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Why people should stop complaining about variums nerf~

 
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12/22/2012 21:55:54   
ReinXI
Member

Hello all you forumites who are currently reading this post. The reasoning for this post is to point out why it is stupid and is just utter
nonsense as to why you continue to complain about variums "nerf" and possible reasons for this sad behavior.

Reason one ~ not understanding an appropriate F2P model
This stems from people not having experience with the f2p model that a lot of mmorpgs use. I will use one of my favorite j-mmorpgs that in all honesty is in a way a
much more complex version of ed's pvp model. In the game atlantica online the game takes place in a heavily pvp based world there's multiple servers that each have
a competitive pvp league as well as there being a place for people from "every" server to go and face each other for the right to be titled as one of the best. The games
combat is also very similar to ed as it's a turn based strategy game. ( in each fight you control a main w/ 8 mercenaries as your battle team ) and they even have modes
where you can have 3 v 3 fights. This game also is full of things a p2p player to buy but yet some of the best players in the game are completely f2p. How is this possible
you may ask? a f2p being better than someone who puts thousands! of dollars into the game and there on equal footing? it's because anything you can buy in the item mall
you can purchase in game for in game currency. So you have the p2p who purchase it all and get good quick and the people who work for extended amounts of time to become
good as a f2p. The point is paying to win is not right and will never be right. And this example is a game that can claim much more money much quicker than this one.

Reason two ~ Corrupted sense of entitlement
Believing you belong on top just because you payed the most, this is also known as "social Darwinism" ( I believe? ) and that it stems from the ideal
that The rich are meant to be on top and the poor should "stay" poor in relation to this game it would be Varium should stay on top and f2p should be stuck
at the bottom. Just because you payed money into this game you believe it gives you the "right" to be better than other people and is that not arrogance at it's
finest? You should be entitled to something yes but what your entitled to is the fact you helped a company make a game for everybody to enjoy.

Reason three ~ Fear of falling from power
People who's entire battle records stems from having varium enhanced weapons and the ideal that "there superior" and that they never had to use there brain
in any fights to make a build as they just moved on from build to build racking up wins. These people would be terrified if the game of money suddenly became a
game of intelligence would they not? the idea that since there not clever strategists and they made up for it by the sheer overwhelming power of varium is going to
be vanishing.

I could go one but the above two points seem to make up the majority of "anti-fairness" players so I will leave it at that.

This game is moving forward and changes will have to be made if it is going to last game wise. Yes you may have payed $$$ to get an advantage but face it did you really expect it to last
forever? Just deal with the losses and move on with your life think of buying varium as an "investment" no your not getting stock in the company but you are helping it grow
and become better as investments do to increase the customer base/ player base. Sometimes moves are made that make some investors unhappy so they pull there funding
want to know what happens when that happens though? they find new investors people who like where the company/game is going and those new investors will take the place
of those lost.

So I suppose the true point of this post is to just get over yourselves you know who you are. And please keep the comments civil and not a bunch of trolling flame-war ridden trash

P.S. yes I am a varium player yes I have spent a good chunk of $$$ on this game for various reasons most of which was I like the promo weapons and wanted them/ supporting a company
that's work I enjoy seems fair enough.

Edit ~ P.S.S as goldslayer has put in several threads keeping a 3-4 stat + on varium gear does seem fair enough since that will really only give you say 3-4 def 5-6 resistance as it stands if
every point is put into a defensive stat so that's not to big a difference.


< Message edited by ReinXI -- 12/22/2012 22:26:24 >
Epic  Post #: 1
12/22/2012 21:59:37   
rej
Member

I shouldn't be replying to this topic, as I find it complete and utter nonsense, but I will anyway.

I spent a fair bit of money on this game. I spent that money to gain and advantage. That advantage is being reduced. This upsets me a little, and may cause some complaining. This is obviously justified.

There, I effectively wiped out your page-long argument. I hope you are happy.

_____________________________

It is difficult to enjoy your cake when your pants are on fire.
~Dragon of Time
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 2
12/22/2012 22:30:32   
Vypie
Member

The advantage you payed for was NEVER permanent.

You paid, thinking the game would never change it's varium system. But now it is going to change, and you are disappointed. But you should not feel like you have wasted money.
Your items would keep getting outdated anyways, and you would have to pay again, and again, just to stay on the tip of the wave. All the items bought with real money would eventually rot, and become worthless.
But this didn't prevent you from paying, right? You KNEW they were going to become useless.

Omega brings some sort of "Outdate", not by implementing stronger weapons, but by making these changes.
You wont be able, of course, to benefit from the power advantage again, but that doesn't mean you didn't make use of that advantage. You got those extra wins, more available builds, customization, etc.

Now, just adapt to the new changes... and ENJOY the game! (while saving some money in the process if you need)


Omega cuts the gap between players. Some are afraid of losing the extra power, but think about it:
This change makes the game easier to balance all around. The game will become FUN and competitive!

Would you rather pay to be better in a mediocre game with poor balance, or not feeling obligated to pay for a fun, balanced game?
Players should use the brain to win, not a flat boost from money.
Being equally balanced is a GOOD THING!

You can still use varium for convenience, speed, and UNIQUE special effects from promos!

< Message edited by Vypie -- 12/22/2012 22:31:50 >
Epic  Post #: 3
12/22/2012 22:37:46   
The Astral Fury
Member

We spent money "knowing" the kind of advantage that we would get , which was to have a large advantage over varuim players and to become alot stronger. This advantage has been around for a while so that's why we kept spending because we though this advantage was permanate and wouldn't go away. After so long of this advantage, they finially take it a way, is this fair to the players who spent so much money on this game and have kept it runnig. We spent varuim to be better than non- varuim payers and to win more. Now this has been taken away from us. So to thank the people who have kept your game runnig your gonna give the people who have contributed the least the same advantage, is that respectful to us? We spent money they didn't that's why there's a gap. People who spend money on a browser game should be better than the people that don't because that my friends is common sense. Is this how you repay us dev's you make all are money go to waste and buff the people who support you the least.

I don't want there do be a gap, but theres a reason there is one.

< Message edited by The Astral Fury -- 12/22/2012 22:46:33 >
DF AQW  Post #: 4
12/22/2012 22:43:52   
Mother1
Member

Vypie

Everyone isn't seeing the good of this. All most are looking at is most of power not the revival of old formally outdated items.

OP I can agree with you. The time of punching bags will come to an end in omega, and I for one am going to embrace it with open arms. It was because of all these extra enhancements that every creative build was nerfed into the ground, and unbalance arouse. Now that this change is happening the game can become truely balanced since the developers can now see what needs balancing and what is ok instead of what is ok for one group but OP for another due to extra stats.
Epic  Post #: 5
12/22/2012 22:46:57   
The Astral Fury
Member

We spent money "knowing" the kind of advantage that we would get , which was to have a large advantage over varuim players and to become alot stronger. This advantage has been around for a while so that's why we kept spending because we though this advantage was permanate and wouldn't go away. After so long of this advantage, they finially take it a way, is this fair to the players who spent so much money on this game and have kept it runnig. We spent varuim to be better than non- varuim payers and to win more. Now this has been taken away from us. So to thank the people who have kept your game runnig your gonna give the people who have contributed the least the same advantage, is that respectful to us? We spent money they didn't that's why there's a gap. People who spend money on a browser game should be better than the people that don't because that my friends is common sense. Is this how you repay us dev's you make all are money go to waste and buff the people who support you the least.

I don't want there do be a gap, but theres a reason there is one.
DF AQW  Post #: 6
12/22/2012 22:48:32   
Vypie
Member

The only players with a reason to complain would be those who bought varium items very recently, just before knowing the changes. Those players probably didn't make enough use out of the varium they spent. :(
They may feel ripped off because they could have just waited a bit longer for Omega, instead of spending money.
Epic  Post #: 7
12/22/2012 22:52:18   
The Astral Fury
Member

Vypie your not in a position to make that assuption.. The fact is people have spent alot of money on this game wether recently or in the past.
DF AQW  Post #: 8
12/22/2012 22:53:53   
One Winged Angel1357
Member


I would like to point out that as a cap player you are not paying for an advantage you are paying to be on equal footing with the majority of cap players and your advantage if diminished in Omega would actually increase because more F2P's, like myself, would be at the cap meaning a 3-4 point advantage would show a great advantage than the current 8-12 point advantage(which is only over lower level varium users and F2P's of any level)


To put this into a very simple question.
Would you rather have a small advantage over a large number of people or a large advantage over a small number of people?

< Message edited by One Winged Angel1357 -- 12/22/2012 22:56:31 >
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 9
12/22/2012 23:02:56   
Vypie
Member

@The Astral Fury
The money spent in the past gave you exactly what you expected. You got the power boost, and later it got outdated. It fulfilled it's purpose.

____

Every player who REALLY SUPPORT the game should want the game to become BETTER. And that's what is going to happen!
Thanks to every player who have invested money in this game, this can now become a reality!

But some players just support the power advantage, and don't care about the game evolution, because they were benefiting from it and don't want to give it away.

Do you really prefer to just win more, or actually play an AWESOME GAME?
I prefer to play a challenging, competitive Fun game, rather than being successful at an unbalanced game because I used money.

< Message edited by Vypie -- 12/22/2012 23:03:10 >
Epic  Post #: 10
12/22/2012 23:03:22   
The Astral Fury
Member

So wait I pay all that money to be strong for an limited time, who told me this? who said that varuim would be worthless later on and thats there no point in buying it becuase sure as heck the Dev's weren't saying don't buy varuim because in the end it was worthless. We thought it was permenant like most upgrades in games are that why we spent it), and non free players get to be just as strong forever without paying a dime while we have payed so much... uh logic? Dev's is this how you thank us?

< Message edited by The Astral Fury -- 12/22/2012 23:09:06 >
DF AQW  Post #: 11
12/22/2012 23:08:49   
Mother1
Member

@ Astral

It is because of said power boost that just about every build was nerfed into the ground. With all these extra stats non variums were made into punching bags and because so many non variums were losing to op builds with enhancements the staff saw this on the balance checker not to mention those same players complained and then the dreaded nerfs happened. Every build other then focus and strength due to extra enhancements overpowering them. While some moves were actually OP on their own it was more of the fact that these extra stats destroy builds that would have been ok if they weren't there in the first place.

So if you think about it you were paying to destroy the game in general.
Epic  Post #: 12
12/22/2012 23:19:29   
Vypie
Member

@The Astral Fury

quote:

So wait I pay all that money to be strong for an limited time, who told me this? who said that varuim would be worthless later on and thats there no point in buying it becuase sure as heck the Dev's weren't saying don't buy varuim because in the end it was worthless.

No one needs to be told about this... It is common knowledge that this game has been releasing stronger and stronger weapons over the time, rendering old weapons useless, eventually.

quote:

We thought it was permanent like most upgrades in games are that why we spent it

It's not permanent if it gets outdated....

quote:

And non free players get to be just as strong forever without paying a dime while we have payed so much... uh logic?

You paid for the advantages, and you got the advantages. Just because the system changes now, it doesn't mean you are losing anything. Paying didn't made you a special player with benefits.

quote:

Dev's is this how you thank us?

They thank your support by making the game BETTER, more balanced and fun.
You should thank them back. ;)
Epic  Post #: 13
12/22/2012 23:24:46   
The Astral Fury
Member

Lol how am I suppose to know about all this though I paided knowing the power boost I would get and that this was the permenate system of upgrading your character And I have people saying "you payed to be good then" I payed to be good all the time because most upgrades on games are permenate. Don't you dare tell me I payed to be good then no that won't cut it I expect an upgrade system to remain eminate and display the results given not change where it likes all my money spent was wasted.

I'm fine wth the system, but varuim players need a edge because this is real mney beng spent on a game a passive on a weapond won't cut it 3-6 reduced stat points on credit players on items may saistify this.

Please mind your language, this is a family friendly forum, thank you ~Lycus

< Message edited by Lycus -- 12/23/2012 10:30:53 >
DF AQW  Post #: 14
12/22/2012 23:39:40   
Vypie
Member

Do you understand the concept of an item becoming outdated?

Example:
When the level cap was 33, there were good, level 33 varium weapons. You bought one. Meanwhile, the level cap raises to 34, and eventually, 35! Now there are new, better weapons which are level 35, and have extra stats.
You buy the level 35 weapon to stay competitive, and your previous weapon in now useless because is weaker, compared to the new ones.
The level 33 weapon got outdated.

The money you spent on the first weapon did not give you a permanent advantage, because you don't use it anymore.

But does this mean you wasted varium? Should you get a refund for those old weapons? Or benefits for having paid?
NO. You benefited from the advantage for a while, just as intended!

< Message edited by Vypie -- 12/22/2012 23:40:08 >
Epic  Post #: 15
12/23/2012 0:47:44   
  Exploding Penguin
Moderator


All I can say that with the current system, stuff is extremely expensive (buying a gun/aux and fully enhancing it with around 8 slots can cost 20$ USD or somewhere around), but also unfair. Fighting a F2P player in 1v1 is almost a guaranteed win for the varium player unless luck is involved in extreme amounts, and it's just not fair to F2P players, much like how varium TLM tanks with health boosters is definitely not fair to two level 28s in jugg. With the varium "nerf" coming in Omega, things won't nearly be as unfair to f2p players, which is definitely a step forward.
Epic  Post #: 16
12/23/2012 9:55:36   
One Winged Angel1357
Member


quote:

Lol how am I suppose to know about all this though I paided knowing the power boost I would get and that this was the permenate system of upgrading your character


Wait so my Chaotic Cleaver that I bought back in Gamma is supposed to be a power boost over F2P's now at the tail end of Delta.

This is using your logic on my only varium purchase which is on my alt Max the Dark
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 17
12/23/2012 10:10:48   
kosmo
Member
 

Hi, i started playng this game before beta, and i never used varium weps, but i still enjoied this game alot. I didnt do that cause im poor, i did it just cause i wonted 2 proove ED that it is possible 2 be awesome and f2p at the same time.
But i relize that u need 2 much credits 2 be good whitout var , so this changes are really needed not only cause var r gonna get nerfed but even cause credits prices will criticaly go down. Dont forget that there is gonna be a huge nerf even on total stats and hp, so i guess that when Omega is gonna get relised u guys will have other things 2 complain about....
Epic  Post #: 18
12/23/2012 10:15:20   
One Winged Angel1357
Member


@Kosmo credit prices may not exactly go down but the unlimited NPC for credits makes that a moot point anyway because we can get all the credits we will ever need
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 19
12/23/2012 10:29:33   
Lycus
Legendary AdventureGuide!


Locking this up since this is only going to turn into flaming, as has already been shown. I will touch on the subject on hand first though:

I would firstly like to point out that anyone who has kept up with ED over the past months and have regularly read the DN's would have known that we have been trying to close the Varium/Non-Varium gap for quite some time now. It has been a project for quite a while now, since yes, Varium players pay for the running of the game, and we are incredibly grateful for that, but at the same time Non-Varium players also keep the game running, since without them, you guys would have no one to have an advantage over, nor would there be enough people to play the game. Now the main issue was that a lot of Free players were playing up to the point where Variums had most advantage, then simply just quitting the game. This is obviously not what we want. The only way to retain maximum players, which in the long run, means a much better game for you, is to close up the Varium/Non-Varium gap. As I have already stated, we have been aiming for this and many of the recent Non-Varium items have reflected this over the past few months. So you have had plenty of warning, so complaining about not having enough warning is not a great thing to do.

Secondly, what is currently happening is that quite a few players are choosing to ignore the positives and just moan about the negatives, it is to be expected since there are always some people who do it no matter what. Think about all those Varium weapons you have bought in the past that now sit helplessly in your inventory no longer used because they are old and no longer good enough. Theoretically you could look back at them all as wasted money, since you purchased them all with Varium which you payed for, and now they are just pointless since you cannot use them. We did not feel that was fair on any user who had done that. Any user who had purchase Beta Weapons, Founder Armour and Alpha Weapons just to have some good weapons for a sort amount of time. Any user who had purchase Varium to get the seasonal rares such as Azreal's Bane and the Eggzooka's. Any user who purchased anything in the past with Varium to have an advantage for a bit, but then never be able to use the item again. With the old model we realised that people were paying for a limited time advantage anyway, so saying that this release has made it unfair because only now is it a limited time advantage and that is not what you paid for does no make any sense. Since you were paying for a limited time advantage anyway. We thought this was not fair on you as a paying customer, so we are now allowing you to use ANY weapon you have purchase at ANY level. This means anything you buy is a permanent advantage, since you have:

1) Purchased it without having to work real hard to earn the credits.
2) Upgraded it fully without having to work real hard to earn credits.
3) You have a lot of rare weapons you can now use and show off that people will/may never get the chance to purchase again.

To me Varium players still have a big advantage, but at the same time, it is now a fair advantage. Varium is a huge time saver, as well as giving people rare weapons etc. that may not be achievable in any other fashion. Complaining that you no longer have an advantage, yet you now can use any weapon you previously purchased, can purchase and upgrade items without loads of time and effort, can purchase rare items no one else can and you can also class change, name change etc. so much easier, I feel that Varium players now have more of an advantage. Maybe not in a Over Powered, but in a sense that is fair for all, but Varium players still massively benefit.

So I think we are thanking you a lot by making every single purchase you have made in the past mean something, not just purchases that you made that month and after are no longer considered powerful, but every purchase you have ever made. We thought a lot about this system and there are huge benefits for all parties involved. It's all about not just looking at the disadvantages and yelling 'I hate it, I am no longer OP', it's about looking on what you do get out of it. You will hopefully then notice this change makes a lot of changes for the better. Especially since it will mean more players continue to play, and therefore more competition, more people to meet and a bigger community. The advantages I have stated in this big post are just the start of it.
AQ AQW Epic  Post #: 20
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