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RE: Azrael's Will

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4/1/2013 6:18:26   
odsey
Member

Ansh0,believe it or not the core is not op. I may not have the gun and aux, but I think its fine. Even I beat some of the azrael promo owner.
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 26
4/1/2013 10:18:05   
kosmo
Member
 

 in my opinion this skill can be quite unfair and not all classes or build r able 2 counter it. i think this core should be used only 2 gain a bit more additional dmg , but the real problem is the free turn WORM UP and COOL DOWN that u recive from using this core, onesly i found it unfair expecially when u face ur same build and ur opponent can use skills before u even when he went 2nd.
I know this skill is easely counterable in many ways, but trust me, not all builds can, not all classes can, and in my opinion this kills creativity.
Epic  Post #: 27
4/1/2013 13:19:21   
Sipping Cider
Member

I think having it do 0 damage is a perfect solution!

As a small buff for compensation, it should trigger color blast. This way the color blast gets a needed buff and azrael's will is slightly nerfed, but you can combo it with color blast!
Epic  Post #: 28
4/1/2013 13:24:48   
ansh0
Member

^That's not so bad.
Epic  Post #: 29
4/1/2013 14:42:44   
Ranloth
Banned


 Compensation is triggering Color Blast? What if I don't have the Bot, why should I not be compensated? Why should I be forced to use a Bot just to receive 'compensation'?
AQ Epic  Post #: 30
4/1/2013 14:57:36   
ansh0
Member

^It works for Omega weapons.

The passive works with Omega Yeti's only.

What if I don't have an Omega Yeti?
Epic  Post #: 31
4/1/2013 15:04:54   
Ranloth
Banned


 Bunny Bot is Easter item, Azrael is a promo. Omega promo has Bot included (Yeti) + themed for evolving.
AQ Epic  Post #: 32
4/1/2013 15:06:31   
Aqw22222
Member
 

 I think it should still do damage just maybe a % of normal damage so its not hitting like 45

instead of hitting 45 have it hit like 20 about 50% not 100%
Post #: 33
4/1/2013 15:06:46   
Sipping Cider
Member

@Trans

Since You could only get Azrael's Will with the 10k Varium Pack I assumed most people who have it can afford the bunny as well. And as AnshO pointed out there already is a situation like this with the Omega weapons and yeti bots. The omega gear is still good without using the yeti bots, and the yeti bots are still good without using the Omega weapons.

The one thing I could see is Azrael's Will is a different case than the yeti/omega combination. I still see Azrael's Will being useful for special situations like slightly nerfing rage or giving you time for a coodown. This is how a core should be, useful sometimes but not so powerful that you expect you use it every battle.
Epic  Post #: 34
4/1/2013 15:11:49   
ansh0
Member

Then they should include the serums within the pack itself.

Not make people dish out over 10 bucks for a miniscule dmg bonus.
Epic  Post #: 35
4/1/2013 15:26:32   
Ranloth
Banned


 Yeti comes with the promo, Bunny Bot does not. Azrael is even separate promo at that. Only because you should be able to afford doesn't mean you can hence 'compensation' would be good for you. Also Omega weapons have passive core that boosts its damage, not active core that works as mere compensation with an average Bot that is half-useful and not a part of the promo.

This is why we can't have nice things.
AQ Epic  Post #: 36
4/2/2013 2:30:45   
ansh0
Member

When this is used in 2v2, you get a guaranteed loss.

How is it now OP.


The aux makes shielding useless.

The gun gives the user a free turn.

Really friggin OP.

Make these cores buyable ingame, or nerf them.
Epic  Post #: 37
4/2/2013 2:42:51   
Mother1
Member

@ ansh0

Nope you are wrong with that statement. I have beaten players who use this promo as have many others in 2 vs 2 so it isn't a granteed loss.

quote:

The aux makes shielding useless.


The aux is no more OP then the azreal's borg which isn't OP.

quote:

The gun gives the user a free turn.


No a stun give you a free turn, this weapon still causes the opponent to attack you even if it is a forced strike. If used wrong that person can lose due to the strike taking them out.

quote:

Make these cores buyable ingame, or nerf them.


Where have you been? The cores not only got a nerf from 100% damage to 85% damage, but they will be in game for all since they are seasonal rare's not rares like all the old promo's in the game.
Epic  Post #: 38
4/2/2013 2:59:13   
StatueOfLips
Member

@ ansh0
Dude all i have to say is the only thing you do is complain
Without us people who buy these promo;s there would be no EpicDuel
And Varium's Deserve an advantage because lately in Omega
Non-Varium's were about just as good as Full variums.
Enough said.

~.LoveyLips.

Plus i fully agree with Mother1

< Message edited by StatueOfLips -- 4/2/2013 3:00:29 >
Epic  Post #: 39
4/2/2013 3:07:24   
odsey
Member

@Ansho I doesn't understand what you're saying. So you want us to do 0 damage when we're force to striking? Not good solution, it would make the core OP. But if you mean when the special is used it deals 0 damage while we atttack for normal damage,not supported too.I think it is fine as it is. No need to nerf the core because I beat some of the owner of the promo and I still beat some of them. Even the promo got a nerf which reduce the damage to 85%.

< Message edited by odsey -- 4/2/2013 3:09:05 >
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 40
4/2/2013 4:21:09   
Blaze The Aion Ender
Member

I will go some fights without even the slightest need to use it
I could also go through some fights without even the slightest need to use energy drain core
My point is; just because it is effective, doesn't make it OP
It is perfectly counter-able

Before I had the gun and was a BH, here was my strategy against someone who had it

(I go first)
Me: Smoke
Them: Malf
Me: Omega Overide
Them: Aux
Me: Aux or Heal depending on my HP
Them: Azrael Core
Me: "I'm fine, because I knew you would use that, and I prepared for it"

You can beat it by healing, to brace yourself for whatever comes after (Heal) or you can shield right before you know they will use it, convincing them to use the shield taking aux, in turn making you stall the battle instead of them, giving you an extra turn to stall, should you need it

Point is you can plan for it, use it in YOUR strategy, plan around it, just like you would do for ANY other core


AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 41
4/2/2013 12:21:05   
Sipping Cider
Member

@Blaze The Aion Ender

First off, very nice method for dealing with gun.

@ Opposition to nerf

However, the way I am looking at this nerf idea for Azrael's Will is not as something that is unbeatable, but rather as something that is way above the level of other cores.

Comparing to energy shot:
One does damage the other doesnt. One can reduce a rage to a strike the other only reduces a rage to anything less powerful than a skill requiring energy. One removes the option of using an energy skill, the other removes all options besides strike. The one thing energy shot has going for it is azrael's will lasts one turn will the energy loss is more permanent.

Comparing to concussive shot:
azraels will does 5% more damage. Azraels Will limits all options besides strike, concussive shot limits one random skill. The one thing it has going for it is the random skill is limited for a longer period of time, which does not seem as good when you think about all the cores and other skills and weapons you can do instead.
Epic  Post #: 42
4/2/2013 14:56:55   
ReconnaisX
Member

@StatueOfLips
Personally, I would still buy Varium if I could because I don't play too much, and it's a convenience currency. (I have bought Varium before.) Let's not go too off-topic, though- this is not about varium vs. non-varium.

I think the damage should just be nerfed to 25% or maybe 10%. Nothing else.
MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 43
4/2/2013 17:15:45   
sleddyboy3
Member

@Sipping Cider: The difference is that one cost $50, and the other one is free.

Get my drift? The gun is fine, just because a few people can't beat something doesn't mean it's OP.

Strength merc was never OP either, people just didn't know how to counter it.

< Message edited by sleddyboy3 -- 4/2/2013 17:20:24 >
AQ DF MQ Epic  Post #: 44
4/4/2013 10:36:21   
Thesoulweaver
Member

The core is fine as it is. Plus, with tank builds, stunners do a huge amount of damage.

@Cider-

Do you realize how much 10% damage does?

Eg. 20+40+7 (DA)

67 Damage without resistence.

10% = 6.7 damage.



Detailed:
Yes, it is not necessary to use the core in battle. I personally only use it for desperate situations, like 10HP Heals cooldown , and with all those crits, dodges nowadays, I may have given my 15% damage for nothing, or it may save my life. Therefore cores like this are not reliable.
While stunners, (Dex build mage) Overload can unleash huge damage for some energy. IMO 30 energy is too less for good damage with 30% stun chance along with it.


Compensation. As Trans said, compensation in that form is worthless. I'd rather go for a cute yeti, IA or AB then use BB just for compensation, which guarantees only 1 turn of damage rebound.
Plus, if you have such a problem countering it, get it next HHD.

MQ AQW  Post #: 45
4/4/2013 12:32:53   
Coolkid1999
Banned


 I Agree With Trans What A Stupid Idea!
Post #: 46
4/4/2013 13:57:28   
priest_hidan
Member

lol... this is by far THE worst idea... good job.
AQW Epic  Post #: 47
4/4/2013 20:21:49   
Sipping Cider
Member

quote:

@Sipping Cider: The difference is that one cost $50, and the other one is free.

Get my drift? The gun is fine, just because a few people can't beat something doesn't mean it's OP.

Strength merc was never OP either, people just didn't know how to counter it.


The core is definately beatable, and I have been beaten plenty of times while using it. When strength merc was OP, people could counter it and often times win. The point is too look at the core overall, as the mercs were. True, that strength merc could be beaten by those who knew how to counter it, but it was by far still the best option if you wanted to win lots of battles and have even a fairly good win%. This core is just on a whole other playing field when you look at how powerful it is. For now, I am going to ignore the cost arguement as this is not about varium vs non-varium (as far as I know).

quote:

Do you realize how much 10% damage does?

Eg. 20+40+7 (DA)

67 Damage without resistence.

10% = 6.7 damage.



If I get you correctly that is example is saying 20 damage is coming from strength, 40 from the gun, and 7 from deadly aim? I have not played at the top level for quite some time now, but I was under the impression the max damage a sidearm bonus adds is 35, and having 20 damage come from strength is not very common, especially now that it scales every 4.5 points in strength.

I am aware that a 10% modifier of the sidarm damage is more close to a 5 damage difference when at max level.

quote:

Detailed:
Yes, it is not necessary to use the core in battle. I personally only use it for desperate situations, like 10HP Heals cooldown , and with all those crits, dodges nowadays, I may have given my 15% damage for nothing, or it may save my life. Therefore cores like this are not reliable.
While stunners, (Dex build mage) Overload can unleash huge damage for some energy. IMO 30 energy is too less for good damage with 30% stun chance along with it.


Compensation. As Trans said, compensation in that form is worthless. I'd rather go for a cute yeti, IA or AB then use BB just for compensation, which guarantees only 1 turn of damage rebound.
Plus, if you have such a problem countering it, get it next HHD.


Ok, maybe having it trigger with color blast is not the best compensation. What if instead it filled your enemies rage bar when used (this forces them to use their rage on a strike)?
Epic  Post #: 48
4/4/2013 20:53:47   
cool preston
Member

This core is especially unfair.

If you are facing one with an ultimate they use on the turn that you will heal. Then they use their ultimate boom your dead...

Here's how to fix this. allow the option to heal or generate. That's it if none are available you automatically use strike.

Sounds simple but would fix the abuse. And it's not really a nerf anyway.
MQ  Post #: 49
4/4/2013 20:58:31   
odsey
Member

@Cool preston the core is fair. You could counter it but you need yeti. And I have fight a azrael owner without yeti and won. So not supported I guess.
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 50
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