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RE: =ED= Weapon Stats Rehaul

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3/28/2012 21:37:08   
Stabilis
Member

The total score of a weapon. This is a combination of how many damage points and stat points a weapon has.
AQ Epic  Post #: 26
3/28/2012 21:38:09   
Basicball
Member

question: can we have a graph showing exactely where J6' lightsaber is?

pwetty pwease?
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 27
3/29/2012 2:51:49   
Nub Apocalypse
Member

I must say, I am really disappointed with this update. I am totally against the idea of changing the stats of existing weapons. You cannot simply just change what we have already bought. Many of us bought specific items for the sole reason of their stat-ting. This change could potentially risk hundreds of dollars I have invested in this game. I believe that variation in the weapon stats are a rather good thing. Having every weapon of the lvl to be of a similar power lvl just makes everything duller. Some weapons should be stronger than others. Rare weapons are usually strong because they are hard to obtain. People might argue that they should simply be collectors' items, but most players in the game are not collectors themselves, and being rare doesn't serve any purpose at all to me if it does not give me an advantage in battle. Yes, call me an abuser, EpicDuel is a PvP game, I play competitively in battles, I strive to win. In a game about winning, I really couldn't care less how rare an item is. I don't mind if you slowly balance these stats with future releases, but is blatantly unacceptable for you to charge us for buying items and then possibly change them to a state of uselessness. What exactly is the reason people buy new weapons? It is because they are stronger, they add variation to builds, making them all similar in power just decreases the minimal strategy this game already requires.
Post #: 28
3/29/2012 3:07:16   
Ranloth
Banned


 You know most of the items will be getting a buff, and weapons like Mjolnir will be slightly put down, right? Betas will be affected too but that's pretty much it.
And I don't see how Lvl 25 weapon that has +25 damage and +8 stats is fair if other Lvl 25 weapon has +23 damage and +6 stats. Nope, isn't at all.

Oh and they will still change it, it's called balance. AQ has Sweep that affects whole game, including rares, and no one minds even though it's old perma-rare. Why? It's for Balance and will happen. They will have similar power level but you can see some weapons at a given level range are above - that's probably rare weapons which get small advantage. Every item will have stats in different places, it'll put some creativity to builds earlier on as curently most of weapons until Lvl 25-28 suck stat wise and sometimes damage wise.
AQ Epic  Post #: 29
3/29/2012 3:09:52   
Striker44
Member

That's mean stats and requirements remains ,only damage changing ?
Post #: 30
3/29/2012 3:24:37   
Nub Apocalypse
Member

From what I see in the graph, there are a quite balanced number of nerfs and buffs. Most of the buffs come in the lvl 20-30 range where true competitive play hasn't really sank into most players' minds yet. And I do not consider a strong lvl 25 beta weapon unfair. Like I explained with the relation in rarity, it is very rare, and so should contain a higher value. With the exception of the recent caster mage builds, the beta weapons are quite useless (par from blaster) after around lvl 30 when compared to other items. And how long does lvl 25 - 30 take? A week? The time you are able to use it effectively limits the lvl of 'opness' it has.

And for AQ, that game is a single player RPG. Who cares if they change the weapons a little? It'll hardly affect the game and their ability to win. In ED it is different, changes in items may cost players their ability to win against others. And I fail to see how hundreds of weapons with a similar power lvl will have much variation. They will likely end up with many items having close to identical stats.

And that is not my main point still, what I have been trying to say is you cannot change what we already have. We spent our money to get a specific item, only to have it changed to something else, an altered product. I refuse to accept this type of change in the game.

< Message edited by Nub Apocalypse -- 3/29/2012 3:29:07 >
Post #: 31
3/29/2012 4:33:20   
Ranloth
Banned


 AQ or not, Balance is balance.
It's in T&C that ED has full right to change their products and you've agreed to it upon registering so you cannot refuse as you agreed to it.
Similar power? Top Lvl items are all the same already yet we buy them anyway. Change will happen and it's good one as almost all weapons are due to get a buff and only those OP weapons will get a nerf. A lot of weapons will be useful and I fail to see how it's bad because it's a change to an item.

It will happen, you agreed to it upon registering and it will improve balance overall. ;)
AQ Epic  Post #: 32
3/29/2012 5:00:56   
drinde
Member

Oh thank you thank you thank you!

Wait... I sense a Mjolnir nerf. NUOOOO!
DF MQ Epic  Post #: 33
3/29/2012 5:14:08   
Khimera
Member

Before I start ranting, I'd like to make it explicitely clear that everything here is entirely my opinion, and may not be shared by Froth, Shari, or indeed anybody else on the team. Furthermore, a good deal of my input takes the form of bouncing ideas, theorising, and discussing balance logic, particularly with Shari. I can only comment on my ideas, and what I have proposed, not what is planned to be implemented in any way, or at any point in the future.

For anybody who is worried that re-balancing the weapons will cause rigid stats and a lack of variety - This can be true if all weapons are simply read off a spreadsheet. However, there are many creative ways to alter weapons while maintaining balance, some of which don't even require additional coding. For instance, once a reasonable damage:stats ratio is in place, you can make weapons damage-heavy or stat-heavy, within reasonable limitations - Shari and I have discussed such theoretical features in the past, and I even mocked up some numbers. Then you have various power modifications to take into consideration, such as whether the weapon is rare, varium, promotional, etc. And these can be applied in a number of ways, which I won't go into detail here for fear of getting too drawn into the numbers.

I haven't had a chance to peruse the thread fully, so I'll return later to reply to any other worries of criticisms with my own views.
Post #: 34
3/29/2012 8:11:41   
8x
Member

1. Will this update affect rares and seasonal-rares too or only normal weapons?

2. Who is the staff member that uses Pin Blades?? Nvm it's Nightwraith.

< Message edited by 8x -- 3/29/2012 8:15:27 >
Epic  Post #: 35
3/29/2012 9:15:41   
Basicball
Member

^ j6 has em as well (no wonder NW neirly killed me when i fought him O.o)



_____________________________
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 36
3/29/2012 9:33:20   
aomont
Member

Will we get a retrain to reajust stats after this update ?
Epic  Post #: 37
3/29/2012 10:03:37   
Oba
Member

I assume that the beta weapons will get changed statwise and get requirements. But how about Founder armor? Will it be a nerf on this one? If so, I suggest making a lvl 30(maybe even higher?) version of it with the stats it have now.
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 38
3/29/2012 11:18:12   
Ranloth
Banned


 @aomont
I believe so as it'll affect literally everyone so it'd be a nice thing to do. :)

@Oba
It's a Weapon Stats overhaul. :P Armor might be done too but not yet I'd say and it isn't that strong really. Also requirements are not being changed in this update but they are planning on removing them fully from all weapons BUT not yet as it'd create stat abusing so until solution is found to prevent abusing it w/o requirements, they'll stay. :P

@below
I thought about it as well, but if you look at Beta and Founder items - many would say that they are buffing (rewarding) them again and rants would happen. -.- Either solutions work although if they are Lvl 25 weapons, why raise their Level if they had advantage over a lot of items? Level changing should be a last resort solution but as I said - either can work.

< Message edited by Trans -- 3/29/2012 11:33:17 >
AQ Epic  Post #: 39
3/29/2012 11:28:58   
Remorse
Member

I have a question Rabble :)

For wepons to scale, Im guessing stats and damage would be lowered or increased.


Is it possible to however increase the actuly Level range of some wepons rather then nerfing them an extreme amount.

For example beta wepons and ....
We all know that something has to be done about them considering they are a level 25 wepons they are extremely overpowered.


But rather then nerfing it to dust,

Why not simply increase the level of the wepon to say lvl 30,
And leave the damage and stats the exact same.

If you think about it the extra stats beta wepons have compared to other lvl 30 wepons would be justified by the decreased wepon damage compared to other lvl 30 wepons.

In other words it would be similar to Some wepons such as Nightwraths gun (forgot the name) Which has lower dmagae for the level (+31 only) BUT increased stats in it's place.



Infact I think You could get away with neglecting Nerfing Many wepons etc. by simply increasing their level range in many cases. (When I say increase level I mean increase the level of already oped wepons so that the dmagae ans stats they give is suited to that level, WITHOUT changing the stats or damage at all.)

This means that perhaps people will be less anoyed by this release.

Just wondering on how you are going to approch this,

And if you would actuly be allowed to "increase the level range".

Thanks Remorse.


@ Above,

Whe I say increase the level of betas,

I mean increase the level BUT Not change the stats or dmagae AT ALL.
So people cannot complain because the wepons will be the exact same except lvl 21's cant abuse it to shreads.

Infact leveling up beta can be considered a nerf, IF the damage and stats are kept the same.

Think of it not as leveling up, Think of it as putting their power to their correct level.

< Message edited by Remorse -- 3/29/2012 11:38:38 >
Epic  Post #: 40
3/29/2012 12:40:46   
Oba
Member

@Trans, aha!
AQ DF AQW Epic  Post #: 41
3/29/2012 12:44:30   
Ranloth
Banned


 Yeah Remorse, I knew just raise in level and no power change and said some would see even that as a buff. :P So simply 2 options: nerf them to Lvl 25 standards + bonus for Varium/Rare item OR buff them up to right Level for their power which would be about 30 at max.

No problem, Oba.
AQ Epic  Post #: 42
3/29/2012 13:49:54   
happysmurf44
Member
 

 i need a like button for that one right there ahhahahahahahah cadense curse such a good pun\

now on topic are you guys doing anything for like alpha weapons in the sense that they truely are unusable for the very few of us that have them to show off as well as they dont mutate still is there anything in the boooks for those thigns?


< Message edited by happysmurf44 -- 3/29/2012 13:51:21 >
Epic  Post #: 43
3/29/2012 13:58:43   
Chosen 0ne
Banned


 Can't wait to see what you guys do.
DF AQW Epic  Post #: 44
3/29/2012 15:52:32   
Wootz
Member

I really like this update. Good job!
Does anyone even have a picture of that level 25 Wrist Blade which is obviously totaly powerfull!? ;)

I also have a question. How does the Sword graph look?
AQW Epic  Post #: 45
3/29/2012 16:35:58   
Rui..
Banned


 Froth what does the black line signify. Why is the line different on the graphs?
Post #: 46
3/29/2012 16:50:11   
Basicball
Member

^wootz: http://epicduel.artix.com/charpage.asp?id=nightwraith
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 47
3/29/2012 16:52:37   
Wootz
Member

Still it doesn't show it.
And it looks like he's wearing his Pikes ;)
AQW Epic  Post #: 48
3/29/2012 17:02:45   
Ranloth
Banned


 @Rui..
Black line is line of best fit. ^^
AQ Epic  Post #: 49
3/29/2012 17:14:28   
Wootz
Member

Oh and, RabbleFroth,
I belive Mjolnir is in the 2nd line above 40 Power. Meaning that under level 23, it isn't at the top. Secound place ftw!
AQW Epic  Post #: 50
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