Cookie Worthy


    On the soul:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/21/2013 12:07:25

    Soul... is a term that cannot be firmly defined. It is the part of an individual that makes them an individual. Some would equate the soul with the mind. Some would say it is the combination of the mind and the anima. Some would say that a damaged soul can heal and in some instances like a starfish develop two daughter souls.

    Soul is meaningless in a technical context. It is a term fraught with faith based meanings.

    For Forsaken, When we talk of ripping out the soul what is being ripped out/damaged is clearly the anima, which carries with it the echoes and memories of life but the mind clearly remains behind. The annunaki may remember the life memories of their host but the damaged host does not forget them. This shows the problem with calling a soul either mind or anima. It is at once more than and less than either. Therefore a Forsaken has a damaged and weak anima but it is a positive one not a negative one like those of true undead. It is like undead in that it is weakened however.

    As to Undead themselves, the degree of weakening varies, furhtermore most undead are not fixed at the state of undeath. Undead can and do still develop. Some positively (developing new abilities, thoughts, etc) some negatively (Decaying as a result of the damage and susceptibility their state induces).

    Skeletons for instance likely start as animated corpses but due to infections and other invasions in their weakened life state literally develop gangrene and other diseases that cause the progressive wasting of their flesh. This could be quite horrible as it implies they initially maintain sentience but that it literally rots away from them.

    A lich by contrast continues to evolve and study magically, and maintains strong sentience, they can mostly hold infection and decay at bay, though some choose not to for various reasons, as flesh can be not only a strength but a liability with flesh comes pain for instance. A Lich will develop a relatively strong negative anima over time and in extreme cases this anima likely grows even stronger then a natively born Hadeni.

    This shows the problem of simple definitions. The matter is not simple. It is as amazingly complex as the underpinnings of life and genetics themselves. And it occurs in just as much variation (that is to say infinite). It is as much the process that defines undeath as the state of being.

    One last thing. I hinted at it earlier. Undead can become undead from one of two states. Living or Dead. Either can be made to produce undead without necessarily passing through the other. A living being converted to undead directly is far more likely to be relatively intact. There anima is merely inverted imperfectly. Contrast with a dead being brought back to life in the negative anima state. Who likely remains as damaged as their corpse had become.


    Anima

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/21/2013 12:16:46

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    "Anima" = "Spiritual Energy". What is "energetic" about it? What does it mean to have a large amount of positive or negative anima? Can it be converted, say, into elemental mana? Non-elemental mana?


    Not on a one to one basis but there is a strong correlation to elemental Light and elemental Darkness.

    A positive anima being is imbued with a large quantity of elemental Light relative to their Darkness. Whereas for a negative anima being the reverse is true. However it must be stressed that ALL beings have all elements to some degree with the exception of elemental ones be they pure elementals, para-elementals, or quasi-elementals.


    Lichs

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/21/2013 12:16:46

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Mordred

    How would a lich increase their negative anima if they keep splitting it and putting pieces into phylacteries? And what is anima? Beyond spirit energy; is it the energy that animates the body?


    Mordred. Think of it like a athlete who is using blood doping. They remove a portion and allow the damage to heal and regenerate. Then they remove another potion.

    Techincally they could also then recombine and reintegrate these pieces and they would have more anima then is normal for their state. Using that to their advantages. Liches can and do absorb their phylacteries for just such purposes in fact.

    Of course this means if a lich has enough of them and reabsorbs enough of them he could be quite powerful indeed.... but there is a distinct risk in that that the lich overloads on negative anima and by consequence Dark aligned mana. Having more mana then a vessel can hold is bad for the vessel.

    This is likely how some, though not all sentient Wights form. A Wight is like a wraith but with a far greater degree of power and intellect. Think of it as a wraith and ghost in one. They have burned their flesh away entirely. To include their bones and they loose corporeality.


    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/21/2013 12:32:49

    Generally a Lich becomes a Lich by being a necromancer to begin with and using necromancy on their self.

    [...]

    How... like how does the physical process of conversion work. That is beyond explanation on the forums and way beyond scope of this thread. He uses magic to alter the natural flow of anima in his body and to... to parody doctor who

    "Reverse the Polarity of the Neutron Flow"

    This is far from any sort of technical explanation. Magic is a science that works under defined rules but in most cases the rules have not been defined for the Dhe Ehmn in enough detail to give a step by step guide. And even if I could I would not.


    Wraiths and ghosts

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/21/2013 12:57:42

    Ghosts and Wraiths are complex. What they are is non-corporeal negative anima beings. Not everything requires flesh to live. Ghosts can be brought back by a necromancer as can wraiths, but both can also arise from a very strong will to live. Refusal to accept death, due to unfinished business can alter the being by dint of the force of their will alone into a weakly negatively animated being without substance or form.

    The anima sticks around and does not dissipate or pass on to its next phase. The result is an apparition.

    This is in essence a very minor act of will working. Which is to say not magic but Alteration of the sort practiced by the Dhe Ehmn. Willing it to be so to the point reality complies under force of will alone.

    [...]

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    Then when one "attacks" a Wraith or Ghost, they damage their anima rather than any sort of physical sign of life?


    Since wraiths and ghosts lack corpus to damage the damage must be to the anima directly yes.


    Healing

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/21/2013 12:35:33

    Healing is complex and can work via multiple different avenues. A moglin's inate healing is far different from a werewolves regeneration from a spell casters healing spells. A healing spell typically reinforces the anima to a degree that it delays disincorporation and literally accelerates natural regenerative processes. However since it does so by reinforcing anima and since that is generally in a specific direction. Reinforcing a negative beings positive anima has the net effect of cancelling their anima causing damage rather than restoration.

    Magical healing is therefore in most cases a specified form of the more broad sense of the term Necromancy but not of the more specific sense employed by necromancers. As such magical healing is very much tied to spirit orbs as well.


    Immortality

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/21/2013 12:51:41

    Immortality is far more common then most think... Many beings are functionally immortal. Jelly Fish for instance. Many Bacterium. Cancer Cells. But given enough sudden damage or disruption the life force stops.

    Likewise there are magics that simply quench the anima instantly with no physical damage at all. If such occurs life ceases. Finger of Death in D&D for instance works much that way.

    Some magics directly interrupt biology as well stopping cell division or neurological processes. These things would also enduce death in a biologically immortal being.

    Anima immortality is more complex than any of these.

    Also death occurs not simply from weakened damage but also from senescence and subsequent apoptosis. Programmed cellular death. The body chooses to die. This is because the longer something lives the cumulatively greater chance it develops an error in one of its mechanisms... leading to something like cancer. Which is just that cells that stop dying when they should.

    Death is a vital part of life.

    I suspect waters of immortality is a rather potent healing potion or else a very powerful mutagen. I cannot firmly answer which. If the former yes it acts as you suggest constantly regenerating the lost and damaged parts including lost parts of itself.

    Whereas if it is the later it actually fundamentally alters the being and induces biological immortality but sudden accidents would still abridge it.

    [...]

    Aging is not damage sir. The Telemorase example is way too simplex. Aging is becoming chronologically older. Cells will literally destruct even if they are wholly and completely healthy just because their time has come.

    Think of it like a hardware manufacturer.

    Planned obsolescence.

    [...]

    @Edit: Another way of putting my point is that loss of Teleomeres leading to the breakdown of chromosome end caps and their subsequent damage via replication is but a single source of senescence.

    [...]

    Senescence is absolutely aging. Specifically it is biological aging. Not merely chronological aging. Now some of aging is damage. Mutation however is NOT damage. Mutation is mutation. Some of it is even advantageous.

    Reversing or strengthening anima would have ZERO effect on reversing mutations. If the Mutant King or Visia had gotten you and altered you... no amount of the sort of anima based healing we are discussing would repair what occured.

    And yeah... Death always wins... that is the point. Death is a necessary life process. Just as uncreation is a neccesary creative process. Think what would occur if death did not.

    Now in dying some beings become immortal in an anima sense. Some skip death and go directly to that state. Generally such beings though have other complex mechanisms to still replicate the necessary and advantageous parts of death...

    Consider myself. I am not biologically immortal. I die. I have died. I have disincorporated. But in spite of all of that I am immortal in an anima sense and my level of power (anima and otherwise) is such that I can bring myself back from the dead creating a pseudo biological immortality. Most beings are in fact immortal in an anima sense to some degree or another. It is merely that most do not simply return.

    Though on Lore the Reaper as servitor of Death does death's will most cleverly... living beings die and return to life and die again.

    I have said it before and I am sure it is in the quote archive somewhere but what powers death is not the dead. It is not their anima either, not directly. Not their souls. Though Death has been known to employ all of them. What empowers the demi-power, and lesser or greater powers in other realms that fill the same position, is the act of dying itself. No energy transition is perfect when a being dies energy is released. Only some remains with the being. Which is why a ghost cannot by force of will just resurrect their body. They lose anima and mana and dying. Where does that go...

    Kalanyr has spoken to part of it. I will speak to the rest... the Anima goes to death. He reaps it. Harvests it. Absorbs it as his own.

    Lore is to death a huge self-sufficient energy station. And the number of constant death, life, and redeath that occurs leads him to immense power.

    In some pantheons death value their position and its importance and thus abhor returning from death to life (in negative or positive directions). On Lore it very much appears that Death does not care about the functional necessity of his position. Rather he likes the infinite free meal he gets ...


    On Death the Demipower's jurisdiction:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 1/21/2013 13:27:49

    The answer to jurisdiction is complex. Jurisdiction is defined by pantheons and agreement. The elemental lords for instance have jurisdiction over several different Lores but not all of them, as was shown in WF where a very different set act as Lorithia's creation. That different set is arguably positional analogs, but it is far from directly analogs. And their power level is according to current canon strictly speaking greater than Death. Though there is arguably a bit of discrepancy here. Their Station may be higher than death but presumably they too are subject to him to a degree. Therefore in actual potentiality they are likely weaker than death singularly. It is only in position and in their combination they exceed him.

    [...]

    That said. Death 2.0 is still I think a servitor. It may be to the demipower of this lore or it may be to his equivalent elsewhere. It may even be that he serves the station and thus he answers to both depending on where he does the reaping. The last I think is even the most probable.


    Pantheons intra-universe:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor,

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    In other words, different planets in a single universe could have different pantheons.


    Quite assuredly. In the Lorian system the strong current evidence is most of them have Lorithia as creator but even that is not guaranteed as universal and I can in fact verify it categorically IS NOT universal. There are planets in the universe of Lore where Lorithia and The`Galin have no authority either.


    Undead cannot be Paladins (and vice versa):

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    The question is as to why being Undead and a Paladin are incompatible.


    They are incompatible though. It is more then just the prohibition. It relates to the elemental nature of the majority of undead compared to that of paladins. And the fact that Undead act as negative anima, whereas a Paladin functions entirely with the positive anima branch of the "necromatic" part of ley lines of lore, an important point in whats to come actually.

    The fact that the current order has come to treat undead as a whole as evil is related to this fact too actually.

    [...]

    No[further] comment on NDA grounds and on the grounds LB might kill me... horribly.


    quote:

    "Evidence exists your highness that the limited elemental cascade is evoking sentience."

    "What?" Tralin asked the scholar from the school of thought startled by this unexpected pronouncement.

    "The gathering charged energy has resulted in that energy itself beginning to take living form. However the elemental annihilation that is occurring means that which is being created is neutral anima in nature."

    "Living energy, but without direction, that is the basis for the formation of creatures like Salamanders and Water Weird, correct?"

    "Yes your highness..."

    "So what you are saying is that what is being produced is an non-e.. er... a neutral el..."

    "The words fail your highness, but yes I believe your understanding is correct. This energy is gathering over the major conflict zones. Eventually it will reach a tipping point, this tipping point is likely your described "explosion". At that juncture the cascade will be unleashed and manafest... er manifest in some manner.

    "One takes it in a manner not propitious for living beings of either anima."

    "One can only conjecture your highness, however, I personally would avoid being anywhere close to the impact zone. I do not particularly think it would be healthy even for other living neutral anima beings, as such beings generally have a strong elemental charge to go with their lack of spirit energy. This being, in so far as it can be called a being at all, is spirit that has lost all elemental affinity."

    "A non-being? This really does have an untoward ammount of similarities to the Shadow Universe doesn't it."

    "It does majesty but it is decidedly unlikely to follow an identical course because the area of effect is more contracted and because the elemental affinities is being lost. Whereas Erebus maintained his own."


    Ley lines/core (not necessarily canon):

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 2/16/2013 20:27:36

    This is a rough developer explanation. It is not a firm canonical statement of anything. But one might compare mana core of lore is something like a giant battery. There are circuits both inwardly and outwardly from that battery. Some of the specific circuits related to a specific subset of magic have burned out from being overloaded. Dark and Light mana can still be drawn, that does not rely on those specific circuits, and as with in electronics a pathway can be constructed to route around the damaged circuitry, but that is not simple it will take time and not everyone will be able to just draw on these new pathways; it must be relearned, hence the in canon fact that both classes will be majorly revamped.

    Undead themselves largely are unaffected by this change incidentally. As would be creatures like the Hadeni. They draw on differing avenues then a necromancer or paladin trying to manipulate life.


    Confirmation of the precise powers of the Gauntlet that Celestra wields:

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 5/10/2013 10:27:51

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    What's stopping Celestra from simply re-creating Ryuusei by using her Gauntlet to cut an exact copy of him out of Cartwright?


    The gauntlets can create exact current temporal duplicates only they split one into two. They cannot modify any aspect of the one in that process. If Celestra were to do what you suggest to Cartwright, assuming Cartwright were to sit for it. The result would be identical to that effect seen in Drakel Cube P for Jano. Two Cartwrights. The second would not be Ryuusei, it would be an entirely new temporal twin with the full memories and experiences of Cartwright and deviating from the original only AFTER the point of its creation.


    On Amorality

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: Falerin Ardendor, 5/10/2013 10:27:51

    quote:

    ORIGINAL: ArchMagus Orodalf

    Also, just in general... when did Cartwright decide on a policy of amorality (when was it indicated explicitly in-game aside from the Salvation quest) and what are the specifics of his position? They seem to be throwing a lot of words around regarding this topic, but not a lot of concrete ideas...


    Amorality has a very distinct meaning. It means the practice and belief that morals are irrelevant, that actions should not be based on morals. When Absolix first returned cartwright clearly indicated his intention to kill Absolix and ressurect in hopes of having him become an amoral agent.

    Salvation delineates this but it should be pointed out that Absolix himself (purposefully) uses the term incorrectly there. Absolix's position is against immorality not amorality. Ryuusei on the other hand argues a very clear amoral line. This is in direct keeping with his characterization since his return in The Restoration which while far less malign than before his abandonment has never been particularly benevolent.

    quote:

    Absolix: The pupils there get ample time for social interaction as well. Which can be enjoyable. However, I am not here to discuss any of that with you.
    Absolix: You must atone for your transgressions.
    Ryuusei: I am sorry to hear you feel that way. I, on the other hand, do not. You see, some of us are BEYOND transgressions. YOU included.


    This is in part the reason why Ryuusei seeks to teach amorality. The other part is in reproof for Absolix's wrongheaded ideas about what amorality means.

    < Message edited by ArchMagus Orodalf -- 5/10/2013 12:09:58 >
    AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 8
    4/26/2014 15:04:34   
      Dwelling Dragonlord

    ArchKnight AQ / OOC / L&L


    Eukara on the mysterious entity seen in the quest where <spoiler>. 3/20/2014
    quote:


    The being in the background can only be seen by her.

    But, someone else on Lore can feel the presence.


    Eukara on Xov and the Truphma regarding <spoiler>. 3/22/2014

    quote:


    The Truphma HAVE killed. They've destroyed whole worlds because of resistance. That's been established in game for a long time. This past quest SPECIFICALLY made note that XOV herself hadn't killed anyone personally. Or at least can't remember doing it.
    AQ DF AQW  Post #: 9
    7/28/2014 5:04:24   
      Dwelling Dragonlord

    ArchKnight AQ / OOC / L&L


    Lord Barrius on liches. 7/26/2014 11:57:45

    quote:

    Well the thing is, from a lore standpoint, the original "liches" weren't really all that much like actual liches.

    Really the only features that our original liches had in common with traditional ones is that you had to die in order to become one. They weren't visibly powerful when compared with their necromancer counterpart, they didn't look at all like a lich (I often joked that the old lich art looked more like a vampire wearing Ribbonmancer armor), they die MUCH too easily (a lich is typically pretty close to immortal, thanks to the power of magical soul constructs known as phylacteries), and they really don't inspire much fear when you run into one. They were pretty "meh" overall.

    A lich is supposed to be a master of undeath, the sort of creature that you fear will inevitably be at the helm of a large undead army or will be guarding the chamber of an ancient tomb. They command other undead, they wield necromancy with hundreds of years of experience (if not more), and they are almost impossible to permanently kill off since they can just retreat back to their phylactery and resurrect themselves. They're a big deal.

    Thus, the sheer ease by which players became a lich in the game originally has me thinking that the old method of becoming a lich is probably more of a half-measure than anything else, a good attempt at achieving that legendary status, but not quite reaching the full pinnacle. With so many people using the necromantic ley lines at once, combined with the fact that the ley lines were generally never really a power source that can be fully controlled, it probably got awfully hard to obtain enough power and control to achieve a full lich status, resulting in the types of liches you saw in the past.

    However, now that the necromantic ley lines are gone, and the Paladin Order is dwindling in size, all of these more ancient liches are starting to come out of hiding, seeing an opportunity to make their move and secure more power in the fragmented environment of the Necromancers....
    AQ DF AQW  Post #: 10
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