RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (Full Version)

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Luna_moonraider -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 6:25:34)

@ above
as i said in my post most non variums are forced to abuse a stat and yet the devs are planning to nerf the stat abusing builds. also support tlm and mercs do not work so well now due to the nerf on field medic. str build are the way to go in 2v2 now. trust me i know and y i m not using a str build cause i hate str. sopport ftw. XD. as for arcade wat are the chance of u winning a 25 credit hmm let me guess close to Ummmm 0% so basically i call the arcade the token scamming machine.

back to topic

The problem here is stat inflation s PD said lots and lots of time.

Also another problem is most non var waste their credits on useless stuff like the silver card(they should put a warning saying that if u buy the card u can sell it), weak armors(the once with +4 and +1 def/resis), class evolving without thinking twice(there goes 50 k credits down the drain, if u class change and was forced to use basic club/staff/claws), buying a 30k bike for no reason( i know bikes are cool but come on some people buy them over buying a armor) and not knowing and planning builds thus wasting loads of credits retraining(using the old system not the new 1 the new system is better but still people can lose credits by retraining too much). most new players do not know how to save credits and since the game does not teach u that enhancements and class evo are the way to survive. Thus u find lots and lots of super uber noobs with just basic claws/staff/club running around in 2v2 and 1v1. These noobs are food for all non variums and variums. In every game there must be free food because without them we cant do much. but now non var without full enhancements and a decent build are turning into free food. this is wrong they have partial enhancements and yet they get trashed like a rag doll. decent build+ few enh hmm people think u might do well but they are wrong. these people need to become full enhance non var in order to at least beat some varium players and to go full enh from partial enh is super hard trust me i tried it with my bh alt and i gave up and just npc for fun now.




zion -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 7:24:20)

@Luna

No need to nitpick my post - we agree.

In the end of the day, there are dozens of viable Varium builds, but only one for either 1v1 OR 2v2 for nonVars.

The only way for a high level nonVar to fight PVP you need:
1) To be in the most OP class at the moment.
2) Need all the highest level rare equipment.
3) Need to fully enhance the items.
4) Hope that the crazy stat requirements on nonVar equipment doesn't destroy your stat-abusing (was support, now strength) build.

With all this, you still have little chance of beating a full Varium user if you have equal skill. (You need crazy RWL - Considering you have no bot and and are 10 levels weaker).



Gepard Acht -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 7:42:05)

so many words.... cant read them all.....
@above

1) you dont need to be the most OP class to win, i'm a BH and yet i dont NPC (except with small lil servers where no-one plays) and still win lots of battle
2) i only use two rare weapons
3)only got 14 enhancements on main equips
4) my 33 support req is a contrast to my strength build

and i dont have little chances of winning, it depends on how you play it and if you can outsmart your foe

i see a couple of good non-variums and i myself enjoy the challenge of facing someone who has greater advantage and still win
besides they pay to get advantages so there shouldnt be any complains of non-variums UP
and i do agree that enhancements price needs to be reduced a bit, i wasted a lot of credits just for my main weps



zion -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 9:57:28)

@above:

Let me guess? You have a strength abusing smoke build? Wasn't that one of the TWO BUILDS I MENTIONED TWO POSTS AGO??????

As a BH with the top level equips and many enhancements you do have a decent chance 1v1, but you still have no chance against heavy Varium users with similar skill in the game.



Gepard Acht -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 10:30:35)

i'm not a strength abuser, i do use a strength build but i dont abuse it

and says who i dont have any chance against heavy varium user, i just beat my boss recently and a whole bunch of varium users who are a lot better then me

you better stop think lowly of yourself and instead try coming up with better ideas to counter people with variums , just how i endlessly retrain and make a working build against tanks (ask my friends like drinde, he was there) looking at your own char, i see you have tons of wins that almost doubles mine, why do you have to complain?



zion -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 12:15:02)

@lynxian
I understand you have beaten __Put in some Varium guy or really tough boss here___.
You fight a lot and you win some. I was able to do that in beta with my TM heal looper.
BUT
now you have one of the only workable builds for f2p - I know, I have a BH alt which does the str thing...
TRY to understand my perspective-
This is a deeper question of balancing the game and making it fair for all f2ps to have some level of success if they try to improve their ED skill. As of now, at the high levels - the highest Varium user has an inordinate advantage that threatens to destroy any real "f2pness" of ED. Like has been stated many times, without a healthy amount of f2ps, the game gets saturated with Varium users and transforms the game into a p2p. Some Varium users might not care but this game isn't developed nearly enough to support a p2p platform and the game would slowly die out. That would be sad considering the potential this game has.

You may not remember or you may not have been around when a f2p BH was the worst class by far since strength builds were no mach for defensive/healing builds. You happen to be using the best build for 1v1 right now and don't see any issues.
What if they nerf str builds and your character becomes unplayable for pvp?
It's time to see things a little more "big picture."




Gepard Acht -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 12:29:42)

dude you got to be kidding me if you say i dont have any issue , everyone have issues and i do see the bigger picture and if you're stating that because i use a kinda-str build doesnt mean that its the only thing that works, e.g drinde uses dex-support and it works, ansh0 uses a tank-like build which also works and we are all f2ps BH

so thats why im saying that you should try experimenting a lot more and so you can come up with something to your liking and not blaming everything on strength builds or non-variums being too UP

and if they're going to nerf str builds, i'll just change to some of my other builds and come up with new solutions



zion -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 12:50:00)

Proving the point:
quote:

we are all f2ps BH

It is understood that BHs work now to some level of success. If you started playing in beta, you would have quit before BHs became viable for a f2p - trust me, it was really rough (the original forums are gone, so I can't prove that fact). At this time, the possibilities for f2ps in terms of creative builds that are successful are few and far-in-between.
If you happened to pick a class that works right now and it seems fine for you now, then that's fine.
This thread is about the big-picture issues that are very real and threaten this game - even if you chose to ignore it.
Trust me - you will get very frustrated by this game as a f2p. This is by design: either lose a lot, purchase Varium or leave.



Gepard Acht -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 12:54:53)

i am from beta -_- and i tried all three base classes and i believe the other options other then, lose a lot, purchase varium and leave is just keep trying and i know it sounds a bit cliche , but thats just how it is



doomkiller98 -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 19:30:38)

@endtime OMg lol thats what i do :P im such a hard ass :)



PD -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 19:45:26)

I see too many anecdotes being used here to actually want to participate.

You wanna prove the situation is bad? Don't use anecdotes. Use MATH. Winning does not reflect skill nor does it correlate with skill at all.

Once I see numbers then I'll get into this discussion. For now you can't really base a balance statement (At least not a valid one) without having the math to prove that something is wrong.



Luna_moonraider -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 23:32:49)

@lynxian

quote:

1) you dont need to be the most OP class to win, i'm a BH and yet i dont NPC (except with small lil servers where no-one plays) and still win lots of battle
2) i only use two rare weapons
3)only got 14 enhancements on main equips
4) my 33 support req is a contrast to my strength build

and i dont have little chances of winning, it depends on how you play it and if you can outsmart your foe

i see a couple of good non-variums and i myself enjoy the challenge of facing someone who has greater advantage and still win
besides they pay to get advantages so there shouldnt be any complains of non-variums UP
and i do agree that enhancements price needs to be reduced a bit, i wasted a lot of credits just for my main weps


1) Bh are the best class if u dun have 50k lying round to do 1v1. as i said most non vars have no sense of saving up credits do u think that and it would be dumb to class change as a non var.
2) class change is only good for non vars if a merc changes to a tlm, a bh changes to a ch and a mage turning into a Bm.
3) 2 seasonals rares is already alot. i myself use 2 and 2 seasonal rare are basically a must have to make a good non var build.
4) 14 enhancements well try vsing a tlm varium with full enh can u win him.
5) i rather not waste points in support whne u can use a cheapshot smoke build.

u win because u vs other non var without enhancements. u also win because u were either lucky to start first or blocked deflect ect ect. i agree with the outsmarting part.

counter to the last point they varium players pay to destroy us non var not to gain a significant advantage. the advantage is not significant trust me. total up the full stats u can have and total up a the full stat a non var can have. well i m gonna help u with that.note: i did not say u can use all the best weps to make a build to make a build



Best stat a NOn var merc/tlm can have

25+6 from mjolnir
16+6 from pirate blunderbuss
13+8 from carrierzooka
12+6 from new city guard armor

grand total:92 stat points

Best stat a varium merc/tlm can have

28+10 from delta destroyer sword
19+8 from stun guns(any stun gun)
19+8 from eggy zookaz
16+8 from tesla armor

grand total:116 stat points

116-92=24 stat

now that is if u are fully enhanced if u r not well that a different case. and note that the enhancing is hard as it is quite expensive to do so.most varium players will run round with +116 stat while most non var would have lesser than +92 stat maybe no enhancements and having just 68 stat that is like 48 stat difference. i would say 48 is a lot that like 8 dmg/armor/resis. so think bout it do u think u can still win a fully enhanced var without full enhancements. yes u can win with luck but with skill not in million years.



drinde -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 23:43:04)

^
Actually, a F2P Merc can use the Cyber Cutlass.

Also, if the Varium player is not very experienced, you still have a chance to win.



Luna_moonraider -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/26/2011 23:49:20)

@ above
stat wise mjolnir is still the best but i would not say dmg wise so it purely up to u but i m just listing the best STAT giving weps. well meeting a in experienced full enhanced varium player is kind hard and require hmm wat ya call that LUCK.



xxomegafaustxx -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/27/2011 0:24:18)

Glad someone brought this up and not to further derail from the topic, Correlation implies an association between two variables. If these variables are very closely associated, the "r" value or correlation coefficient is closer to negative or positive one implying a proportional and linear relationship between the two. Of course we can't assume that because these two variables are closely associated that these variables cause the other one to occur. This is where the Correlation vs. Causation takes into theory because we are not sure if one is responsible for causing the observable pattern of another variable. We need much more context to understand this relationship if it does so exists. But here, what I'm trying to argue is that the correlation is an associative one not a causation. Usual with more varium, one is associated to be a stronger player while those who don't have it tend to be not as strong.

Similarly winning can/may imply (notice the qualifiers) a player to be associated with skill however that being said, the opposite may hold true.

For those mathematicians who enjoy number crunching here's a timbit:

40+ stat difference between the average stat varium user and nonvarium user, enhanced weaponry including the bots (one that does massive damage while the other heals massive nerfs), 2-3+ difference resis and stat different, 2-3 strength points invested in better weaponry and equipment, 10% on weapon specials, and this list could go one forever. Note we haven't factored in enhancement slots, booster packs, xp, etc. Any problems with this?

As far as I see it, the only problem I'm having with this statistic is the 40+ stat difference created by enhancements. The ability for varium users to circumvent the traditional payment system of credits in a much easier fashion and effort has resulted into more oped builds to develop over time. This has discouraged new users to come and thus has a detrimental effect to the community as many adopt these Oped builds resulting in many scenarios of imbalance as we are currently experiencing.

Furthermore for those who ask, the reason as to why I employ anecdotes as my prose of writing and conveying my ideas and thoughts is because these numbers don't mean anything without context. There's a story behind each number as well as a stemming history as to why these numbers such as these have evolved over time. A number only does not have any meaning; rather it's meaning must be invoked in the context of inspection, evaluation and assessment of the situation. As humans, we have learned through evolution to learn things both empirically and emotionally.

As quoted by a famous Japanese poet:

quote:

"the only number is 1.
Any number larger than 1
is illusion."
-Shuntaro Tanikawa (trans. William Elliot)


For those who say my posts are far too long, you don't need to read all of it; as long as you get the point and my message I'm completely fine with that. Additionally, we must also look into not only numbers but also the cultural and social premises and parameters to which have greatly amplified issues such as these (like the GAP). If I gave you a number, 100,000,000 without providing you any context of it, what would it mean to you? Understanding and also appreciating the background and skeleton provides us greater rationale and knowledge of the numbers involved in our context We're discussing an issue involving imbalance on many different angles, not just mathematical.

The imbalance is not only a statistical anomaly but something that must be consider on a much more deeper level of thinking and rationale.



Gepard Acht -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/27/2011 1:07:01)

^ seriously? i win cuz i fight non-variums and get lucky? do you really underestimate people that much, i dont win a lot of battles because "i deflect, crit, etc" that quite offensive you know



xxomegafaustxx -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/27/2011 2:36:41)

^I believe her post addressed battling against the odds and not with.

In retrospect to what you worded as "underestimate", I think that statement can be challenged. Arguably, if the ability of a player is compromised so greatly against his/her odds, one would find it difficult to compete and play the game on an enjoyable level. Why? This is because they know they're going to lose on every single occasion (the majority), despite their efforts to be creative with their builds. Rather, they are punished for being unique and therefore must conform to OPED builds which is the source of imbalance in classes. The biggest source of imbalance however is the one created by enhancements.

Consider a classic children's game involving a set of die:

Both are given one dice to throw but the nonvarium player can only throw once whilst the Varium player is given two throws. They are given two respective tosses in a effort to roll the highest summative value indicated on the respective numbers on the dice. (For example on the first trial 6, 2nd trial 2,therefore the sum of 12). As the Varium player is given an additional turn, both have a fair probability of winning as the nonvarium player may roll 4 whilst the Varium player 2 and 1. The extra roll makes it possible for the varium player to obtain an optimum but not unfair advantage. This is what I think should be proposed.

But now because of enhancements, this scenario is only enlarged. The Varium player instead of two tosses is given 4 tosses making the probability of a nonvarium to roll a summative value greater than four on his/her first try an impossible feat. Of course, there're nonvarium players out there that are luckier than others (veteran nonvarium), but the fact of the matter doesn't change. It will still prove a harder feat for a nonvarium player to rival the favoured unfair odds obtained by the varium player.

Thus the idea of being lucky can be employed because the probability of winning is an unnatural anomaly/occurence.



Luna_moonraider -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/27/2011 3:38:58)

quote:

seriously? i win cuz i fight non-variums and get lucky? do you really underestimate people that much, i dont win a lot of battles because "i deflect, crit, etc" that quite offensive you know


ED is a game of luck without luck non vars wont be anywhere. varium players also depend on luck. if u vs a person with the same as u chances a person who start first would win is high because starting first is luck. luck is everywhere in ed. so u cant avoid it. as drinde said u can win if meet a not very experienced varium player.To meet a not very experienced varium player what do u need... luck. Basically ed is a game of luck not so skill based(note: skill is still needed cause luck takes you that far). Trust me i played this game way longer and i know and i certainly dun under estimate people. i m just stating the facts and i know the truth is bad but get over it. ed is a luck based game. more like 90% luck 10% skill.

elaboration of my post above

also remember a varium player can just have 45str/45dex/45 tech/45 support and they can easily use the weps listed above. Reason being because they have big tool called ROBOT. while a non var is forced to use a hmm support build with the weps i listed.



zion -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/27/2011 10:08:17)

A few months ago, I suggested a standardization for rare items was necessary to end the utter consumer confusion vis-a-vis the purchase of items and their actual in-game value. I think that now there is a better understanding of item value and a general principle of - the higher the item level, the amount of varium, the rarity, the higher the power/stat boosts.

So at his point there is a workable Gap in terms of the pre-enhancement power/stats of varium vs. non-varium weapons.

HOWEVER, this is only the first step.

Since players can instantly boost their weapons with two full levels (or more) of stats by using Varium, the Gap is blasted wide-open and the actual power level difference of an average Varium user to an average non-Varium user is about 40 stats = 10 levels.
This is extremely significant since the cap is only +33 levels.

I think the current system of enhancements is broken, abusive and hurts all players. Variums are forced to spend money to stay in the top 1% of power and non-variums have astronomical costs just to fully enhance one item. Even after winning >10,000 battles you can't really enhance more than 2 or 3 points on each item. And it gets worse - new items come out every few months and the amount you enhanced the old items, you can just by the new item with stronger power and better stats.
Conclusion: Variums are being forced to pay for their items twice and non-Variums need to pay for their items more than 5 times in order to stay at maximum power. Needless to say only a couple old and talented and obsessive ED chars have been able to do that.

How about solutions? I have two suggestions (all feedback is appreciated)

1) Abolish Varium for enhancements: Everyone pays with credits and they have to be earned in battle - therefore people who paid for their items only pay once and players will actually remain interested in the game (the more I play the stronger I get - interesting concept). [Automatically give the Varium enhancement rebate for all currently owned varium-enhanced items]
2) Make credit enhancement cheaper - so it becomes viable enhancement option for everyone and only the extremely lazy waste real money.

If people appreciate these suggestions, I have a tweaked skill tree for an attempt to balance all 3 updated classes - in the suggestions forum. I have some other ideas about the whole classes' lack of balance, but we will save it until enhancements are fixed.
--Noiz



SouL Prisoner -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/27/2011 11:40:42)

after getting the TLPD weapons u still telling non varium "UNDERPOWERED" !!!!

cmon....wat do u want , free varium stuff for non varium players !!!!


ur crazy man >>>>


n btw if non varium players aren't underpowered(more of i would say weaker ) then , varium players wont hve a reason to get varium stuff . when non varium stuff so powerful then , y buy varium stuff and spend cash????



ansh0 -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/27/2011 12:15:12)

^Dude you seriously have no idea of whats going on in this topic.

I agree varium should give a player an adavntage over a non varium player but what you are saying is that anyone who bought varium should ALWAYS win against a non varium player.

quote:

after getting the TLPD weapons u still telling non varium "UNDERPOWERED" !!!!


Dude what do you expect??you want all non varium items to be old and unusable?the stuff's power increases as the game goes on...and non variums cannot even get 15,leave alone 15,they can hardly get 10 enhancements.







~black spidey



zion -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/27/2011 12:36:34)

@ Soul Prisoner:
Calling someone crazy doesn't prove anything.

You are obviously clueless as to the deep discussions that have taken place on this thread.

There may be some rare nonvar weapons that have considerable power, but when you add up all the factors (enhancements, bots, extra def/res) the GAP is still way too big for higher level chars - EVEN with all the rare equips.

You can deny it, but there are actual facts and calculations to back up the imbalance in this game. Look at earlier posts.

Right now it is great to be a full varium tlm isn't it?

What if there are no more nonvars and everything you paid for doesn't give you a battle advantage? You won't have such a "To H3ll with all the nonVars" attitude.

I'm interested in preserving the game that you paid [too much] money for.

--Noiz



PD -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/27/2011 13:22:45)

quote:

A few months ago, I suggested a standardization for rare items was necessary to end the utter consumer confusion vis-a-vis the purchase of items and their actual in-game value. I think that now there is a better understanding of item value and a general principle of - the higher the item level, the amount of varium, the rarity, the higher the power/stat boosts.


I did that that way way WAY before you did.

Actual post was made in 2010, but was archived much later.



xxomegafaustxx -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/27/2011 13:47:01)

quote:

I think the current system of enhancements is broken, abusive and hurts all players. Variums are forced to spend money to stay in the top 1% of power and non-variums have astronomical costs just to fully enhance one item. Even after winning >10,000 battles you can't really enhance more than 2 or 3 points on each item. And it gets worse - new items come out every few months and the amount you enhanced the old items, you can just by the new item with stronger power and better stats.


This is beautifully stated. As a nonvarium player myself, I can testify to this for several reasons:

1) It's too costly just to fully enhance one. The credit enhancement slot sellback is terrible; I have to invest in a lot of time and effort just to get a descent amount of enhancement and if I do sell one, it would be a utter complete waste of time and energy. And sometimes weapons get old over time. Because I lack the money (credits), I have to hold onto old and outdated weapons and hope that it will rival new weapons that are introduced later in the game. This often works against me.

2)I'm compromised with a build that requires me to use certain weapons, therefore I don't have much freedom or flexibility with developing new ones and I must resort to OPED builds. To compete with the varium user, its extremely hard because their oped builds are scaled 20+ or 30+ stat points higher which makes it extremely hard for me to win (I've played this game since beta; those who did also know what I'm talking about).

3) Unlike varium players, I can't change classes that easily; some are able but if i do, that requires me to change my whole set of weapons. I have to purchase new ones and enhance them all over again which is extremely costly. If you're a merc you can switch to TLM. If you're a BH, the same transition will be harder because one does not have class specific weaponry. Therefore, class changing is harder and unrealistic to the average nonvarium user.

For feedback:

quote:

1) Abolish Varium for enhancements: Everyone pays with credits and they have to be earned in battle - therefore people who paid for their items only pay once and players will actually remain interested in the game (the more I play the stronger I get - interesting concept). [Automatically give the Varium enhancement rebate for all currently owned varium-enhanced items]
2) Make credit enhancement cheaper - so it becomes viable enhancement option for everyone and only the extremely lazy waste real money.


For the first option, perhaps make varium an voluntary cheaper incentive to enhance. For enhancements, varium could be purchased on the premise to obtain discounts from the original pricing. For example, if the enhancements cost 2000 per slot (in terms of credits), if one chooses to purchase varium, one could receive a 25% discount on that price. That way, . This is devoid players the chances of enhancing using only varium as well as resolve the problems of varium being too expensive or costly. But I completely agree with you; varium shouldn't have so much "exclusivity" on enhancements (even for the extremely lazy people). That way it doesn't eliminate ED's revenue money entirely (they probably want some money from varium from enhancements), and also encourages players to earn their status and skill in the platform.

For the second option, its either ED makes enhancements on items cheaper or make the amount of credits earned in battles more (instead of 32 credits in 1v1, how about 80?)-radical proposition considering it probably involves a ton of coding D:. With this in mind, new players as well as old players feel that their working towards something EARN ABLE and realistic not something that will take months and months to do. With that being said, enhancements should be available and equally earnable in comparison to the varium player.





zion -> RE: Flowers among the thorns (Nonvariums Underpowered). Are you a flower? (10/27/2011 13:54:05)

@PD
I think you were looking for the =ED= (Dis)Accomplishments Thread.

Of course these are discussions from the beginning of time and, trust me, you were not the first.

I was saying that we were having REAL discussions about it a couple months ago with some of the mods/testers - you can find the threads that resulted in: =ED= Rare Items Policy

Edit: I did the work for you: Would an official policy for updating rares stop a lot of the complaining?

It seems that the time is now to discuss real changes to the stat inflation / gap widening problem.

Sorry dude, your post is nice and thorough, but too long for people to fully appreciate and a bit outdated.

Let's take this one fix at a time:

We know weapons should be pretty balanced from now on.... check!

I think the enhancement gap should be the next step towards balance - what do you posit?

edit: @omegafaust: Totally agree!!

Other options: Reduce the number of slots and increase the credit/varium prices; charge more varium for varium items but make them fully enhanced - and then make enhancements for credit items fewer credits; I'm sure we can come up with many solutions that don't cost Artix Entertainment any money while increasing the game's appeal to f2ps!

WE CAN FIX THIS.

Can anyone get a mod here to offer some feedback?



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