RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (Full Version)

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Varen6398 -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/29/2011 12:31:39)

Wow, Despite being an old man, Honorius has some skills up his sleeves...

I would like to know more about this warmaster, and Honorius' intentions for Jeanne. I guess I will have to wait until you make the next chapter.



Mortarion -> RE: (DF) THe Hounds of God- Discussion (11/29/2011 15:27:48)

Hmmm me liked last chapter



Dwelling Dragonlord -> RE: (DF) THe Hounds of God- Discussion (11/29/2011 15:57:17)

quote:

"Very well. Our glorious God King will never worry of having to face any sort of antagonism very soon."


This strikes me as odd, is it possible you meant to say "anytime soon"?

The Grand Inquisitor shows his true nature, so to speak.



lordkaho -> RE: (DF) THe Hounds of God- Discussion (11/29/2011 20:03:08)

As promised, Chapter 15 is up!

Part 1 is finally done. Now I can get to start working on Part 2, namely Jeanne main story, which probably won't be out for quite some time due to the holidays.

Enjoy. We get quite some drama here.




Glais -> RE: (DF) THe Hounds of God- Discussion (11/29/2011 20:10:38)

Hm, not sure if I want to bother commenting since, my comment is largely negative....but this chapter just felt kinda off to me.
The fight was cool yeah, but the ending was so...weird, didn't seem like Jeanne had known Noir or had had anything to do with her long enough to bother caring about her. But whatever. I wonder what chapter two will bring.

Also, compared to DF's start, what time period is this current chapter? For...future reference.



lordkaho -> RE: (DF) THe Hounds of God- Discussion (11/29/2011 20:23:10)

A year or so, perhaps. Part 2 happens right after part 1, but Part 3 will be some sort of a time skip that happens about 5 months after the events of Part 2. Part 4 will be the climax which is also set right after Part 3.

I haven't stressed it really, but Chapters 6~15 happened over a span of months (Jeanne wasn't going on a mission for quite a long time), which means Jeanne was already been meeting Noir almost casually. But I understand why it felt like forced drama. 15 chapters just weren't enough to squeeze that much bonding moments between the two.

I'll try to make it better in Part 4 when they finally reconcile.




Mortarion -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/29/2011 20:50:14)

What you mean with reconcile, will Jeanne hate Noir again?



lordkaho -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/29/2011 20:52:33)

I mean that they will finally meet together again, after several months of Noir's absence, as both will be busy with their own troubles.



lordkaho -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/30/2011 2:29:35)

Edited Chapter 15.

I toned down the sudden melodrama and made it more bittersweet, taking away the needless torrent of tears. The big crying and sobbing is reserved for later.



Glais -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/30/2011 2:39:35)

Yeah the chapter's got a lot more flow to it now.



Varen6398 -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/30/2011 4:39:58)

Destined to kill Noir? Jeanne's plushie moment was actually quite touching, completely differing to the character we have seen so much of so far. I really felt that chapter was a great emotional moment, and very few stories I have ever read have that sort of power in them. The chapter was really at great finishing point of part one, the emotions playing out very well. I hope to read more when it comes out.



Formorri -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/30/2011 5:02:58)

Markus's actions strike me as odd. I presumed he would be the kind to really think things through before doing something. Like executing a figure of power.

Explain something for me, kaho. Who exactly commands the Inquisition? It can't be Markus all the way, for that would defeat the purpose of protecting Alteon's monarch. Having an absolute leader to protect another absolute leader is like a ticking time bomb. Is Alteon even aware of the Inquisition?

I find Jeanne's interaction with Noir getting weirder and weirder. Jeanne in your own words, described a person with an absolute hatred for all things dark and eldritch. They can't have been acquainted long enough for Jeanne to actually care about Noir. It's like we're missing a few chapters in between.



lordkaho -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/30/2011 5:12:22)

@Varen That was badly phrased, I'm very sorry. Take it like something "The only person allowed to defeat you"/"My true and only rival", etc. Between Noir and Jeanne, killing, death, and pain would mean love and friendship. Glad you liked it by the way. I really want to emphasize the emotional aspects in this story, but since this is my first time writing a serious plot with these elements my execution may come off as a bit rocky. But I'll try to really do my best. Hopefully by end I can pull off a heart warming ending in a world of religious fanatics and zealots.


@Formorri

quote:

I presumed he would be the kind to really think things through before doing something. Like executing a figure of power.


Hrolteus became a major hindrance to Markus' plans, which directly involved Jeanne. Let's just say he wasn't Inquisition material. Ironically, Markus' plans also involve saving the Order from decay but conflicts with Hrolteus' ideas.

The Grand Iquisitor is still the supreme leader, much like the Pope of the Roman Catholic. King Alteon is the figure head. The Grand Inquisitor still isn't an absolute leader akin to a Dictator though. He serves as the direct vessel upon "which" he lays out to the entire Order what the King "wills". From there on, each part of the Inquisitorial Heirarchy will do their specific purposes.

quote:

Is Alteon even aware of the Inquisition?


He isn't. If he's aware, he would defeat the purpose of the Inquisition in the first place, namely the efforts of the 2nd Grand Inquisitor. Plus he'd have them all executed for their immorality.

quote:

I find Jeanne's interaction with Noir getting weirder and weirder. Jeanne in your own words, described a person with an absolute hatred for all things dark and eldritch. They can't have been acquainted long enough for Jeanne to actually care about Noir. It's like we're missing a few chapters in between.


This is one of the bigger problems I'm facing right now. Even after "toning" down Chapter 15, it still seems forced? Jeanne hating all things evil, by the way, was a result of Inquisitorial brainwashing, which will be elaborated more in Part 2. I mean, Jeanne in Blood and Sand isn't that extreme right? Stubborn and fool hardy as she may be, but she wasn't a religious fanatic. I'm saying this because that Jeanne and this Jeanne are connected.

After I polish up Part 1, I'll probably add more chapters to it (the most would probably be an additional 2-3 chapters about Jeanne and Noir, just to justify Chapter 15).




Formorri -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/30/2011 8:56:19)

Wow that's quick. I'm thinking that I'll get instant notification from now on, hmm? [;)]

quote:

The Grand Iquisitor is still the supreme leader, much like the Pope of the Roman Catholic. King Alteon is the figure head.

So basically, her entire life revolves around a kingdom sized conspiracy.

Jeanne, I now give you full permission to destroy something expensive.
quote:

The Grand Inquisitor still isn't an absolute leader akin to a Dictator though. He serves as the direct vessel upon "which" he lays out to the entire Order what the King "wills".

At least now we know that there is SOME semblance of a democracy in the Inquisition. A very twisted reicarnation, mind you, but a democracy nontheless.

quote:

This is one of the bigger problems I'm facing right now. Even after "toning" down Chapter 15, it still seems forced? Jeanne hating all things evil, by the way, was a result of Inquisitorial brainwashing, which will be elaborated more in Part 2. I mean, Jeanne in Blood and Sand isn't that extreme right? Stubborn and fool hardy as she may be, but she wasn't a religious fanatic. I'm saying this because that Jeanne and this Jeanne are connected.

I wouldn't say that it sounds forced. It's just that Jeanne's beliefs are quite contradictory, seeing how she's so adamant and while yet apathetic to killing non human beings (except gnomes of course. Their bombs are just far too awesome for it to say... not exist). True, she might not be a religious fanatic. But the initial chapters give me the impression that she hates evil so much that she treats them as separate entities. Almost as if they weren't important enough to warrant any care at all.

It's like how we non-Nasuverse (I still don't get what that means actually...) behave to snakes, spiders or other creatures we find repulsive. I mean, no one gets sympathetic if a spider got squished right? Totally normal.

Plus like you said. Jeanne's stubborn. I don't think it would be so easy for her to change her beliefs so quickly.

Edit: Oh before I forget. No, Jeanne in Blood and Sand isn't that extreme[:)]



lordkaho -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/30/2011 12:06:26)

quote:

So basically, her entire life revolves around a kingdom sized conspiracy.


Jeanne has been the World's chew toy for LOOONG time, trust me.

quote:

At least now we know that there is SOME semblance of a democracy in the Inquisition. A very twisted reicarnation, mind you, but a democracy nontheless.


Much like any form of government, in theory it has its perks, but it's a lot harder to realize in practice. A supposedly all-powerful, all-seeing, all-present Order whose existence is a mystery even to the King, won't last that long before falling into internal turmoil.


Okay, tell you guys what.

How about this; A mini filler arc for the two to get to know each other properly without each having to point blades at each other's throat? Jeanne still won't budge about her killer instincts of course but it would at least enlighten her on some better aspects, such as not all vampires are that bad, in comparison to what the Inquisition has jammed down her little head.



Okay, so here it goes. *drum roll*

How about...

A Journey To The Center Of The...CATACOMBS! *modulated voice*

-Depending on what happens, this may or may not be filler arc. It would happen between Chapter 10 and 11. It will be about Jeanne and Noir, accidentally stumbling into a forbidden section of the Catacombs called the "Dragon Path"; there they find the early foundations of the Catacombs prior to the rule of the 1st Grand Inquisitor- More ruins to be explored, a sewer system curiously linked to the City proper, some secrets that hint more about the Inquisition's origins, Noir and Jeanne being awkward together and being a bunch of scared little girls (RAAAAATS), some unwelcomed visitors, and of course...Some bonding time.

Look, I even made a caricature teaser for it.

Whatcha' think?



Varen6398 -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/30/2011 12:21:35)

Ah, you might want to change it then so the phrase is worded a little bit better.

Nice picture. Dragon Catacombs? Innocentius? The characters being scared? This is different. However, it would be a nice touch to the story (secondary storylines always add a sense of great depth).



lordkaho -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/30/2011 12:25:56)

It's probably going to be a bit more light hearted compared to the rest of the chapters.

I also have a feeling that Hee-larious hijinks are gonna ensue...Or Jeanne just goes crazy. Being 500 feet below the ground for so long does mess with your perception of reality.



Varen6398 -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (11/30/2011 12:46:36)

quote:

Being 500 feet below the ground for so long does mess with your perception of reality.


Well I know what you mean if 500 feet below the ground means stuck in a horrible English lesson for an hour. If not, then I have to point out that English lessons bend your reality in a horrible way.



Formorri -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (12/2/2011 11:24:31)

I'll be looking forward to it.[:)]

However, I would like to apologize if I have been to harsh. If you think I should soften my words, please don't hesitate to say so.



lordkaho -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (12/2/2011 19:37:56)

Nah, it's okay. I needed the criticism. Glaisaurus already had pointed out before that chapter 15 felt dislocated, mostly because of Jeanne's feelings for Noir are entirely premature and undeveloped, and that was before the edit.

And now even after editing it, making the whole farewell scene faintly one sided, you pointing it out that the entire end was still out of character for Jeanne makes it evident that I still need to expand a little bit more on their interactions. I'm not sure if adding a mini-arc solely devoted to Noir and Jeanne's togetherness would be the ultimate solution to steering Jeanne's views for a bit but I hope I can pull it off nicely without having to make it like forced character development again.

Because if Jeanne's white and black ideology are that unshakable, she'll be just an unlikable jerk here in Part 1 up to Part 4, and the goal of the story is to change that through Noir.



Glais -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (12/2/2011 19:46:08)

@^:I think the main reason is that there was enough chapters, but very few that showed Jeanne and Noir conversing at all.

Perhaps as Jeanne begins to find out about the Inquisition's failure-ness, her thoughts on Noir could change over time, as she realizes the Inquisition isn't as great as she thought.
Either that, or that would do the opposite...



lordkaho -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (12/2/2011 20:17:23)

It was hard to talk when they were fighting every time they met, lol. But that will change briefly when they are lost 500 feet below the ground and the only solution is to cooperate together.

quote:

Perhaps as Jeanne begins to find out about the Inquisition's failure-ness, her thoughts on Noir could change over time, as she realizes the Inquisition isn't as great as she thought.
Either that, or that would do the opposite...


It's already happening. In Chapter 7 or 8, I think, she began to question the Inquisition for becoming soft (fearing the loss of soldiers) and having Vampires in its ranks; it only made her angrier, more so at the Inquisition than at Noir.



Glais -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (12/2/2011 20:27:51)

quote:

In Chapter 7 or 8, I think, she began to question the Inquisition for becoming soft

I know, that's where I got the idea. I mean as she sees the Inquisition's failure, she could reflect on Noir a bit and possibly eventually change her perspective, though it would be a long process.



Helixi -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (12/3/2011 7:54:08)

That teaser makes me want to hug them. Damn it Kaho, why make them so cute?! *shakes fist*



lordkaho -> RE: (DF) The Hounds of God- Discussion (12/3/2011 17:49:23)

In the grim dark past of the Inquisition,

There is only...

Cuteness.

*cue Noir and Jeanne wearing cat head bands while dancing to Buri Hamachi (ﾟ∀ﾟ)



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