RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (Full Version)

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Arevero -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 1:48:13)

Guys PLEASE leave out the CH/BM conversation, or we could go back to it, then we will end the bludgeon discussion. From what i have seen in this balance discussion is loads of problems, then we have a few posts, then before we even solve it, we move on to another problem. This is called Balance Discussion for a reason, i don't want to make you all feel bad or anything, but please taking into consideration that we should at least solve something before moving on. Now back to the topic...

Bludgeon is a skill that can stay the way it is, but the up call about CS and DS might be an issue. We can leave bludgeon since it's TMs only melee skill as its a 'mage' afterall. Then again CS and DS are also fine in my opinion. As you can see, CS has a crit chance that can usually make you win in the last second. I have been saved by the crit many times before. DS is a great skill for Mercs/TLMs as it has 1 cooldown. We can leave it as Mercs deserve a buff and TLMs is already nerfed many times. So i suppose that all these skills are pretty fair in its way already.

Now if we are back onto the CH and BM topic, then I'd say stop criticizing us CHs. We didn't bring this upon ourselves, the fact about our tank builds is well, it's a great build and it works as our STR+SC build is a bit lost. I think CH is a great class, and i don't see a problem with tank. I know it tops many other builds, but it makes the game again what many call:Diversity. Not many games online have anything as complex and exciting as ED. It requires a lot of calculations, and one single move can make you win or lose. It's all about the experience. Now about BMs, yes it's STR build is quite annoying, but on average their win-streak isn't guaranteed. once you live through the Fireball+zerk(maybe block)+gun. You could easily outwit them. But it may require a bit of a nerf or something so BMs can have other builds than STR.

Overall, Cyber Hunters aren't OP AT ALL. I have made that clear. You can object but this is my thought. Right now with out SC nerf a lot can counter us without our heal loop. So attempt to try out CH-counter builds. And i know that our biggest builds are tank and dex. I haven't done both to make my battles more interesting, and i hope we CHs won't make your lives hard. Afterall, Mercs deserve a good buff to equal things out.




Remorse -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 1:51:59)

Agian people turn back to constantly complaining about little skills, and Oped builds needing to be individualy nerfed.


THE PROBLEM IS ON A BIG SCALE

Indivdualy trying to fix the small side effects of the large problems will NEVER END!!

I Think its time that balance is tackeled at a large scale so that balance changes then after can actuly have an IMPACT.

And that is reducing the total amount of stats by changing enhancement system.




BlueKatz -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 7:01:57)

quote:

Now if we are back onto the CH and BM topic, then I'd say stop criticizing us CHs. We didn't bring this upon ourselves, the fact about our tank builds is well, it's a great build and it works as our STR+SC build is a bit lost. I think CH is a great class, and i don't see a problem with tank. I know it tops many other builds, but it makes the game again what many call:Diversity. Not many games online have anything as complex and exciting as ED. It requires a lot of calculations, and one single move can make you win or lose. It's all about the experience. Now about BMs, yes it's STR build is quite annoying, but on average their win-streak isn't guaranteed. once you live through the Fireball+zerk(maybe block)+gun. You could easily outwit them. But it may require a bit of a nerf or something so BMs can have other builds than STR.

Every turn count? bah how can every turn count when half of the attacks are blocked and you can't even know which attack will be blocked. Even though Energy BM is impossible to beat, I still hate CH more because of its nonsense. The class might not be OP, but it's so stupidly broken




PivotalDisorder -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 7:12:18)

if Tank CH uses EMP the fight is essentially over, especially when they tend to block 3/5 attacks even if you are using a high dex build.
how exactly is that NOT OP? so now they get less energy back BOO HOO they are still top dogs by miles, just doesn't always look that
way cause so many "class changers" are appallingly bad players who cannot think for themselves. Plasma Armour ruined a fun class.

BRING BACK CH AND TLM!




Stabilis -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 9:36:45)

Stats:

Current Stat Attributes:

quote:

Strength: Increases base damage range of Primary, Sidearm, and enhances certain skills.
Dexterity: Increases physical defense, increases the chance to block, and enhances certain skills.
Technology: Increases energy resistance, deflect, robot damage and enhances certain skills.
Support: Increases base damage range of Auxiliaries, increases chance to go first, critical strike, and rage rate; reduces chance to be stunned and enhances certain skills.




Suggested Stat Attributes:

Strength: Increases base damage range of Primary, and rage rate.
-
Dexterity: Increases chance to block, accuracy of Primary, chance to dodge (50%), and accuracy of: Sidearm, Auxiliary, and Ancillary (50%).
-
Technology: Increases base damage range of Robot, increases base damage range of Sidearm, and increases base damage range of Ancillary (50%).
-
Support: Increases base damage range of Auxiliary, increases base damage range of Ancillary (50%), and improves buffer skills (Defense Matrix, Field Commander, Reflex Boost, etc).
-
Defense: Increases physical defense.
-
Resistance: Increases energy resistance.
-
Luck: Increases chance to go first, critical strike, chance to defend (25%), and reduces chance to be stunned.
-
Focus: Increases accuracy of Robot, and conventional accuracy (25%).

  • 50% means that this attribute improves at only half of the normal rate (EXAMPLE-> normal: attribute increases by 1% per 4 stat points/ 50% attribute increases by 1% per 8 stat points)
  • Dodge means that a ranged weapon can completely miss, comparable to blocking
  • Defend means that Primary weapons and Robots can be blocked, Sidearms, Auxiliaries, and Ancillaries can be dodged
  • Conventional Accuracy means the accuracy of Primary weapons, Sidearms, Auxiliaries, and Ancillaries





  • Strength has been added to, the rate at which rage accumulates. Sidearm improvements have been removed as Strike has no cool-down, making outgoing damage just as flexible. Also, because rage is calculated by Strength, smashing away and doing low damage is functional for making Strength the ideal stat to overtake tank users to generally dissolve defense issues.

  • Dexterity has been added to, the ability to dodge ranged weapons, and ranged weapon accuracy. Defense has been removed as an attribute as it is difficult to gauge the power of Dexterity when a strong relation between offense and defense exists in a stat. These were chosen for making Dexterity a stat for accuracy, but also staying true to the meaning of Dexterity, the agility/limberness of a person.

  • Technology has been added to, the damage range of Sidearms, and Ancillaries (50%). Robot damage is solely controlled by this stat. Resistance has been removed as an attribute as it is difficult to gauge the power of Technology when a strong relation between offense and defense exists in a stat. These were chosen for making Technology the stat for controlling the power of ranged weapons as a whole. This is easier to monitor. Also, staying true to the meaning of Technology, the innovation and development in practical application in life. Technology is now a better weapon.

  • Support has been added to, the damage range of a new secondary weapon... Ancillaries, and the ability to improve buffer skills (friendly skills). This now includes Field Medic. The chance to go first, critical strike, rage rate, and chance to be stunned have been removed as merging luck into a basic skill which also controls offense is damaging to balance and difficult to monitor. These were chosen for making Support a balanced offense/defense stat with diversity with the new weapon slot. Support was allowed to manage both offense and defense for 2 reasons: skills are not meant to last as many have energy requirements, but also because Support's weapons have the largest cool-down of all. Also, staying true to the meaning of support, the amount of help or backup that one possesses.

  • Defense is a "new" stat. It has been split from Dexterity to better control the relationship between improving defense by itself as opposed to improving both defense and offense in a stat. It is easier to monitor.

  • Resistance is a "new" stat. It has been split from Technology to better control the relationship between improving defense by itself as opposed to improving both defense and offense in a stat. It is easier to monitor.

  • Luck is a "new" stat. It has been split from mainly Support as Luck is contradictory to balance when controlled in PvP. By separating Luck from defense and offense, the rate of occurrence is easier to control and monitor, but also to stay true to the meaning of Luck, randomness.

  • Focus is a "new" stat. It has been split from the basic 4 as Focus is not easily monitored in power by encompassing more than 4 different attributes. Focus has been added to, the accuracy of Robots, and a small accuracy boost to all other weapons. Damage has been removed from Focus as Technology is better suited to be an offensive stat, while Focus for the longest time has been a principle of everything Strength, Dexterity, Technology, and Support have done... usually luck influences.

    8 stat point are distributed per each level.

    I will be adding a stat progressions sheet right here -> <-




    I have made Focus it's own stat to better control the mechanics of the game, making it that much easier for staff to implement balance changes.

    Ancillaries are a new weapon, and have been designed for Support to supplement a second source of outgoing damage as Sidearms have for Strength. They have one more turn of cool-down than Auxiliaries, at 5 turns.




    Steps towards further fixing balance:


    1. Remove Agility

      • Agility has been known to create loopholes in balance, such as improving the rage rate of players at high levels of health by increasing their own incoming damage, but in return being able to accumulate rage much faster, the higher levels of health means that they can take more damage, so that vulnerability has been compensated. There is also the present issue in which Thorns will accumulate with high levels of health, increasing incoming damage, dealing increased damage upon being stricken. This effect is disastrous to Strength builds, but not as effect to ranged fighters. If you would like my opinion please ask me.

    2. Remove or Change Encumbrance

      • Encumbrance has been known to allow lower levels to compete with level cap players, by allowing their weapons to be handled with only reduced damage. This is not enough, as stats are not compromised. Abusing stats only becomes more of an issue as the player base becomes more accessible to stat points. Remove this feature, or edit it so that stats become reduced relative to player level, but having no equipment stats fall below 0.

    3. Remove or Change Enhancements

      • We have enough stat points from weapons and armour. Enhancements only stockpile towards abusing player attributes and damage or defense. These are also not accessible to a majority of the player base... the F2P. This forms a rift in the ongoing gap, mainly because of the costs. Remove this form of upgrading equipment, or make it more accessible.

    4. Change Focus

      • Focus is an amalgamation of 4 existing stats. It is difficult to therefor monitor and balance Focus, when it is supported on basic building blocks. It is therefor advised to make Focus it's own stat or risk damaging the entire community. Focus becomes the Robot's main stat for accuracy, and generally boosts the accuracy in all other weapons by a small amount.

    5. Remove Stat Requirements

      • Stat requirements are simply a bandaid towards stats. For example, if Strength is overpowered, staff decides to create newer equipment that possesses Support requirements. The fact that stats have been imbalanced, or that stat progressions are nasty, is why we do this in the first place.

    6. Remove Skill Improving Stats

      • Another one of the largest balance issues is that skills can improve with stats. I will keep this simple and give this example: the synergy of a Tactical Mercenary possessing: Field Medic which improves with Support, Artillery which improves with Support, Reroute that refuels these 2 skills. When you had removed improving Field Medic by Support, the game improved drastically.






    A Cyber Hunter's suggestion towards repairing Cyber Hunters

    i) Steps

    ►Remove Plasma Armour

    ►Remove Shadow Arts

    ►Remove Malfunction

    ►Remove Cheap Shot

    ►Remove EMP

    ►Add Conduction

    ►Add Plasma Aura

    ►Add Cyber Arts

    ►Add Blue Ruin

    ►Add Energy Shield

    ►Massacre becomes a Physical Ultimate (it is either that or you create a new Physical Ultimate skill for Cyber Hunters. Malfunction and Conduction both synergize enormous power with Energy attacks, imagine ultimate attacks that work WITH the player's Primary)

    ╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢

    ii) Descriptions

    ▼Plasma Aura▼

    If a user of Plasma Aura is struck by a Primary weapon, the attacker is dealt bonus shock damage. Plasma Aura will not reduce health below 1.

    Level 1: Attacker takes 1% of their total health in damage.
    Level 2: Attacker takes 3% of their total health in damage.
    Level 3: Attacker takes 5% of their total health in damage.
    Level 4: Attacker takes 7% of their total health in damage.
    Level 5: Attacker takes 9% of their total health in damage.
    Level 6: Attacker takes 11% of their total health in damage.
    Level 7: Attacker takes 12% of their total health in damage.
    Level 8: Attacker takes 13% of their total health in damage.
    Level 9: Attacker takes 14% of their total health in damage.
    Level 10: Attacker takes 15% of their total health in damage.

    Weapon Required: None
    Stat Required: None
    Level Required: replaces Plasma Armour
    Improves With: None
    Warm Up: 0
    Cool Down: 0

    quote:

    ND Mallet brought to me a great point: what if a player abuses a tanking build to minimize his/her incoming damage and still have greater outgoing damage (enemy hits you for 3 damage, and every turn your Plasma Aura hits 10 damage)? I have devised my own little logic to combat this:

    during the enemy's turn ->
    attacknegate = player with Plasma Aura's Defense - enemy Primary damage + minimum Strength damage...
    if attacknegate <= 3:
    _____Plasma Aura = False

    Therefor enemies will not be shocked by Plasma Aura if their minimum Primary damage is the minimal value accepted... 3.




    ╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢

    ▼Cyber Arts▼

    Passively increases the Primary hit rate and resistance to poison.

    Level 1: 1% increase to Primary accuracy and 10% resistance to poison
    Level 1: 2% increase to Primary accuracy and 15% resistance to poison
    Level 1: 3% increase to Primary accuracy and 20% resistance to poison
    Level 1: 4% increase to Primary accuracy and 25% resistance to poison
    Level 1: 5% increase to Primary accuracy and 30% resistance to poison
    Level 1: 6% increase to Primary accuracy and 35% resistance to poison
    Level 1: 7% increase to Primary accuracy and 40% resistance to poison
    Level 1: 8% increase to Primary accuracy and 44% resistance to poison
    Level 1: 9% increase to Primary accuracy and 47% resistance to poison
    Level 1: 10% increase to Primary accuracy and 50% resistance to poison.

    Weapon Required: None
    Stat Required: None
    Level Required: replaces Shadow Arts
    Improves With: None
    Warm Up: 0
    Cool Down: 0

    ╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢

    ▼Blue Ruin▼

    Assail an enemy with 2 devastating strikes with the held Primary weapon. The player using Blue Ruin is charged with blue plasma.

    Energy Required:

    Level 1: 14
    Level 2: 16
    Level 3: 18
    Level 4: 20
    Level 5: 22
    Level 6: 24
    Level 7: 26
    Level 8: 28
    Level 9: 30
    Level 10: 32

    Damage Progressions:

    Level 1: 23% more damage
    Level 2: 26% more damage
    Level 3: 29% more damage
    Level 4: 32% more damage
    Level 5: 35% more damage
    Level 6: 38% more damage
    Level 7: 41% more damage
    Level 8: 44% more damage
    Level 9: 47% more damage
    Level 10: 50% more damage

    Weapon Required: Wrist blades or Sword
    Stat Required: None
    Level Required: replaces Cheap Shot
    Improves With: None
    Warm Up: 0
    Cool Down: 2

    ╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢

    ▼Energy Shield▼

    Increases energy resistance for you or an ally during combat.

    Energy Required:

    Level 1: 12
    Level 2: 14
    Level 3: 16
    Level 4: 18
    Level 5: 20
    Level 6: 22
    Level 7: 24
    Level 8: 26
    Level 9: 28
    Level 10: 30

    Weapon Required: None
    Stat Required: None
    Level Required: replaces Malfunction
    Improves With: None
    Warm Up: 0
    Cool Down: 2

    ╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢

    [A Trans Suggestion] Conduction: Strike and reduce the enemy's Resistance.

    (Resistance does not affect Deflections nor skills, but generally determines Energy damage)

    Energy Required:

    Level 1: 14
    Level 2: 16
    Level 3: 18
    Level 4: 20
    Level 5: 22
    Level 6: 24
    Level 7: 26
    Level 8: 28
    Level 9: 30
    Level 10: 32

    Resistance Scaling:

    Level 1: Reduce Target's Resistance by 1 Point.
    Level 2: Reduce Target's Resistance by 3 Point.
    Level 3: Reduce Target's Resistance by 5 Point.
    Level 4: Reduce Target's Resistance by 7 Point.
    Level 5: Reduce Target's Resistance by 9 Point.
    Level 6: Reduce Target's Resistance by 10 Point.
    Level 7: Reduce Target's Resistance by 11 Point.
    Level 8: Reduce Target's Resistance by 12 Point.
    Level 9: Reduce Target's Resistance by 13 Point.
    Level 10: Reduce Target's Resistance by 14 Point.

    Weapon Required: None
    Stat Required: None
    Level Required: replaces EMP
    Improves With: None
    Warm Up: 0
    Cool Down: 1

    ╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢╟╨╥╢

    Static Charge: Static Charge currently improves in scaling to Primary weapon damage + Strength damage. This can be abused by Strength users who only need Malfunction and Massacre to play without tactile thinking (only offence). To promote a diverse player-base, Static Charge should scale only with Primary weapon damage.

    It has become a high priority to me now to suggest an edit to Static Charge to save us all. Here it is:

    Static Charge: A percentage of your Primary weapon damage only is added to your energy in a Strike. Energy restoration is unblockable, however damage is blockable. Cool-down has increased.

    Energy Required: 0 (No Cost)

    Conversion:
    Level 1: 33% of the Primary Weapon's Damage to Energy
    Level 2: 36% of the Primary Weapon's Damage to Energy
    Level 3: 39% of the Primary Weapon's Damage to Energy
    Level 4: 42% of the Primary Weapon's Damage to Energy
    Level 5: 45% of the Primary Weapon's Damage to Energy
    Level 6: 48% of the Primary Weapon's Damage to Energy
    Level 7: 51% of the Primary Weapon's Damage to Energy
    Level 8: 54% of the Primary Weapon's Damage to Energy
    Level 9: 57% of the Primary Weapon's Damage to Energy
    Level 10: 60% of the Primary Weapon's Damage to Energy

    Weapon Required: None
    Stat Required: None
    Level Required: 2
    Improves With: None
    Warm Up: 0
    Cool Down: 4

    Questions? I will try to answer them.
    Comments? Feedback is appreciated.
    Suggestions? With great enough reasoning, I will consider adding your thoughts and add them. You will be credited.




  • Mr. Black OP -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 10:18:15)

    quote:

    Make blocks harder to come by, luck just plays too big a role in this game.
    Defender has 100 Dexterity
    Attacker has 60 Dexterity

    Block Adjustment = (100 - 60) / 2 = 20
    Chance to Block = 10 + 20 = 30%

    Instead make it so its like
    Block Adjustment= (100-60)/3=13.33
    Chance to Block=10+13.33=23.33%

    Any comments based on this idea which will nerf high dexterity CH?




    ND Mallet -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 10:26:23)

    Don't forget that lowering the block rate would also highly increase the accuracy of strength builds.




    Oba -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 10:37:22)

    I think that heal shall increase with support again. Its ridiculous that STR CH's can pretty much use static once and then heal 33 hp, with a very low amount of support... As I play as a STR Merc with a 48 heal, would this also effect me aswell. Yet if heal increased with support would Merc get better again, and so would TLM. (Since some say TLM is UP, which I dont agree with at all...)




    Stabilis -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 13:10:24)

    My ginormous post has been finalized above ^ 4 posts!




    PivotalDisorder -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 13:19:22)

    ^^ oh come on man, just use a regular font :P using purple is more than enough to "standout"




    Remorse -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 13:35:34)

    Where are the fireworks and flashing lights???






    Stabilis -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 13:48:11)

    quote:

    Where are the fireworks and flashing lights???


    One moment please...




    ScarletReaper -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/13/2012 14:03:38)

    Would be cool if support raised feild medic again, because then mercs, tac mercs and tech mages would all be able to deal with cyber hunters. Only bounties and bloodmages would be a little underpowered after that, but it would be closer to balanced than it is now.




    King FrostLich -> TM received too much buffs? (3/14/2012 1:02:57)

    After doing 2v2 several times, I noticed Tech Mages have tech tank builds with max plasma bolt and multi. To be honest, I think it was VERY wrong removing the strength requirement from plasma bolt and reducing the mana of plasma bolt didn't make sense at all.

    First off, I'd like to point out that 29 mana cost with devastating tech and huge amounts of mana is already overpowered as it is. Add reroute on it and it's almost near endless. Even if you're a tank with 40+ resistance, the damage of plasma bolt at max with 122 tech is 80 damage and adding multi with it seems too much. The other classes on the other hand have higher mana cost and do not have reroute which I did not understand in the first place. Defense matrix costs 10 mana while resistance shield costs 11 mana at level 1 yet blood mages and bounty hunters cannot regenerate mana.(unless the BH uses reflex boost but it's not enough to recover it)

    Assimilation is also there for TM's which allows them to recover mana depending on how much skill points they invested on it. It's already too strong as it is right now and therefore needs to be nerfed.

    Topic Merged with Balance Discussion, please keep all balance discussions to this topic! ~Lycus




    DeathGuard -> RE: TM received too much buffs? (3/14/2012 1:12:05)

    Come on -.- dude you know this buff was nothing at all right? It would be the same, 4 mana won't do the change, that wasn't a buff at all! TMs have already receive many nerfs in the past and you want to kill out one of the few builds that can actually survive? Stop nerfing classes -.- Bms should receive a nerf too if they nerf plasma bolt build, they are quite unstoppable.

    By the way if you say that I'm saying no to the nerf because I use that build, I will state that I use a SC build since first days of delta so enjoy my response.




    BlueKatz -> RE: TM received too much buffs? (3/14/2012 1:13:39)

    So when should I use those skills if they got nerfed again? A Merc with DS can do more damage than that anyways

    I fail to see how RR is a problem. Maybe BM should not have BL because all of their skill deal 60+ damage or some kind like that. Different classes are different

    A caster TM still can be killed far easier than any CH in 2vs2. They don't really have too much Sup so any Merc TLM will kill them. EMP work fine for BH.
    I think you just complain because BM in 2vs2 suck unless you have a really good ally




    Stabilis -> RE: TM received too much buffs? (3/14/2012 1:18:42)

    One of my points:

    Improving skills with a stat for example Technology improving Plasma Bolt is negative to balance as it emphasizes extreme stat numbers.




    King FrostLich -> RE: TM received too much buffs? (3/14/2012 1:25:15)

    quote:

    TMs have already receive many nerfs in the past and you want to kill out one of the few builds that can actually survive? Stop nerfing classes -.- Bms should receive a nerf too if they nerf plasma bolt build, they are quite unstoppable.


    There are betetr builds far better than a caster dealing huge damage for quick kills. The problem is everyone just wants fast kills and soon, people will complain about it.

    quote:

    A caster TM still can be killed far easier than any CH in 2vs2. They don't really have too much Sup so any Merc TLM will kill them. EMP work fine for BH.
    I think you just complain because BM in 2vs2 suck unless you have a really good ally


    I don't believe that. With 100+ mana and reroute or even an energy booster, it will just compromise emp. Some mages are even reserving plasma bolt for rage which clearly does alot of damage.




    BlueKatz -> RE: TM received too much buffs? (3/14/2012 1:31:11)

    quote:

    Improving skills with a stat for example Technology improving Plasma Bolt is negative to balance as it emphasizes extreme stat numbers.

    It's not that bad basically. When % skill get bonus from static Damage. Stat skill get bonus from nothing but average stat point per level to be equaled. Remember that all stat based skills do not have Primal damage bonus
    Basically stat skills focus more on builds and abusing while % skills focus on the skill itself.

    quote:

    I don't believe that. With 100+ mana and reroute or even an energy booster, it will just compromise emp. Some mages are even reserving plasma bolt for rage which clearly does alot of damage.

    Eh If he get good Multi and Bolt his RR will be around 6. Let say if he gets 100+ MP his build will be terrible with low Dex and HP and Sup and zero Str of course. Most of the time he would be the last to move, get tons of crit even with 44 Def/Res with DM. You don't even have to kill him, just Tank and kill his friend




    huuduy1 -> RE: TM received too much buffs? (3/14/2012 1:50:01)

    I agreed with the topic :D My CH and BM can't kill TM with ( Super Charge or Full Technology Build ) 10% win only by STRATEGY.




    Silver Sky Magician -> RE: TM received too much buffs? (3/14/2012 1:58:41)

    Actually...those who choose caster builds (especially tech caster builds) usually end up losing a 10-20 turn match with my non-varium CH [:D]

    Anyway, the buff tech mages got aren't very significant. The dominance tech mages have now is a result of more people switching to that class after CH and TLM got nerfed, resulting in increased creativity and diversity in mage builds and of course, the consequent build copying. In other words, the current situation is one that has always been possible but did not surface due to too much of the population being in the 'OP' classes at the time. Even the mages who stayed shunned caster builds and failed to see their potential due to the stereotype of them being 'useless' at high levels.




    Goony -> RE: TM received too much buffs? (3/14/2012 2:06:13)

    @KF, I said they went too far on that buff within 2 hours of the buff being given, the reason for the changes stemmed from data that apparently suggested that Tech Mages at lower levels were underpowered. Removing the str requirement just opens up all sorts of abusive build opportunities and it has become almost as common as Bunker Buster abuse with lower level Mercenaries with the exception that Bunker has a Dexterity requirement.

    They should bring back the str requirement and also change the fireball skill from a dexterity requirement to a support requirement. (although with a 15 start it does nothing to address the power of that skill) 33 dex at max is nothing, I guess the same could be said for double strike, but unless the reqs become level scaled it doesn't really compromise the ability to max skills and stats to create very high powered attacks with short cooldowns




    BlueKatz -> RE: TM received too much buffs? (3/14/2012 2:12:13)

    I think the requirement is a good point, but I don't really see the buff that big. It got like 3 less MP and 2 more damage? If TM rarely hve MP problem then this should not be a big deal especially when those skills are UP before.
    That update was meant to help people like me or Non Varium which can't abuse a lot of stat and have to rely on Rage or Crit or mistake to win




    Goony -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/14/2012 2:38:13)

    As a buff to Intimidate, I suggest that it reduces weapon damage on primary, sidearms and auxillaries (to the same extent as deadly aim) and reduces energy stealing skill effect by 80%. To offset that improvement the attack damage should be modified to 25% of normal strike!




    AQWPlayer -> RE: =ED= Balance Discussion Thread (3/14/2012 3:16:21)

    @Goony
    Simply increasing the amount of strength it takes will do. Simply buffing the support stat will do. If you improve intimidate too much now, it will become OP when support is buffed back up.




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