RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (Full Version)

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Lord Darkblade -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/16/2013 5:31:58)

Yeah, the alignment chart was designed for tabletop roleplaying, not forum based, unless it had a major effect on the game.




TJByrum -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/16/2013 10:10:38)

Alignment Charts take away the freedom of your character. Why let a single word determine the entire outlook of your character when you could do it in a better, more complex and interesting way? To me every character takes on their own set of morals within the RP. What they do, think, and say during certain situations pretty much builds the character's moral, whether they prefer Unity, Chaos, Good or Evil.

Also, would you guys say a character modeled around the RP's story is more interesting than a character who is not?




Legendium -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/16/2013 10:52:41)

@TJB

It certainly makes for more story depth.

But in general, the Alignment Chart is meant ore as a basis for your character's morality. Sure, you can be lawful good, but that doesn't mean you need to strictly help everyone and everything. It fits the description, sure. When making a character, think of what the world did to them, how they reacted, and out of that you find your morality. Then just squash them into the right part of the table, if playing D&D.




Lord Darkblade -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/16/2013 14:13:29)

Yes it harms the freedom, but it is just the basics, you decide how they act.




TJByrum -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/16/2013 16:21:28)

Agreed.

Does anyone here think magical abilities are a must in characters, or do you think characters with no magic whatsoever are viable?




Ted Zlammy -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/16/2013 17:03:11)

Characters without magic powers are definitely viable. It's just that magic tends to add in a "coolness factor" of sorts. I mean, sure you can RP a swordsman, but why not RP a swordsman that can also shoot lightning from his fingertips instead? Because of such, there tends to be more characters that can use magic along with brawn, so people tend to do it as well lest they be outclassed by their peers should a duel come along. Personally I'd like to RP a character sometime who can't do any magic, but is surrounded by people who can. It'd just be amusing to try and figure out how the heck he'd get out of sticky situations, hehe.




Lord Darkblade -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/16/2013 17:08:30)

I like both, sure magic is interesting, but melee characters have more appeal to me, I just add in magik, for awesomeness.




TJByrum -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/16/2013 17:23:26)

I may be alone here, but I have a sort of hatred for magic, although I use it now to keep on par with other characters. I never use magic in TES, and disliked it when all that Apple of Eden stuff happened in Assassin's Creed. It's just... I dislike it, strongly.

To be without magic feels like letting everyone have an advantage over you. I just didn't know.




TormentedDragon -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/16/2013 18:06:00)

A word on the alignment chart, and how it is often misused:

For some reason, people seem to think that the alignment chart necessarily locks your character in to a certain set of actions. This rigidity of thinking is what is actually harmful to both character and roleplay, not the chart itself. The key is to realize that what Captain Barbados said regarding the Pirate Code applies here as well: the Alignment chart is more guidelines than actual rules.

The real purpose of it is to define a certain set of motivations and guidelines for general character behavior, as a quick reference for both yourself and the others in your group. The good and evil axis is perhaps best interpreted in terms of selflessness and selfishness - the good have a tendency to think of others and act to their benefit, perhaps at the expense of the self, the evil have a tendency to think of themselves and act to their own benefit, at the expense of the others, and the neutral might help another or themselves, but generally not to the point of sacrifice or to the point of harm.

You can apply this idea of selflessness or selfishness to a grander scale, too - worldviews and philosophy. Good characters will see organizations, governments, campaigns, crusades as opportunities to improve lives, to create wellbeing, etc. Evil see them as methods for personal gain. Serve the people, or serve the government, etc. Neutral may not really care, or may have some idea of there being a grand balance to the world.

As for lawful - chaotic axis, it's a rubric of how tied to law they are. The more lawful you are, the more you hold to rules and regulations, and try to act within the context of the law as it stands. The more chaotic you are, the less use you have for laws. You may even consider them to be harmful - those of chaos see nothing wrong with thumbing their nose at law and law enforcement or acting outside the system. It does not mean they have no moral code, mind, but they care nothing for society's terms of how it should be applied.

Neutral falls in the middle, again. They may see the merit of law, but are less holden to it. They may simply not care that much about it beyond making sure they aren't inconvenienced by law-breaking, or might have some kind of philosophy on there being a need to balance laws with leniency, etc.

Combine the two for great justice: lawful good suggests a character who believes in the power of law to promote the health and wellbeing of the people, or could simply be someone who is genuinely good-hearted and likes to follow the rules, or any other option you can think of. There is similar flexibility in each of the other five alignments, so long as you do things right and make alignment fit the character concept, rather than trying to shoehorn character concept into a rigid idea of what the alignment dictates.

Additionally, alignments can easily change. If the character doesn't seem to fit what you picked for alignment, modify the alignment! If a character has a philosophical shift in their view of morality, rework the listed alignment to fit! Alignment is not intended to be static. It is not intended to be rigid. It is not intended to limit your choices.

It just provides a basic framework, a reference point, to describe their motivations and give an idea of what they might do in a given situation.

Now, all that said, it's not necessary. It can be useful, but you only need it if the system you're playing in requires it, which these boards don't. If you like it, use it, if not, don't. But it's not the horrible thing I see it being made out to be, provided you use it right.




Lord Darkblade -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/16/2013 18:50:49)

^Exacta.




dethhollow -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/16/2013 23:08:59)

@ TD

Pretty sure I remember hearing something in psycology class that's basically what you're saying but without the ties of something being escentially good or evil. It was something like the Base level of morallity, the Pre-social level, and the Post-social level. I probably got that completely wrong, but I remember what each one was about. The base level was like what you're discribing evil as. Just doing something for yourself. Like if you were to steal candy because you liked it or cheat on a test just to feel good about the grade. Or, in more RP-based examples, like if your character went after power for the sake of having power.

Does that make someone inherently evil? Not exactly.... It makes them self-centered, but that isn't necessarely the same as being evil or doing wrong for the sake of doing wrong. It's kind-of more like being neutral or something, I'd think? Anyways, then there was the Pre-social level which is doing things because it's what's socially acceptable. For example, if your character followed the villian since they were used to them being in control or tried to act nice to the group because they didn't want to come off as a jerk.

Basically, it's what's usually discribed as the order allignment, but it's not restrictive in the same ways. For example, say you're from a city and you go to meet up with some kind of tribe or something. Someone in the order allignment would just follow the new traditions no matter what from my understanding, but someone in the Pre-social level might not be so willing to change. Then there's the Post-social level which is basically doing stuff because you think it's right. Who cares about imagry or social norms, this is about personal philosophy. Example would be if your character hates necromancers. A necromancer is your new neighbor, he's accepted by everyone else, but because you believe necromancy to be wrong you kill him even though it's not what's acceptable.

In that example, that really should fall in either good or evil allignment depending on how you look at things. Necromancy's kind-of not exactly a great thing, you're stealing the souls of the dead, but does that mean you have to kill them even if society says otherwise? Would it be like "they don't know how bad it is" or would that be more like "I don't like him so I'm going to end his life"?

That's one of the problems I have with allignments. They may be guidelines for base characters, but simple moral delimas can completely bust it right open like nobody's buisiness. That simple example could either indicate someone good, evil, chaotic, or potentially with order since they believe necromancy to be against natural laws. Might even be able to put it down as neutral, when you consider it.

Using it as guidelines is ok, I guess, but it's still something I would have to heavilly warn against. It's a pretty dangerous mindset if you're not prepared for it....




black knight 1234567 -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/17/2013 6:48:03)

I don't mind magic in RP's, I tend to kind of apply a bit of both. I rarely go full on wizard, nor go full on warrior. As for the alignment chart: I like dynamic alignments, myself. I change how my character may feel or react based on certain situations. You can never be always good and lawful, nor always evil and chaotic. I, myself, am a fan of the Chaotic Good. The law is not always bringing justice, sometimes, you must break a few boundaries and take things to your own hands.

One thing I want to bring out is: what do you guys think about ''inspiration'' of characters? do you not mind it when people borrow aspect from other fictional characters, or do you have a dislike for it?




Ted Zlammy -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/17/2013 8:29:43)

^
I don't mind it when people borrow aspects of other fiction characters usually. It's fun and sometimes necessary to borrow aspects from other characters for inspiration, but I don't care for it when people make carbon copies of said fictional characters though. Let's use Harry Potter for example, because well, who hasn't heard of him in the past decade what with all the movies based on the novels? Anywho, if a character pops up that has a curious scar on their face, wears glasses and uses a wand along with silly made up phrases to cast magic but has a unique backstory and personality, I'd probably just chuckle and let them do whatever. If said character had like practically the same origin story, personality and goals as Potter, I'd facepalm and say why.

Honestly, I'm not sure why I dislike it when people practically use other fictional character other people created in RPs. I get how it'd be fun to RP a favorite character of yours, but I just feel like doing so would bring great injustice to said character. Plus, I find the fun part of RPing is creating a unique personal character and using them, and missing out on that somewhat sad. X-D




dethhollow -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/17/2013 10:05:52)

The reason people like to include magic in thier characters is because it allows so much extra creativity. Most of the time, it's hard to make a completely new type of weapon without copying an existing style of combat or crossing the suspention of disbelief. There is only so much you can do discribing a human body in motion, but there's an infinate ammount of ways to discribe a fire spell and what effects it has on the environment. Makes things so much easier.

As for the thing about using ideas for other characters. Considering how many characters have ever been created, you're bound to run across characters with similar traits and abilities to yours. It's like the saying goes that nothing's ever truely been invented since the basis for it was always around in one form or another. I could make a character with the ability to form a sword out of raw mana. But no matter how different he is, people could still look at that and think "so it's a lightsaber" or "Zero from Megaman".

All I can really say is try to be original unless you're making a parody character. But if you do that, then at least aknolage it's a parody or get clever about your references.




Lord Darkblade -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/17/2013 12:00:19)

Originality? My characters(from the UCaG) are just basics, name, abilities, bio, weaponry, but they end up evolving into actual people with a story. I like to reuse the names/backstoryies of my characters sometimes, because I'm lazy.




Eukara Vox -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/17/2013 12:32:31)

Since I tend to use myself when creating characters I think I am safe from borrowing pop culture icons, characters, etc.

As to magic? I like it if it is the right place and time. If it goes with the world, RP and character, but I also think it is a good idea to play a mundane character too. You need balance creatively.

One thing I really despise is the people who create magic characters who... are just SOOOO AWESOME. Even though magic to most people is a thing of fantasy, reality dictates that should such talents exist, they would be riddled with repercussions, problems, vulnerabilities, weaknesses and perhaps ostracising. They would have pitfalls and strengths, curses and blessings. I tend to see people create a magic weilding character as an almost guarantee that they will come out on top.

I used to punish RPers for trying that stuff. And the punishments were... humiliating.

Man I miss hosting...




Starstruck -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/17/2013 16:23:27)

quote:

I tend to see people create a magic weilding character as an almost guarantee that they will come out on top.
MY CHARACTER HAS A SPELL THAT LETS HIM EXPLODE ANYONE FROM THE INSIDE OUT THAT HE CAN USE OVER AND OVER AGAIN

DOES THAT MAKE HIM INTERESTING

Joking aside, I kind of like magic a lot. It's a bit of a problem when I create physically powerful characters (Yuxe is waaay too strong, you guys, stop letting him into your RPs), but as a rule, I like it when my character has unnatural abilities. I like writing about them, I like thinking about them, and I like using them.

But most of all, and I think this is what makes people okay with my personal brand of magic, is that I make each spell or ability thematically appropriate. For some people, magic is a tool for allowing your character to do anything. For me, it is a way to enhance the concept of a character. My fighter character doesn't have any long-ranged artillery spells, but I have absolutely no qualm about putting like 5 of them on my weak and scrawny mage character. However, my fighter character does have many close-ranged abilities or boosting skills that enhance his ability to fight. Keep your fighters fighters, keep your mages mages. If you can't tell the difference, don't stuff mage spells on a fighter character. Hybrids are okay, but they're hard to handle.

(side note, Deth: Kohlberg: Preconventional, Conventional, Postconventional.)




Ted Zlammy -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/18/2013 11:13:24)

Speaking of magic... What do you people think of wonder boys/wonder girls?

Meaning, what do you think of dem' teenager characters that can cast spells as well as old wizards with a life time of knowledge, or fight as well with a blade as a grizzled veteran that fought in an army for over two decades? I get that people might want to RP a character close to their age that can also fight well, but eh, I find it silly when there's an excess of them in an RP. Why, one time I was in an RP using a guy in his fifties, who was surrounded by teenagers. Honestly I forget what it was about, but I just remember that bit. X-D




TJByrum -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/18/2013 13:15:28)

To be honest?

I dislike any RP character with skill that is below the age of 21. Can't stand a couple of 16 year old girls prancin around casting powerful magic.

My characters are always about 30-40 years of age to show experience.

But that's just me.




Legendium -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/18/2013 13:17:23)

@Ted

I think wonder boys/girls are too unrealistic for me. Now, a vampire teen who's that good I could understand, but not a human 13 year old who should have next to no experience.




Lord Darkblade -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/18/2013 14:16:59)

I call them sorcerers, just very powerful sorcerers.




TJByrum -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/18/2013 15:50:13)

So what do you think of a purely-focused mage VS a purely-focused warrior? Or rogue?

I know there is no real classification for them, they're just templates, but assuming an armored warrior with shield and sword fought a mage with robes and spells.




Ted Zlammy -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/18/2013 16:16:39)

Aye, I'm also not into them wonder boy/wonder girls myself. If there's some good reason for it, like them being an earlier mentioned vampire or some pureblooded powerful sorcerer, and possibly them being the chosen one, I might not mind it as much. I tend to make my characters in the 20-60 age range so (Usually I'm in the 20-30 though), so my characters have had a fair bit of years in them for training.

@TJB

Hmm. Hard to say who would win really in any match up of the three basic class types. If I were to make a combat triangle between the three I'd think; Mage > Warrior > Rogue > Mage. Rogue might be able to stick in an arrow into the mage's face quickly from afar (or a dagger into his neck if he gets close enough due to sneakiness), mage could pelt the warrior with an assortment of spells from afar til he just stops moving, and the warrior can just get close enough to the rogue to hurt him by using their superior defense.

Granted, several variables can change how a fight could go. Three examples being; If the warrior's shield and armor was able to hold up against most of the mage's spells, he could get close enough to run the mage through with his blade. The mage might be able to burn the rogue's bow to nothingness and just nuke the rogue from afar, and the rogue might be able to tire out the warrior due to his speed and jab into an opening of the warrior's armor.




Legendium -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/18/2013 16:17:15)

It all depends on the situation. Thinking of a mage as a person wearing no armor and throwing ranged spells, the way to trump the warrior is to stay away and roast them in their own armor. Take away the space, and the warrior wins. The rogue wins by getting into the correct position to take the enemy unawares. Face to face combat isn't really the rogue's specialty. So, one cannot say "A rogue is better than a warrior." The correct thing to say is "X is better than Y in Z situation." Then there are hybrids, like warrior rogues and spellswords, etc. So yeah.

Are we not getting off topic?




Lord Darkblade -> RE: Making Interesting Characters (Discussion) (5/18/2013 16:24:28)

The cycle, like what Ted said, Mage>Warrior>Rogue>Mage, and so forth, although, add in something like psionics and then you now have it where the Psion/psychic is better than them all, unless they just have some of the abilities.

And it really does depends on the situation, like what Legendium said, a mage could beat a warrior just by staying out of his range.




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