RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (Full Version)

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Ranloth -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 11:16:03)

^ Minus BMs. They can't really compete as well, mostly due to Energy Parasite. Then there's just limited amount of builds, which is matter of buffing underused/underpowered skills, and then just focus on fixing the balance once and for all (i.e. blocks, crits, rage, etc.).

I've posted my feedback, and would very much love War NPCs with lower chance - than 1v1 has - to drop Bombs, and retain the 100 NPCs per day, so after that, you cannot get Bombs. This would take the stress away from NPCs. Basically this: http://forums2.battleon.com/f/fb.asp?m=21630302 (posted on previous page).



kosmo -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 11:23:44)

yeah, infact i said almost all classes

blood mage and tactical merc need some improoves, many of us already bought this up, and im sure the staff know this perfectly.

when they feel like it, they will fix it;
its alwaise confortable to have some inbalance to fix.



Ranloth -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 11:28:12)

I can cope with temporary imbalance, as long as each class can compete in one way or another, and they are working on long-term fix behind the scenes. Pretty much the main reason for War NPCs to be introduced, in my opinion, to take the stress away and make it a bit more enjoyable experience.

And missions. Content to play through is good.



kosmo -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 11:45:18)


i do understand the feelings of who doesn t want to jump, still being stuked whit limited classes, and i agree that they never should have left bm and tlm inaviable for so long, if i could imidietly do 1 change into this game, it would be this.

when i sayng that balance isn t that terrible i was referring to those who are using tm- bh-merc-ch, but still rage as hell because they dont know how to win.
the truth is that epic duel is an hard game, and too many players think that is possible to win whit no strategy.




Ranloth -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 11:48:16)

quote:

the truth is that epic duel is an hard game, and too many players think that is possible to win whit no strategy.

That's part of it, but there's still major imbalance behind the scenes, such as how nerfing and buffing shifts the balance greatly, how stat progression is a bit messy, etc.



One Winged Angel1357 -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 11:50:09)

I think they will use all the data from imbalance due to side numbers to help even out the the future locations.

I am only curious what they will do at the West Naval Yard as it is a tiny map



kosmo -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 11:50:37)

quote:

That's part of it, but there's still major imbalance behind the scenes, such as how nerfing and buffing shifts the balance greatly, how stat progression is a bit messy, etc.


sure, but this doesnt change my point.



Mother1 -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 11:59:12)

@ Kosmo

Look at who the game is targeted at now. Thanks to AE taking over their audience is guess what? Kids. For most kids playing a game that requires too much thinking would drive them away which is sad because epic duel is suppose to be targeted at teens to adults who would enjoy thinking games more. However all AE games are targeted at kids they have no choice but to dumb down the game so kids can do just that. Win without too much thinking. They can try to make it more thinking related but can only go so far with it.



kosmo -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 12:07:39)

quote:

they have no choice but to dumb down the game so kids can do just that. Win without too much thinking.


yeah they should be doing this, but there are prooves that they are doing the opposite.



Chosen 0ne -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 12:48:28)

Thanks for the picture of the limo Whitetiger.



Noobatron x3000 -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 19:56:37)

In the last week or so I have been playing my lower lvl 32 because im tired of the same old same old on my 40.... Anyway I have got my 32 to 36 now and I've prided myself all week on being able to stay in the top 10 on 2v2 dailys usually top 5. up to 35 I was fine a couple of hours ago I hit 36 and instantly realised not only is it going to be impossible to stay on the lb .... But its going to be impossible to play the game as often as I have. At best every other fight I am intercepting 2 40s usually every fight.... I cannot stay logged in when this is happening. Good message being sent to lower levels there. The game is only catering to 40's I just hope they don't get bored because no one else will stay logged in long at the top end of the game.



Mother1 -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 20:26:38)

@ Noobatron x3000

Complaining about the same things all over again over and over isn't going to make the staff do what you want them to do any faster. Esepecially when they are get this 2 programmers. Not 5 not 10 but 2 programmers!

I know you want them to fix the match making so you will be getting the illusion you are getting a fair fight every time, however until they come up with a solution for the wait times (Which is going to be the flaw here) that this would cause they aren't going to do anything about it.



Noobatron x3000 -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/15/2014 20:42:40)

^ Fine I give up

I'll join the masses. Hopefully the devs will learn in time to save the game by this point I doubt it.

I'm not just retiring my 40 im retiring all my character . I genuinely hope they learn whilst the player base is still in the 3 figures.



Remorse -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/16/2014 1:50:51)

Balance doesn't only mean all classes can compete or not.


A large part of balance should be opening up variety of builds within each class.


It is hardly balance just because for example all classes can compete providing they use a HP spamming STR builds.


When they get back to a time were build variety that could compete was high then balance will truly be better.


I miss the days were you could make a random build with a good concept to it and it was viable.

These days most build are shut down to OP build dominance and the lack of counter variety to cores and robots that make these dominating build harder to counter and easier to win with.



Mother1 -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/16/2014 3:10:44)

@ remorse

Tell me about it. Even in delta which you claim was horrid, there was a lot more build variety then there is now. Mainly because while it had some things you claimed made balance bad a lot of the things the omega brought didn't exist making it so more builds could work. That and a lot of the horrid balance changes they made weren't here.

I remember when classes were different in their own ways and that was what made them great. TLM was the best at tanking, but lacked in burst builds. TM had the best caster and energy gaining abilities but couldn't tank too well and so on.

But those days are done for now due to the masses complaining about how this class couldn't do what the other class could, or complained about their weaknesses and wanting them fixed.

Personally now I find balance extremely horrid, and it feels like torture to play just to do daily missions as well as compete in this war.

Whenever I go into battle most people ask me "Why aren't I using the hatching rush core?" Since majority of the time I am the only person in battle who doesn't own this core (and I won't either since I like my item I use)

But yeah each balance change that people scream for only seems to make the game worse and worse.



Remorse -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/16/2014 3:40:32)

^ If you though delta was good in terms of variety,

Then you would of loved beta.


Before robots were introduced their wasn't a fixed style of either focus or spam.

Before robots players mixed it up went hybrid spamming of two stats or medium spam high defense etc.

Robots in my opinion were actually the first variety constricting idea as it forced all builds to chose between spam or focus.

Nothing in-between could compete any more.



I believe to some degree their is the same issue, maybe the answer to free up variety (along with many other balance changes) is to free robot damage from focus and to dramatically decrease the power of full spam builds.


The result would hopefully a lower of the dominance of either focus or spam and thus opening up the build variety that was in-between these types of builds.



edwardvulture -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/16/2014 4:10:15)

^No more nerfs.... This is what happened when players just single out OP builds. The horrid balance we see today is the result of players complaining about a single or multiple builds and the devs responding to it by nerfing them.

What mother said about how each classes were special in there own way was right,but they took that away with the removal of passives.
And I agree with you about how robots and focus or originally bonus, constricted builds to the 45 45 45 45 or 40 40 40 40 format. But tbh at the time, hybrids of multiple stat spam builds still coexisted with the time of the robots. Btw, spam existed long before robots with the support merc build.



Remorse -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/16/2014 12:58:18)

^

Nerfs are not the issue,

The fact they do lousy band-aid nerfs are the the reason why they show little success.

Their current way of nerfing is like you said to single out the exact build, but they should be nerfing the full style.


For instance I think the whole style of STR builds are too strong.

Nerfing only one say STR BHs by making a requirement to massacre or smoke for instance is an example of their pathetic band aid nerfs that have indeed shown little results.

This is because it does not take much to make small adaptions to fit the almost the same build power into a similar build.



They need to bring out the big guns and perhaps change the whole stat, ensuring STR of all forms are brought down along with other overpowered strategies




The point is Buffing for balance is a terrible idea because classes are already over-powerful and buffing less powerful classes to the over-powerful level merely means each battle is about who starts/gets better luck because the same power ensures victory with effortless repeatable strategies.
When two build of the same power spamming style meet the Victor is almost completely determined by luck without strategy at all.



This is why classes and build styles need to be properly nerfed for balance to ensure strategy becomes a vital part of winning rather then the execution of an effortless powerful, un-counterable strategy.



edwardvulture -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/16/2014 13:33:26)

Is strength OP for someone with 45 strength? If the 45 strength does even less damage that would make it underpowered. They almost had stats perfected at one time. Allow me to show you the progression from Delta to Omega...

Nerf to HP--->nerf to str/support---->nerf to weapon damage--->nerf to skills---->nerf to Dex/tech---->huge nerf to crits/puny nerf to blocks.
Then somewhere in there, you add deflections to tech, passives to actives, and the only obvious good to have come out, the 10x update along with removal of enhancements of course....
Do you see the nerf cycle?

My whole idea Build Diversity x 10 is that go back to delta, re-do agility, so that stats can coexist in dominance just like they once did.



Noobatron x3000 -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/16/2014 23:04:56)

Strength and hp will most likely be nerfed its easier then buffing 3 stats up.

And honestly its needed playing defensive has always been underpowered now though more then ever.

The fact is if you see some1 with 700-900 hp on your side in 2v2 we all know your chances of winning are severely lowered against anyone exploiting strength and hp. And so many people are running around with low hp like lambs to the slaughter house.

Perhaps they just don't know how to exploit to compete in the broken environment the games in perhaps they are incapable of making a competitive build, perhaps they refuse to follow the sheep.

No one knows the only thing that's certain. They shouldn't have to.

But the fact is right now the only way to survive in delta v is strength and 1400-1600 hp or dex spam highish strength and 1000-1200 hp and hope to cash in on blocks.

Delta v is a boring place to be right now and a very broken one.

Dark times indeed .



Digital X -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/17/2014 10:22:35)

Just want to double check so I have this war thought out correctly:

1. I can fight at the shield screen, get drops, used them at the launchers either side?

2. Does it matter where I fight as long as it's in the war zone as I'm Legion.

Cheers.



Ranloth -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/17/2014 10:24:27)

1. You can fight anywhere to get the drops. They drop from PvP as a whole. Then use the Bombs at the most efficient Launcer/Turret. (read their description)
2. Read above



Digital X -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/17/2014 10:26:03)

OK thanks, easier than I thought.



Noobatron x3000 -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/17/2014 17:50:36)

I think until things are fixed and these is serious genuinely.

There should be a thread opened to alert people for instance when 1v1/2v2 is heavily crowded with build abusers / level 40s.

This would help people who don't want to be slaughtered in unjustified fights completely scaled against them , Or a way to tell whos waiting.

This solves a few problems no one complains....

No lambs are sent to the slaughter in fights that there hopelessly out levelled

And the victors don't get overly inflated wins they really didn't earn.

Things have become so laughable in 2v2 now you have people on the daily 2v2 leader board with names such as so f4ir



Scyze -> RE: =ED= March 7th, 2014 - Onward to War (3/18/2014 13:56:23)

I like the War 2.0, but how the game currently is... it's killing me. I recommend the Developers really spend the upcoming weeks on making Class balance. Before the new region is active, the update should come.



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