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RE: Becareful what you wish for.

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7/15/2011 0:59:17   
TTG Sean
Member

Get Rid of The Stinkin Plasma Rain
AQ DF MQ Epic  Post #: 26
7/15/2011 0:59:28   
Womba
Member

But don't you know? Pigs CAN fly! Strap them to a catapault or shove them into a cannon and fire away!

@julian I agree with that... Mage has usually been the Damage Dealing (offensive) type of class in MANY games. Giving them defensive skills and buffs only serves to turn them into Battle-Mages... A mage that can dish out damage, AND take it... Hmmm...
DF AQW  Post #: 27
7/15/2011 1:11:18   
king julian
Member

This isnt the place for suggestions TTG sean and now we can rely have a str dex blood and no they didnt since u get back energy from assimilation they gave the next best thing with defense and also has a energy regain we both have a replacement for assimilation and defense.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 28
7/15/2011 1:34:15   
Remorse
Member

^ I like your tac merc shield idea, I will add it because i wasn't really sure to give them defence matrix. because than too many classes wil have that skill.

As for the stunning part, I'm just guessing here but I think this is why the devs decided to remove asimilation as they cant remove the new skills (well would seem pointless) they cant remove the multi, and im asuming the only reason the didnt swap it for overlorad rather than asimilation was because all skills must have a stun, but if this is not the case than your right leave plasma canonan as is.

< Message edited by Remorse -- 7/15/2011 1:38:02 >
Epic  Post #: 29
7/15/2011 1:38:22   
king julian
Member

bloods didnt get nerfed they got what they asked for since the devs listen.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 30
7/15/2011 1:50:57   
Thylek Shran
Member

CYBER HUNTER: Is pretty much the same. 7% more then before really is not going to make that big of a difference. (CH needs another passive just like every other class in the game has one.)

Strongly agree. Static Charge should be replaced by Reroute. CH is still to weak.

TACTICAL MERCENARY: Got a small nerf. One of their passive needs to be taken away in order for the class to be anywhere near beatable. (A small decrease in poisen damage/frenzy % and a club requirement is not acceptable)

Agree too. Their Reroute should be replaced by Static Charge maybe. Even that Toxic Grenade is maybe still overpowered because its initial dmg is high, they have so many other great skills and build choices. The only class which combines tank and offensive skills like Smoke Screen.

BLOOD MAGE: Got nerfed in amidst a failed attempt to make it slightly better. (One of BM's key skills was taken in the process)

I think Reflex Boost is much better than Assimilation and they can regen much more energy with it while getting
defense and boosting their dex skills. They can even boost both dex and tech now which is 5 of 12 skills.
Is this a comeback of Super Charge builds ? I think BM are balanced now maybe even a bit to strong but lets see.
I would have gave them Defense Matrix instead of Reflex Boost because they now have some of the best skills out
of the 3 base classes and the synergy effect between Reflex Boost and Technician could make problems.
Just imagine Plasma Cannon and Plasma Rain with both buffs up. High Defense and very high dmg while regaining
health from Blood Lust and energy from Reflex Boost...

< Message edited by Thylek Shran -- 7/15/2011 2:00:54 >

_____________________________


v.35.3 (2016-01-23) ~ beam.to/shran
DF Epic  Post #: 31
7/15/2011 1:55:44   
Remorse
Member

^ I dont think removing asimilation was exactly waht they asked for... Although lesson leared maybe next time when player sugest skills that need to be added they should also state what it should take the place of!
Epic  Post #: 32
7/15/2011 2:16:50   
Nexus...
Member

Nice points. I still think assimilation was a valuable skill for blood mages, but agree with you that Reflex may push things over the edge. For now I think Blood Mage is pretty much balanced. Cyber Hunter really needs that second passive, and one of TLM's passives needs to be taken...its that easy.
Epic  Post #: 33
7/15/2011 2:23:22   
goldslayer1
Member

@nexus
dude removing a passive from tac merc would make them UP.
as for one of the skills there. technician i dont like it. so IMO trade it for berserker.
AQW Epic  Post #: 34
7/15/2011 2:36:57   
Celestine
Constructive!


 [@goldslayer1]:
Actually getting rid of Reroute would, if anything, would level the playing field. Reroute is not needed to survive, if anything it contributes to the overpowered-ness of that class.
Being able to use Frenzy multiple times, as well as Field Medic, and Smoke Screen. All deadly combo's.

But before TLM's come at me with pitchforks and flame torches, why not just reduce the effect of reroute to let's say 18%-20%.

Also, giving Berserker to TLM is a horrible idea with all the Strength Builds running rampant.
I'd rather be smoked and beat by a robot than be a 2 turn puppet.

Seems like the definition of Underpowered to a TLM is equivalent to the definition of Balanced to the other classes. Funny, is it not?

-Celestine

< Message edited by Celestine -- 7/15/2011 2:37:26 >
DF Epic  Post #: 35
7/15/2011 2:41:16   
goldslayer1
Member

@celestine
well the original merc always had to rely on having exact ammounts of energy and then some to stay away from assimilation.
but u seem to be ofrgeting that altho it has technician and smoke. it doesn't have intimidate therefor tac mercs are beatened by str bh alot.
i was a str bh about 18 hours ago. and was beating tac mercs because they did not have intimidate like the normal mercs did.
i can also see why some bloodmage with thought out builds didn't have alot of trouble with TLMs.

and i was being sarcastic about the zerker lol.
AQW Epic  Post #: 36
7/15/2011 2:46:12   
Thylek Shran
Member

quote:

But before TLM's come at me with pitchforks and flame torches, why not just reduce the effect of reroute to let's say 18%-20%.

That would nerf Tech Mages too and this would be bad.
DF Epic  Post #: 37
7/15/2011 2:53:00   
goldslayer1
Member

@thylek
i think she's refering to only tac merc's reroute
either way, a smart tlm wont max reroute. max reroute + hybrid mean su can only maxx out one other skill. then ur basically run out of attack options.
AQW Epic  Post #: 38
7/15/2011 2:55:18   
Fatal Impact
Member

^ almost all of my builds have 3 things maxed.. lol
Epic  Post #: 39
7/15/2011 2:59:06   
Celestine
Constructive!


 [@goldslayer1]:
Yet, even without Reroute, Mercs were doing fine before the introduction of new classes.
Perhaps, even the best class if the Strength BH build wasn't around.

& yes I do agree that the most challenging class and build for a TLM is a Strength BH.
That being said, why are no other classes and builds this challenging? Says a lot, doesn't it?

[@Thylek]:
I'm only suggesting the reduction on TLM's Reroute.
Leave TM's Reroute alone. They're fine with Reroute since what will they spam? Plasma Bolt? Multi? lol

Unlike TLM's which can spam powerful skills.

-Celestine
DF Epic  Post #: 40
7/15/2011 3:03:25   
goldslayer1
Member

quote:

Yet, even without Reroute, Mercs were doing fine before the introduction of new classes.
Perhaps, even the best class if the Strength BH build wasn't around.

& yes I do agree that the most challenging class and build for a TLM is a Strength BH.
That being said, why are no other classes and builds this challenging? Says a lot, doesn't it?

the old mercs did fine because they had key skills that tac mercs dont have. and that happens to also be what tac mercs are weaker to.
like intimidate so t makes them weaker towards str builds, this includes bloodmages)

its not always about the class. but about the player.
for example Deathnightmare is a tech mages and he still gets quite the good % that he usualy gets even tho people claim that half of ED is tac merc.
AQW Epic  Post #: 41
7/15/2011 3:14:47   
Celestine
Constructive!


 [@goldslayer1]
Can you list the key skills? Seems to me TLM got the better half of their original skill tree.
The skills gone such as Bunker Buster which wasted too much energy, Berserker which was unstable since it could be blocked are not needed for the new TLM's.
Smoke + Maul + Strike is more stable than Maul + Berserker.

Intimidate wasn't used much from my experience, but it is effective against Strength BH's.
Not against BM's. You can easily tank out a BM being a TLM. If you are not a tank but rather a Strength TLM, then you can easily out-damage a BM. Ironic, isn't?

Also, I know the player is an important part of success in ED.
Don't know how that helped your argument, but alright.

-Celestine
DF Epic  Post #: 42
7/15/2011 3:33:55   
goldslayer1
Member

@celestine
Bunker buster is one of those skills. quit powerful and a game changer but consumed alot of energy. and if survived past that the merc would have trouble winning.
while some used it during their 1st turn some saved it for the time it was needed. however an EMP mostly would ruin this strategy.
bunker buster + tank and intimidate would be able to tank str builds mercs and str bh alike.

well maul requires a club. the players with swords wouldn't be able to use that or frenzy.
the build i have atm has the same ammount of str that my bloodmage build had. and the bloodmage build was quite good. berserker and deadly aim dealing good gun damage and berserker (altho it can be blocked its sometimes worth the risk) will regain alot of hp thru bloodlust.

and IMO alot of people should use energy staff. because TLMs will most likely have lower resistance. while they can use a gun like stun cannon (physical) which gives good str and dex + enhancements.

and while str tac mercs do have smokescreen, smokescreen is better with high tech builds because it can be raised with tech. most str tac mercs builds dont have that high of energy.

and i see bloodmages as the old str merc with a little mixx of BH. dealing alot of damage quick while not always be able to win.
in this case bloodmages are weak to defense (maybe not anymore because of reflex) just like the old str mercs were to resistance.
bloodmage is a str based class therefor should get a % like the old str merc did (80-90%)

and the player being a part of their strategy does make sense because alot of the complainers that said certain class needs to be nerfed and certain needs to be buffed didn't exactly have very well though out builds. and thought out builds will do more than copy and paste builds.
AQW Epic  Post #: 43
7/15/2011 4:12:23   
.PinkMoose.
Member

Shadow Arts was put with Bloodlust which is OP'ed and still is
Epic  Post #: 44
7/15/2011 5:45:38   
drinde
Member

So sadly true. I say take away Smokescreen from TcMs and give it to BloodMages!
DF MQ Epic  Post #: 45
7/15/2011 5:54:07   
drinde
Member

Remove Smokescreen from da TcMs.
DF MQ Epic  Post #: 46
7/15/2011 6:01:08   
Nebula
Member

@King Julian No, we got nerfed. Assimilation is so much better than Reflex, therefore our skill tree got nerfed.

@Remorse Actually, me and others suggested skills to replace for Reflex or Matrix, none of those suggestions involved taking our Assimilation away. The only suggestions that did were complete idiots who had never played BM and though "field commander would be more useful"

The should have replaced Intimidate or Plasma Rain with Reflex, they're the most useless skills on our skill tree. Assimilation was probably the most useful/
Post #: 47
7/15/2011 6:03:29   
Silver Sky Magician
Member


 Toxic Grenade should have been nerfed a little more. Not only is it unblockable, it doesn't have any stat requirements and costs less than half the EP when maxed as compared to venom strike! To top it off, it even does more poison and base damage than venom strike.
Post #: 48
7/15/2011 6:08:02   
drinde
Member

@bove
eh, I think Toxic Grenade does 25% base.

< Message edited by drinde -- 7/15/2011 6:23:03 >
DF MQ Epic  Post #: 49
7/15/2011 6:17:33   
elm street
Member

i finished all skill trees for the three new classes to bring balance. they are ofc rough drafts but people seemed very supportive of the CH tree i made firstly. the trees balance the classes and even include 6 new skills (even worked out at being 2 ea class), 2 new unique debuffs and 2 new deffense modifers, as well as a little tweaking in order and rates. ill post the full trees later today for everyone to review and revise. if i gain as much support as i did with CH ill take the idea to the devs, but i want the whole community working on the trees before i turn them in to be reviewed.

Skill trees for the people, by the people cant really beat that if everyone is happy

< Message edited by elm street -- 7/15/2011 6:18:43 >

_____________________________

God has a sense of humor, just look at the platypus http://www.newhotstuff.net/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/platypus.jpg
Epic  Post #: 50
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