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RE: =AQW= New Server changes - More Feedback Needed

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5/4/2017 17:08:39   
Darches
Member

I haven't had time to play much AQW recently (especially on the test server) but I'd be really happy if stats acted kind of like in AQ classic, and were applied only to classes. Without the ubiquity of luck, you have to carry around at least 2 or 3 full sets of gear and switching classes for different tasks becomes tedious/annoying. I normally use a farming class (like Blaze Binder) for most content and a solo class (like Ultra OmniKnight) for bosses, while keeping support classes around for when they're needed (every boss group needs at least 1 StoneCrusher IMO). Prior to obtaining these strong, end-game Wiz classes, I had to juggle a lot of enhancements.

As an example, UOK has almost identical DPS with Wiz and Luck enhancements, so unless I'm fighting a REALLY mean boss I can switch to it freely from my luck classes without having to change other gear.

I also really REALLY hope you fixed the bug with magic abilities being poor without static weapons. I think damage range should be a customizable stat attached to classes along with Str, Int, etc. High damage ranges could be new Nulgath rewards or something...

< Message edited by Darches -- 5/4/2017 17:09:52 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 126
5/5/2017 16:10:40   
Keeper of the Owls
Member

A beat 'em up style of gameplay would be interesting to see. Assuming the lag problem is fixed once and for all, this kind of gameplay change could make combat feel fresh and exciting again.

_____________________________
AQ AQW  Post #: 127
5/6/2017 21:23:56   
The ErosionSeeker
*insert cheesy pun here*
quote:

Who needs Chronos when you can just auto attack the enemy for 200k+


And now I am become Death, the destroyer of Worlds.
I-I swear I'm only using it for jokey stunts and not actually breaking anything important!
DF AQW  Post #: 128
5/6/2017 21:32:22   
ShatteredReality
Helpful!


 @above

How does that even work?!
AQW  Post #: 129
5/6/2017 21:39:47   
Aura Knight
Banned


 Must have been pretty lucky.

That's just another thing that needs fixing. Crit modifier shouldn't be able to go so high that you can auto attack for over 100k on your crits.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 130
5/6/2017 23:51:19   
Legendary Ash
Member

The initial crit mod values for Str/Int were closer to the ideal amount prevent things that boosted critical chance from being too powerful. However I am against the shifting of critical mod from Luck to Str and Int as it overshadows the Parry and Resist chances of Dex and Wis, which is in conjunction with Parry and Resist dmg amount of Str and Int, the values show that the server changes are in favour of Str and Int.

Testing Server Stats per point of Stat
Str: .00091% Parry dmg
Dex: .00071% Parry
Int: .00091% Resist dmg
End: .00093% Parry and Resist dmg
Wis: .00071% Resist, .00031% Heal

It makes Str and Int the all powerful stats, which is why Fighter and Wizard enhancement work well as they capitalize on that growth.
I recommend removing crit mod values from Str/Int and scaling crit mod to the Luck values of whats expected of a full Luck build (with current enhancements spread or a Point distribution system) at Lv 100 so that the crit mod is at most 2.00, since passing that crit mod value means any critical chance passives or skill buffs are stronger than what the percent of critical chance is, 10% critical chance of mod 2 is a 10% gain in damage. Only member or Awe +3 or +4 Lv 100 enhancements (if higher than max lv power is balanced) and class passives and skills buffs can increase the crit mod beyond 2.

Additional there is a smaller imbalance in that Wis gets an additional Healing modifier favouring Caster classes, while the Warrior equivalent Dex doesn't get anything, I suggest removing the Healing mod for Wis or adding it to Dex to balance it.

Whats good about the Testing server's changes is Endurance, the resistance effectively increases the value of the stat and provides an additional modifier to buffing monster damage by the average base resistance expected of a player when you face that Level of a monster addresses the problem that there is minuscule growth in appropriate monster damage as it scales up with player base health which is just +13 from becoming Lv 65 from 64.

Once Testing server phase 1 is finished and changes to classes are open, the eight different class stat models' significant imbalance should be addressed in that Berserker's stats outright trumps Warrior's stats and combat modifiers (hit/haste/critical chance/crit mod/evasion) in all aspects except in Endurance. Mage trumps Shaman's stats in everything except hit chance despite their actual distribution ratios suggesting a difference if they shared the same formula, for example Shaman's greater Wis should give it higher critical chance at base, but instead its formula is lower than a Mage, making the difference in stat values meaningless.

As the writer behind A Guide to Stats, and non official class tester I recommend to either make it so that the formulas are the same for category of class, Caster, Warriors, Hybrids and Lucky, or a Strength and Weakness mod system. For example combat modifiers except crit mod have the same base formula but can receive bonus points from a .2 increase pool with a cap at .1 per stat. Base formula is (stat*(.1+bonus))^(1/1.4), bonus = [0, .1]. At the extremes there will be a 50% difference should the points be maxed out on two modifiers .2 and the other .1.

< Message edited by Legendary Ash -- 5/7/2017 2:09:48 >
AQ  Post #: 131
5/7/2017 22:12:14   
Stronius
Member

So, when I test my caster classes on the servers now that luck is apparently a thing again, I was immediately doing far more damage with Abyssal than I used to. The autos are actually hitting as hard or harder than they do on the live servers, which is very nice. One thing I noticed, though, is that my weapons and capes enhanced with depths have a +6 enhancement level, but on the test servers it says they have 0 of every stat. Is this just a visual bug, or are the Depths items actually broken on the new servers?

EDIT: Okay, after doing some testing with static weapons, boost items like AFDL pieces do work, as do racial weapons like the BLoD. Also, depths enhancements are definitely still the way to go for casters. Using ABA my autos were hitting for about 333/980 with full wizard, and 346/1369 with 2 wizard and 2 depths.

< Message edited by Stronius -- 5/8/2017 18:20:17 >
AQW Epic  Post #: 132
5/10/2017 12:29:30   
Thronos
Member

Right I dont know if this is where you post bugs but whatever, anyways testing Servers are filled with bugs, let see all dots and heals are magnified by a lot, i cant acutally move anywhere half time because it wont go to where i click it, the Sential class will die in one hit if its 4 skill, i dont know if this is a bug or whatever but whatever i do on the testing servers in terms of doing quests wont move over to the live server but that could be a feature or something, haste is when on the elemental dracomancer is ridiculous as in it attacks so fast that it finish the attack animantion when doing the auto attack. but about the luck rewrite its whatever to me. but the critcals are lower
Post #: 133
5/10/2017 16:37:33   
ShadowMoon
Member

meanwhile i still can't venture though the tercessuinotlim
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 134
5/10/2017 17:19:15   
Metakirby
Constructive & Helpful!


 Well, once we can traverse Tercess on the new servers, I wonder, can we possibly go through the whole area without needing to actually have any of the items (in our inventory)?
It's confirmed that the new servers features a system that recognizes banked items, which makes me very hopeful, the next step would be, to be able to accept items without the need to unbank them, so you don't need to unbank various drops, just to prevent them from dropping. Even with this system, I can confirm that having max stack of an item in a loaded bank does not prevent it from dropping, but oddly enough, it does recognize that the stack of set item is at it's limit, which I find a little odd, maybe this possibly eliminates the need to unbank items to prevent them from dropping from "you will recieve one of" quests, it's an interestng thought and I hope it becomes a reality, if it isn't already.

Seems like it doesn't do anything to the "you will recieve one of" quests, it just says the stack of the item is maxed, instead of saying "this item already exists in your bank". I tested with the Wheel of Love house item, which can be done in Cursered, if anyone was wondering, I honestly just found out about this a couple minutes ago, because I wanted to test my theory.

< Message edited by Metakirby -- 5/10/2017 17:35:24 >
AQW  Post #: 135
5/23/2017 16:36:33   
  Alina
Battleon Sorceress


 How is the new server feeling after all the changes?
Keep the feedback coming, Arklen and Yorumi need it!
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 136
5/23/2017 16:53:01   
darkhl7
Member
 

 does item boost stack on normal server now r is it just on testing server?
Post #: 137
5/23/2017 17:26:22   
Ryuyasha
Member

@Alina Combat seems fine with luck enhancements, the base damage is a bit lower than on normal servers but the crit mod is higher which makes up for it. HoTs and DoTs also do way too much heal/damage. I'd still like to see other enhancements get some sort of buff so I'd have a reason to use those over luck. There are still some bugs with classes and combat (they've been reported to my knowledge). Also, I still find it strange that monsters heal in the middle of combat.

< Message edited by Ryuyasha -- 5/23/2017 18:00:20 >
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 138
5/23/2017 17:34:35   
Metakirby
Constructive & Helpful!


 @darkhl7
Item boosts stack additively on the test servers, which means you add every % of boost on top of the others. Boost from equipment still don't stack on normal servers, don't expect it to untill the rewrite is done.
Example: each AFDL piece gives 25%, so for each piece you equip, you will gain 25% more, based on the base value. Misc boosts only doubles the base value of whatever you are boosting, so if you have 4 AFDL pieces and use a boost, you will gain 3 times as much of whatever you are boosting, which means, for every 1 xp/cp/rep/gold you would gain without boosts, you would get 3 instead.
Oddly enough, the server boost stack multiplicably with all the other boosts.

@Alina
What I like the most about the testing servers atm is the dynamic stat panel, it makes it a lot easier to find out what exactly happens under certain effects and making it easier to report possible stat related bugs. I do still wish we had the general overview of the skills somewhere, mostly the passives, because they are not listed anywhere else. Speaking of passives, they don't seem to be in effect and kind of makes some classes seem worse than they would be, which can be bothersome for balance testing sometimes.

I also like what luck does now, it only increases the Crit Modifier (from what I can tell), although only under a very specific circumstance, making it more of a secondary enchantment. Crit damage seems to be higher, but crit chance seems to have gotten reduced serverly for most classes.

There's also various bugs that have been around for quite a while (mostly class related), for better or for worse. I'm probably not alone in wanting class bug fixing to be a high priority, there's a couple classes I would like to use, but just can't due to bugs that makes them pretty useless, classes with 50/50 abilites only being able to activate one, stacking buffs/debuffs having the reverse effect upon fading, huge self DoTs (I'm not going to rant about it again), the seemingly nerfed state of Thief enchantments, not really giving any real benefit in pretty much everything (luck gives more evasion than thief enchantments, which should be the defining feature of a high Dex enchantment) and so on.

There's also the highly variable spawnrate, which is nice when it rolls in your favor (more or less insta respawns), but it does give a little more inconsistency to farming compared to normal servers.

And about xp, it would be nice if mobs and bosses gave xp that matched their difficulty, not necessarily their level. It's just odd to me that some bosses give 3k xp, while other, even harder bosses, only give 100 or so. Apart from the xp kinda scaling with level, there doesn't seem to be a pattern whatsoever. Some of the lower leveled bosses in bosschallenge even gives more xp than some of the harder ones, how does that make sense? It's probably a little nitpicky, but the feel of getting pityful amount of xp from something like Binky, or 100k+ bosses feels unsatisfying.


< Message edited by Metakirby -- 5/23/2017 17:50:40 >
AQW  Post #: 139
5/23/2017 18:12:14   
Aura Knight
Banned


 The xp we get from monsters on test servers does need to be changed as Metakirby mentioned. Also, seems some monsters give more gold than they should be. I forget which one it was but yesterday one of the monsters I fought on the test server dropped near 7k gold. I think I was using a full set which gave gold boosts but even so, 7k from one kill seems a lot. And I don't even think the monster was tough to fight. Wish I could remember which it actually was.

And some monsters give more class points than others. The one I had gotten most class points from is the defense turret at /hyperium. Compared to other monsters in game it gives a lot more class points. Very useful but perhaps a bit too useful.

Also, hp values are strange on us and on monsters. Some monsters have too much hp while others have too little.

It's a bit hard to test classes on the test server if some things on them are working wrong or not at all. Evasion seems to be almost nonexistent. Most times when I use a dodge class monsters still hit me and when they don't it's a miss instead of a dodge. There are also monsters that seem to lack skills on test servers even though they have skills on regular servers. The chaos lords are one example. Perhaps the monster skills are on a delay and I end up winning too fast but even if I just auto attack and heal, I get no effect from the chaos lords. I've fought escherion (ignoring the staff) and kept damaging him constantly, kitsune never goes into fox form, wolfwing doesn't enter its berserk state, etc. The one chaos lord that still seems to be a bit of a challenge is ultra alteon. Hits pretty hard, but like the others I don't think he's got any abilities.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 140
5/23/2017 18:17:38   
darkhl7
Member
 

 i was lagging when there are 4 r more players in the same room as me on the ptr server kinda odd
Post #: 141
5/23/2017 18:18:09   
Metakirby
Constructive & Helpful!
quote:

And some monsters give more class points than others. The one I had gotten most class points from is the defense turret at /hyperium.

CP is still based on level of the mobs compared to your level, but with 2 differenes.
1. It no longer caps out at your own level, which means you do gain more CP per kill of something that's, lets say 10 levels higher than you, than something that's at your level. Since the Turrets are level 99, of course they are going to give a lot of CP.
2. You gain CP from everything, no matter level, but anything 20 levels, or more below you will give you so little CP it will probably never be worthwhile to farm with.
AQW  Post #: 142
5/23/2017 19:44:45   
Shadowhunt
Member

I was farming with another guy in Honorhall and we ran into some issues. After a while, there started to be a pretty big lag spike whenever we killed a monster. Also, the temp items for quests would sometimes stop dropping even though we only had 9 out of the 10 required. Both of those things could be potentially really irritating issues if they're not ironed out. Beyond that, though, it felt fairly nice. It's definitely a lot faster than the normal servers in terms of quest turn ins and loading, so that's a plus. They feel like they're pretty close to ready, though there are still some issues to be ironed out like class bugs.

I will say, being able to see others' damage numbers and HoTs is pretty distracting and confusing. I don't really see why that's a necessary "feature", unless it's just a bug, but I'd rather it be like it is now where you only see your own numbers.
AQ AQW  Post #: 143
5/23/2017 20:15:03   
Metakirby
Constructive & Helpful!


 Question, have some magical classes been given an INT based auto attack? I seem to be doing some auto attack damage that's way out of proportion for some classes.
Blaze Binder: 498
Legion Evo Dark Caster: 498
Lightcaster: 453
Pyromancer: 498
Shaman: 380
Stonecrusher: 435, this one is also backed up by the fact that Magnitude increases it's damage, even though it only affects the "Magic Out" modifier.
I do deal less damage once I equip something like Luck enchantments. So it's either based on Spell Power, or INT.

HoTs also seems to be grossly high. Not that that's "bad", but I do feel they are a little over the top sometimes, healing for 1k a tick on something as mundane as Blaze Binder is pretty...unnatural. They also vary and not only due to the fact they can now crit, it seems to be the first and last tick that's affected.
Blaze Binder heals 1633, 810, 1633.

All numbers are based on my lvl 76 account using lvl 76 Wiz enchants, Locks of the Doomlord and a Static damage range.

There's also some sort of "action delay" when entering combat*, which can prevent you from resting, joining other maps and sometimes changing equipment.
*It seems to be able to be triggered by some self buffs, even without needing to be in combat with anything.

On the topic of resting, it's pretty wonky, sometimes you need to wait for the enemy to respawn before you can rest, sometimes you don't, and also, the HP and MP regeneration while resting are vastly different, HP increases with maybe 10% or so, MP increases with 30% per tick. This makes resting for HP annoying, as you cap out your MP way faster.

Stuns/Petrifies also don't work, inluding Dragon Shinobi's self Petrify.

Dragon Slayer's Forgone Conclusion doesn't heal any HP after the 12 seconds.

On an ending note, I would like the color coded enchantments to come back, especially since I can finally make my inventory a very colorful rainbow and not just a pink/blue mess.

On a second ending note, combat tends to feel slower on the testing servers compared to normal servers, maybe we had it way too good before, but a lot of classes easily lose 10%+ base haste (some of it may have to do with the seemingly not working passives, for all classes pretty much), just by switching to testing servers, it's not too bad, especially since overall damage seems to be higher (on magical classes at least), it encourages to team up with haste buffing supports, I thought I would mention it now that I remember it and have a reason to talk about it.

< Message edited by Metakirby -- 5/23/2017 20:31:31 >
AQW  Post #: 144
5/23/2017 20:41:37   
darkhl7
Member
 

 did anyone try using toh cuz when i use it all the skill icon turn grey and i cant seen to click on them after that
Post #: 145
5/23/2017 21:41:34   
Xiao Carrot
Member

I tried using ToH, and the skills do come off, but it seems like the temporal insanity does not work again,
it's just reflecting 0s. This happens with chrono assassin too.
DF MQ AQW  Post #: 146
5/23/2017 22:32:52   
Aura Knight
Banned


 I didn't think any monsters besides the ones in /thevoid were given skills but seems a few others do. For example, chaos spiders do a poison DoT to us. Nothing huge but I guess it's interesting. And some werewolf monster in brightoak has a Howl effect. Not sure what it does. There may be others and monster skills will be a nice addition to the game, provided we don't eventually get a monster that can stunlock us. Last thing I'd want is for a slime to get revenge on us.

I think one thing the game lacks is use of environment for combat. Battle could use strategy. Not just taking turns hitting each other till one loses. Maybe we can get obstacles to block an enemy's attack path, hide from an enemy's view, hit from an enemy's blind spots, and other things of that nature. Combat in AQW is boring and could use changes, however, there's likely limitations with what can be done about it. And most of these suggested features are likely more suited for a 3D game, but if it can be done for AQW, I'd very much like to see that.

I'm waiting on fixes for some classes because right now, quite a lot of them are useless or really weak on the test servers. I think skills which make AoE effects single target don't work. At least, the enchanted blade effect from Royal Battlemage doesn't seem to. And neither is chaorruption from the chaotic slayer classes.

< Message edited by Aura Knight -- 5/23/2017 22:39:03 >
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 147
5/24/2017 0:18:18   
Harrison
Member

Howl should lower your defense by the looks of it, or stun. There are quite a few monsters with assigned skills, for example Gressil gives a hidden DoT poison when you fight it.
AQW Epic  Post #: 148
5/24/2017 8:46:35   
Metakirby
Constructive & Helpful!


 It seems more like Howl just increases the enemy's damage output, seeing it's a buff applied to itself.
It's good to know they are already in the process of adding mob abilites, even if we do not know about them, it's always a nice suprise to find out that some random mob has something a little more interesting to it. It's going to be a nightmare to catalog it all for the wiki team once the rewrite is done, I would imagine. Unless they can get a complete list from AE.

Speaking of mob abilites, the Reaper is one hell of a foe, applying a Decent DoT and then applying Decay is a deadly combo. Combined with his general damage output and nuke, he's a tough guy to solo, even with VHL.

Xyfrag was also a tough guy to get through, not because he does a lot of damage, but even something like a full Wiz lvl 76 Darkblood with a Static weapon and 15% damage could barely decrease his hp once he started popping heals and defense buffs, healing upwards of above 1000 while taking almost no damage.

Also, What is up with this lag flame?, it counts as an account according to the bottom right number, but it's really nothing, it's just a lag flame that sits there. There's also a bunch of them in Battleon-1. This is on Safiria.

On to some class stuff.

Full Wizard Dragon Shinobi is finally real , stacking ~250 DoT per Shadow Kunai adds up pretty fast into multiple thousands as well as Flaming Dragon dealing more than 2.5k per tick. It may just be a side effect of the insanely high HoTs/DoTs in general though, I would say full Wiz Dragon Shinobi is worth a consideration to use for high hp bosses. Add a Stonecrusher to the mix and you will stack to 10k in no time. Sadly there seems to be some sort of bug that will stop HoTs and DoTs from working, from time to time and you will need to let the effect fade before you can continue, which in Dragon Shinobi's case, is not what you would want to do. I can't seem to get high above 11-12k DoT, before it just stops ticking for no particular reason.

GB is a killing machine, easily on par, if not a better DPS and possibly survivor than VHL. 0.88 Haste (although slightly unreliable because you need to hit a 30% chance on Glacial Storm), 5.1 Crit mod, about 50% crit chance, a 600-800 HoT that can crit for way over your max hp, if you use Luck enchantments and I bet even if you used full Fighter, it would be more or less a full heal. With the 0.88 Haste, not only do you auto attack what seems like every half second, but you also hit for a decent 700-800 non crit, once you subtract possible damage boosts and whatever else. Cooldown times are also ridiculous during these 10 seconds, popping skills every 2-3 seconds. This gives it moments of just being amazing in every way possible, taking down the 20k mobs in Battlegrounde in a matter of seconds. Of course, nothing is perfect and if you let your crit buff and/or haste buff fade, you lose everything and is forced to relog to get back your stats.

There's just so much to talk about when it comes to the test servers, I find myself always wanting to write more and more, but writing these super duper long posts is not really what I want to spend my time on, so I just post in smaller (relative to the subject at hand) posts. I could write on and on about every little problem with the current state of the testing servers, but then I would be here for the next hour or so and other people have already talked about and explained some of those aspects thouroughly enough, so it feels redundant to start ranting about all that.

< Message edited by Metakirby -- 5/28/2017 4:33:01 >
AQW  Post #: 149
5/24/2017 19:15:39   
Randomnity
Member

Infinity Knight's 1st skill is still bugged. Temporal Rift still only applies once and then never again, rendering all the other skills much weaker than they should be. In particular it makes the second skill Daybreak nearly useless, since it especially relies on Temporal Rift stacks. The HoT will always be 0. I have submitted a bug report about it, so hopefully it gets fixed.

< Message edited by Randomnity -- 5/24/2017 19:16:02 >
AQ  Post #: 150
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