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RE: FleshWeaver and Soul Smith Class II

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5/31/2015 21:21:11   
Chaoshaper
Member

What about Curse, that one really uncommon element? Not necessarily evil, nor good, but tainted energy that your character can't help but feel burdened by it.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 676
5/31/2015 21:21:23   
VJ
Member

the fw shouldn't be multi elemental lock just ice and or maybe darkness nothing more.
Post #: 677
5/31/2015 21:27:32   
Chaoshaper
Member

Ice and Darkness are both commonly resistable. What i'm looking for is an element that won't deal bonus damage in most situations, but also wont suddenly cause you to be forced into a corner. Dont forget, we're looking for a way to make people think carefully about choosing it, not nerfing the class into oblivion to cause people to turn away from it, the classes and ally locks should be enough.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 678
5/31/2015 22:18:36   
VJ
Member

it has nothing to do with nerfing but everything to do with the soul ally. his def & att skills are all ice and thus the skills should more or less be ice only or ice & darkness.

< Message edited by VJ -- 5/31/2015 22:19:23 >
Post #: 679
5/31/2015 22:25:51   
W.A.R.Z.
Member

Darkness doesn't really have much to do with FW. Eating Aegis would be more "evil" and less "darkness", even if evil is just a state of mind it would be the state of mind you would be in when using FW.

I'm pushing for bacon/evil because bacon is the closest thing to flesh.
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 680
5/31/2015 22:28:59   
Drop_Bear
Member

If it were ice locked then you simply need to give it an option to still kill ice creatures. Ice bound revenant has one though lacking as it only effects one enemy. Something like this that negates all ice resistance of all mobs may be a possible. Another one might be changing from ice to evil etc on ice resistant mobs.

Personally I'd be more fond of ice defensive moves (Aegis's Shield) and other element offensive moves (preferably not all bacon as book 3 has alot of bacon resist).

While thematics is important, a class loses alot of appeal if you have to swap out of it or struggle against an entire quest/s because of it. This isn't a problem on single moves as thats a con you can work around, but is a pain when you can only hit the attack button and defensive moves.
Post #: 681
5/31/2015 23:16:07   
VJ
Member

Remember though our soul ally is ice thus ice based damage should be done.
after all if you take him during a mission that has ice based enemies we don't see any skills that would allow them make an enemy weak to ice so then why should the armor have it as well?

< Message edited by VJ -- 5/31/2015 23:17:45 >
Post #: 682
5/31/2015 23:55:28   
Drop_Bear
Member

@VJ, In case you did not know Aegis has a move that lowers ice resist therefore it makes perfect sense to me to have a move that lowers ice resist (a move that makes them weak to ice).

In the end you have to strike a balance between thematics and gameplay. I love the idea of element locked classes but only when it still plays smoothly. Going off topic for a moment, for example if pyro was element locked to fire I would want someway to deal with fire creatures as you should be as strong to fire as fire is to you but as we do not have base element resists rather than a defensive option offensive is usually the go to.

This said another option since aegis is defensive ice would be have a move that gives 80% (the cap) ice resist meaning that you would have a hard time killing ice mobs but they would have a hard time killing you. This would be my favourite option tbh. would require basically all ice locking to have the full 80% and then if you have something ice resistant that hits with eg darkness then obviously you will have problems as its a monster strong against ice that isn't ice and is much rarer than pure ice creatures.

TLDR: As long as it isn't heavily nerfed against ice creatures ice locking isn't really a problem (to me at least).
Post #: 683
6/1/2015 0:42:27   
VJ
Member

its been months since I last used that class, means I will just have to have the joy and fun playing the class again. :)
*shrugs*
The Death Knight comes with a move that reduces all element def by 30 of a single target so I guess the armor could do it like that but with high cost(the DKA's counter part is 28 mana drain with a 6 cool down) but that I am guess is because its only 30.

now if it was more then that it should cost more and a longer cool down so it cannot be spammed so easily.



< Message edited by VJ -- 6/1/2015 0:43:07 >
Post #: 684
6/1/2015 3:09:31   
Sakurai the Cursed
Member

All this talk of Ice-locking is just silly to me... Why would fleshthreads we use Aegis to make be element-locked, when soulthreads we use him to make aren't?

Also, @Chaoshaper -
quote:

...MSW, SW, CW, all three of which are confirmed to be Tier 3...


SW is not tier 3, it's tier 2. MSW is tier 3 however, being an upgrade to SW, and CW will almost certainly be tier 3 since it'll cost DCs. Also, in reply to another post of yours, DL is full tier 3, not 2-with-a-bonus, but Guardian is indeed 2-with-a-bonus since it's a special offer class.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 685
6/1/2015 3:48:27   
VJ
Member

actually Cursed it makes good sense as the very base of the power if one thinks about it is their soul ally which they had been 'devoured' thus giving the player who had their char do such a disgusting act his elemental characteristics thus ice would be the locked element of their abilities which happened to be ice.

anything else is just silly to me.
Post #: 686
6/1/2015 8:05:57   
Sakurai the Cursed
Member

So what you're saying is it should be locked to punish people? Because the "very base of the power" of SW and MSW is also Aegis, and hell, we fuse with him and shoot a beam of energy from our fused body on SW and MSW, and even that's not Ice-locked, so saying everything should be because he's giving us our power in FW makes zero sense to me.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 687
6/1/2015 9:25:20   
VJ
Member

@Cursed
Who said it was punishment?

There is a difference as well between working with him and eating him.

working with him you 'borrow' his strength however that is it.
eating him is different though and thus doing so you adsorb him and his element which is ice.

So it makes perfect sense that the fw will be ice and locked in.


Post #: 688
6/1/2015 9:41:24   
god of chaos
Member

^VJ. But we already have IR. So another ice locked class wouldn't sound that good.
Post #: 689
6/1/2015 9:56:58   
Ibnar
Member

I dislike the idea of sacrificing aegis for the fleshweaver class. Does not seem to be worth removing a character from the game.
DF  Post #: 690
6/1/2015 10:00:13   
VJ
Member

how so GOC?
our soul Ally is ice and eating him and adsorbing him you will be adsorbing his elemental base thus fw would be ice and as such locked in.

@Ibnar
also not worth losing so many classes as well I take it?

< Message edited by VJ -- 6/1/2015 10:01:43 >
Post #: 691
6/1/2015 10:07:49   
soulus42
Member

@ VJ
While we are absorbing him, that doesn't mean that we will be forced into the ice element. It is a possibility but it isn't definite.

As Cursed was saying, SW/MSW use the power of Aegis yet only Aegis has used ice based attacks. With what you are saying, you would have to think that SW/MSW would be fixed to the ice element as well, as they are using soul threads created from a spirit attuned to ice, yet we don't create anything that involves ice or is even ice related.

I'm guessing that's what FW will be like, we will be using Aegis as a power source but we aren't bound to his aspects. Same for saying that FW will be purely defencive with a bit of offence. Yes, Aegis is a protector but a protector doesn't mean that they are all about defence.

At this point, it's all a matter of perspective and guesses as we know very little about FW and Roirr isn't the best example to use, despite being the only FW we know.

AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 692
6/1/2015 10:41:42   
Ash
Member
quote:

^VJ. But we already have IR. So another ice locked class wouldn't sound that good.

Why not? It's not as though we're operating under a rule of "YOU CAN ONLY HAVE 1 CLASS LOCKED PER ELEMENT! EVER!" We could have 20 ice locked classes if we wanted to. That's not saying it WILL be, that's, again, pointing out flaws in what people are saying.

< Message edited by Ash -- 6/1/2015 10:42:41 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 693
6/1/2015 15:32:48   
W.A.R.Z.
Member

What about a shield bash attack? That could be your stun (or one of them if it has several)
And with the argument about fleshthreads made with Aegis being ice powered, what if you had a fleshy body like Murk or Vaaloir by default? And because of that you have a higher base ice resist.
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 694
6/1/2015 16:54:51   
Dark Lord Urmi
Member

while FW could very well be ice locked i truly doubt it would be I mean the class is called fleshweaver after all not iceweaver i could see like one or two ice based moves based on aegis in that move set however.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 695
6/1/2015 17:17:03   
ergotth
AQW Lore-titician


 I agree with Urmi and Ash, we can have more than one element-locked class, but ice is not precisely an element that fits fleshweaver, besides, Vaal's soul ally was fire element, and after Roirr ate her, he didn't become fire element, he kept his own element.

(also, Icebound revenant have a way to counter ice-resilient enemies, it has one skill that causes the enemies to become weaker to ice for 99 turns, proportional to their resilience so you can do some significant damage)
DF AQW  Post #: 696
6/1/2015 18:09:26   
Chaoshaper
Member

But its a side class. Its optional. If it were major you'd think there would be more support for it.


I still stand by my whole Mana-defensive Health-Offensive costs, with the defensive skills being ice-themed, and with the hardest hitting attack/attacks locked to an element that isnt so commonly resisted. A class not designed to destroy everything in its past with the click of a button but with the ability be in a fight that has dragged on for longer than most other classes can.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 697
6/1/2015 18:11:18   
Christophoses
AQW Tester
&
Lore Adept


 @Ash

Locking Fleshweaver to Ice doesn't make sense. Roirr ate Vaal's soul companion, who was attuned to Fire, and was able to use use the Evil element in combat. If anything should have been bound to a certain element it should have been SoulWeaver, since we are bonded with our icy soul ally. Fleshweaver has serious potential to become a major class, so locking it to one specific element would make it unpleasant to use. If it absolutely has to be locked to an element that can deal a fair amount of damage to all monster. Something like Void/???, which doesn't meet this standard, or maybe even a new element. I know there's the whole issue with having to implement it into the combat system, but this would be on of the only ways that locking FleshWeaver seems logical.

________________________________________________________________________________________________________

EDIT: Sorry egotth, I didn't read your post and basically copied what you said.
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 698
6/1/2015 18:27:42   
Shadows Morgenstern
Member

Wow! I keep forgetting how much about Tomix's stories you guys know without him even stating almost anything about fleshweaving. We know next to NOTHING about it, and the only combat skills we have seen were modified skills of Vaal's. Most of the information we even know about it could even be unique to Roirr.

< Message edited by Shadows Morgenstern -- 6/1/2015 18:30:47 >

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DF  Post #: 699
6/1/2015 18:38:07   
soulus42
Member

@Shadows Morgenstern He has given us some info on the thread, like little appetizers of information ^^
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 700
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