RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (Full Version)

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BlueKatz -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/17/2012 4:49:25)

If early MP drain is so strong (looking at other MP drain skill >.>) so why won't we make it DoT MP drain?



Remorse -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/17/2012 4:52:26)

^ good idea xD

Then it wont even need a warm up :S



theholyfighter -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/17/2012 5:16:12)

Don't know what the game staffs do to Static Charge....I know that they lowered the %, but almost every SC i use there's a BLOCK( the blocker has 20~30 dex less than me)



Xendran -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/17/2012 5:22:12)

EMP can be used on first turn. If it becoems DoT it's losing its warmup.



steven11113 -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/17/2012 20:22:56)

EmP is good because if you are a bm,bh,or mercency they cant get mp back so it disappoint.
Emp might make nothing for Ch becuase when theyre static they regain around 22 so it might be around the same, even DOT not going to work a lots since Static is only 2 turn cooldown

suggest to remove Cheap shot since it like almostful of Maul for a lvl 1. Example is Cheap Shot: Strike enemy ignoring a % of all defenses; 25% chance for critical strike.
Maul Strike enemy ignoring 20% of all defenses, plus a chance to stun
They are both powerful at lvl 1 and low energy. I suggest Something that do more damage without improve my Strength. Since there massacre and cheapshot=KILL

Dont change Bounty hunter since they cant regain mana like cyber hunter.
The new one should be tech or support requirement



Remorse -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/17/2012 22:05:33)

^ I agree cheap shot On CH's isnt very fair because similar to constant mauls on TLMs CHs are in no short supply of mana.

Making unfair crit wins a freqent occurance.

Maybe change cheap shot for something not very useful such as the current intimidate.



goldslayer1 -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/17/2012 22:39:58)

quote:

Maybe change cheap shot for something not very useful such as the current intimidate.

are u out of ur mind?
giving CH intimidate is probably the worst idea ever.
so with all their tanking, versatility, and survivalness, u want to give them the means to take less damage by str?

i dont agree with that idea. sorry.



Remorse -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/17/2012 22:54:46)

^NP,

xD
It just really hard trying to think of a skill to give them.

maybe field commander?
If massacre is changed of coarse.



ND Mallet -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/17/2012 22:58:03)

The main problem on CHs is Massacre and Multi Shot. Both skills are planned on changing someday as well as Artillery and Surgical on TLM, and Supercharge and Plasma Rain on BM. If those new skills aren't enough to stop the dex and strength abuse of CHs from being so effective then they will need to add more changes. But as I see it, those skills should be finished first before any other changes can be placed on those skills. Why nerf the non problem classes with those multies and ultimates when the problem classes will be losing those skills entirely?



Remorse -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/17/2012 23:03:52)

^ That is true which is why I take into account of a change in super moves into my ideas.
Persoanlly I havnt agreed with any balance changes that have colateral damage such as many requirments when a change in the skill would of been better,
Look at poor techies, they have alot of requirment for TLMS mistakes. Though I am happy that the balance team have shifted from adding requiments and attacking the core problem.

But I didnt know they were goin to change the multi...

I do agree Dex CHs may be a problem but most actuly get high dex in an attepmt to get blocked less, a blocked sttaic can be the death of any CH.

They do block frequrntly aswell as a bonus to high dex and shadow arts.

Which is why I think they should change Shadow arts.

I think Dex CHs are very beatable without their constant blocks.






Zeoth -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/17/2012 23:09:58)

SA is a luck based skill dont blame it for constant blocks.



Xendran -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 0:47:21)

Don't blame a skill that increases the amount of blocks for increasing the amount of blocks?



Zeoth -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 3:37:31)

I just feel that remorse is blaming SA for dex CH constant blocks. Dex CHs are naturally going to have a greater amount of dex so in theory it translates to more blocks. As a dex CH I don't bother with SA anymore so yea putting blame on it isn't needed



Remorse -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 6:03:10)

^ Yes but it gets to the abusive point when both SA and high dex are combined,

I have high dex but no shadow arts yet I cant say I get constant blocks though they do occur I dont think its worth changing anything about.

Its when things get to an abusive point when things need to be changed,

They weird thing is alot of people think abusive is everything that isnt 5 focus or evened out, I belive this is untrue I think things become abusive when they lead to unfair battles and a lack of counters.

Constant blocks could be said to fall under this catagory.



dracule1984 -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 12:37:45)

^ I Agree with Remorse.. But for me shadow arts is not the issue here.. Correct me if i am wrong Remorse.. but for me its SC.. Now the reason behind why i say this is simple.. Me being a CH also .. i spam Mass, Multiple shot, Heck i can spam everything i like to because i know i have an unlimited energy supply.. but what is even worse is when i Energy drain a Tactical Mercenary or a Bloodmage and see them useless!! yes i have done it countless time while we constantly pawn his partner a Tactical Mercenary relies mainly on his SS and hits or Artillery strike, I end up EMP them and forget them (rendering them unable to gain energy)!! Their was EMP before.. but they rarely used it because 1). they did not have the ability to tank.. thus even if they could EMP.. They will still prolly die.. but now since they can tank + regain energy .. well i don't have to say it more..

What i suggest is.. Classes who have the ability to tank.. they should not have any ability to help them Regain energy.. What i mean by tanking class is obviously classes with passive armor.. if CH and Tactical Mercenary Do not have energy regain ability i suppose fights will be more fair.. Classes like TechMage, BH, i don't know maybe BloodMage should have the ability to Regain energy..

Remorse can sum it up more nicely ..

Thanks




Smackie El Frog -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 13:12:49)

I was thinking about Mercs earlier and how hybrid armor works. If hybrid was moved to where blood shield is currently would that make it possible that Hybrid Armor's numbers could be changed? Say 9 def 9 res since it would be harder to reach Hybrid in the skill tree. If so I believe that would really help improve the Merc class.



BaIllz -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 15:03:19)

That is a very good idea smackie, I hope it gets implemented. Why did they even have to adjust the hybrid armor anyways? I know it was suggested awhile back, but that was because Tacticals still HAD

Hybrid armor. Now they don't even have hybrid armor, instead they have Mineral Armor. So now mercs are the ones with this new adjustment, and I was one of those people who liked to switch hybrid armor in

juggernaut. It allowed me to tank against people with full energy. (Many lvl 34 CH I encounter these days Have full energy... For some reason.. :D). All the mercs that I know do not like this change, so

why did they have to change it? To most builds, it is a nerf. Mercenaries rely on technology for most of their skills, and have no skills that improve with dex, only skills that improve with tech.

So they need more tech and then medium dex, so old +12 armor can cover it up. Now that it is split, you can't do too much tech now, because your dex would be far too low. So you would need more dex,

making your tech low, therefore making skills like bunker, surgical strike, and robot weaker. For now, I am just living with the slight reduction of robot damage with more dex than tech, so all you mercs

out there, I suggest you just move all your tech enchantments into dex. That is what I am doing and it is working fine, because I get slightly more blocks. (I'd rather my robot not get blocked and hit rather

than more dmg but gets blocked alot. Still, the general merc people need more tech and have always tanked tech. ) You get what I just said? If not please ask questions!

EDIT: @ Xendran, If they got rid of intimidate from mercenary, that would be a MAJOR nerf for me. I use it all the time against str CH, and it is very useful.

Thanks,

BaIllz



Xendran -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 16:28:22)

@BaIllz you didn't read the entire suggestion then. Intimidate is replaced with a skill that does the same thing more effectively.



goldslayer1 -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 16:43:40)

intimidate should be IMO changed.

Malf improves with support.
Smoke improves with technology.
why does intimidate need to improve with support when malf already does?

so the solution IMO would be, to make intimidate improve with dex.

this would be a significant buff to mercs, and dex blood mages.
it also gives more purpose to having more dex in merc and be able to combat str builds better.



steven11113 -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 16:47:35)

I suggest to either make something like this: 100 Agility 0-80hp
90 agility 81-92
80 Agility 93-104
70 agility 105-116
60 agility 117-128
50 agility 129-140
40 agility 141+

So much people are sticking with 94 hp or 95hp and need to change something like this. It will shorten the battle.
People are just sticking with 95hp and not 109hp because it cost more stat. This will make people into more hp and less agility.
This will make people invest on hp more or else they will die very fast



goldslayer1 -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 16:52:56)

@steven
agility is a a bandaid to a big mess that happened in beta. and still hasn't been well fixxed.

no need to nerf everyone even more.



Emptiness -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 16:54:01)

Agility is fine as it is plus whats so fun about short battles? I find the most enjoyment comes from long strategic battles that require every bit of concentration you have to win. In the end agility might even have to be raised but the quite yet until more balance occurs.



Zeoth -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 16:54:30)

I say just get rid of it. It's a band aid that isn't really needed anymore



Xendran -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 17:03:51)

Agility always was, and always will be stupid.



Zeoth -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (1/18/2012 17:07:47)

Yea but it wont really matter for any real build with a high heal due to FM nerf. High Hp heal looping just won't work



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