RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (Full Version)

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Mordred -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (8/19/2015 12:09:16)

@MW: Crossbows would only be effective at a range because reloading them was such a process it would leave one entirely exposed.

@GASKAL: I don't think that's the type of Ranger DF's going for. It's going more along the lines of LotR Rangers, lone warriors travelling around the world, trained in sword, bow, and a bit of alchemy. Not that the class won't use bow skills a good deal, only that it's not in the sense of a super-long range class or anything like that.




Neliux -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (8/19/2015 12:14:57)

The revamp I'm expecting the most, I love ranged classes and there's a lack of them in DF, except for TimeKiller but that's a rare.




GreenGuy23 -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/13/2015 13:15:24)

So, can someone explain to me exactly what the new popup is trying to say? I don't exactly understand it...

Also, I've been fighting the New Crawlers with the New Ranger, and they are definitely the one reason I wish Ranger had kept the Melee Focus :/




Bariman -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/13/2015 15:09:44)

The new Ranger gives a bonus on critical damage for left side skills and a bonus to hit on the right side skills. Once you hit 4 straight turns of skills to boost it, you have a chance at getting a free turn, too.

Also using a defensive skill causes the bonuses to reset to 0.




GreenGuy23 -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/13/2015 15:17:59)

I thought the Bonus was removed from the Melee skills?




Aura Knight -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/13/2015 15:21:10)

I thought melee focus was removed.




Bariman -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/13/2015 17:44:07)

It probably is. My mistake, I've only played with it once since the testing ended.




GreenGuy23 -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/17/2015 18:27:07)

How come SKy Assault only does one hit against two enemies? I thought it was 3 hits for 2 enemies, and 5 for 3 enemies? I guess I should report this to the Bug Report thing....




Aura Knight -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/18/2015 13:20:09)

Sky assault does no damage against a single enemy. Again, the animation is there but no hit is being landed.




Ash -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/18/2015 13:37:20)

Verly knows and is trying to work on a fix.




flashbang -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/18/2015 23:17:29)

So...

The flashbang part of the animation of the Flashbang skill plays. But the explosion thingy happens on the character.




Shadows Morgenstern -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/19/2015 1:09:10)

Flashbang has questions about the bang and flash of flashbang.




Sakurai the Cursed -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/19/2015 2:59:16)

quote:

The flashbang part of the animation of the Flashbang skill plays. But the explosion thingy happens on the character.

flashbang, you traitor!




flashbang -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (9/19/2015 23:27:00)

Of course, it's all part of my secret plan. Mwahahahaha!

Drat, that evil cat (or maybe it was the Ficus) found out about my plans! Now the flashbang part of the animation doesn't play! D: On certain monsters, it seems.
This is confusing. I used it on the Soaring Theemis in the Temple of the Winds and it didn't play the first time, but it does now. Ok. I'm gonna go lie down.




NarcissisticLee -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (11/30/2017 12:38:44)

Could someone update the Ranger guide? I would but I don't know how to gain access to editing it.




Steel_King -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (12/2/2017 13:11:37)

I really like Ranger personally. The passive is cool, and it is a tremendous help in boss fights to be able to take sequential turns.




xelessarx -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (12/10/2017 6:16:19)

Doesn't ranger need to scale by both Dex and Str?

Quoted from its Armor page:

quote:


Ranger has two unique features:

Ranged Focus: This class starts out at 175% Crit damage, however each time a Ranged skill is used, the crit multiplier will go up by 25% damage, stacking up to 5 times for 300% Crit damage. With a maximum Ranged Focus, there is also a 50% chance to attack a second time on your turn. Using any of the four defensive skills, Quick Reflexes, Cripple, Kick, or Recover will break your focus, subtracting four stacks.
Ranger will gain a damage bonus of +5% for having either STR or DEX as your main stat. If you invest in both stats roughly equally (plus or minus your level/10), you'll instead gain a damage bonus of +15%. Bonus stats gained from your equipped items also affect the damage bonus, so be careful not to have one stat go too much higher than the other. Having INT as your main stat gives you no damage bonus.


I have tried doing that and what I got as a result is that it doesn't even scale by Dex, let alone the %15 bonus :/

(Maybe stat page doesn't show the bonus but it is effected by Dex? Because against monsters it was seemingly more powerful.)

@below

I understand now. Thanks for the explanation!




Greyor_42 -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (12/10/2017 7:49:54)

@xelessarx

ranger gets a 15% buff on skill damage with that setup, not weapon damage. take, for example, the double attack, which normally deals 2 hits of 60% damage. if you scale STR and DEX equally-ish, it instead does 2 hits of 75% damage.

thing is, though, you actually sacrifice a bit of potential weapon damage by doing it that way, and it's better to balance DEX and LUK instead, since most of the ranger's skills are locked into pierce damage. while the skills only get the +5% buff in that scenario, the damage they deal is actually higher.



at least, that's how it was explained recently in a Q&A thread.




Sakurai the Cursed -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (12/11/2017 0:02:56)

Might as well copy/paste my post from there so it isn't lost to time: (so much good info lost in Q&A answers tbh, I wish they'd just archive them instead of deleting D:)

quote:

Since the Luk update, I'm not so sure. Even before the update, going Dex+Luk would give you similar, if a bit weaker, results; slightly more damage on the ranged skills, except for Purge which was about the same, but quite a bit less on Dual Wield, the only Melee skill that's used for damage. Since Luk was buffed by quite a bit, going Dex+Luk is generally stronger now. Using 91 average weapon damage and 30% crit chance and comparing 200 Str+Dex to 200 Dex+Luk, these are the numbers for the skills:

Str+Dex - 0 Focus ~ 5 Focus
----_Multi - 156.37 ~ 204.24 (multiply by 1, 3 or 5 to get Sky Assault's numbers)
--=Power - 183.57 ~ 239.76
----=Dual - 203.96 ~ 266.40
---_Purge - 349.65 ~ 849.15

Dex+Luk - 0 Focus ~ 5 Focus
-----_Multi - 175.33 ~ 238.85 (multiply by 1, 3 or 5 to get Sky Assault's numbers)
---=Power - 208.73 ~ 284.35
-----=Dual - 181.19 ~ 246.84
----_Purge - 377.52 ~ 900.24

So, here we can see that with a Dex+Luk build Multishot/Sky Assault are ~12-17% stronger, Power Shot is ~14-19% stronger, Dual Wield is ~11-7% weaker, and Purge is ~8-6% stronger. So you lose out slightly on Dual Wield, but you gain more than that on Power Shot so the normal Power -> Dual and repeat combo ends up slightly stronger. Meanwhile you also have stronger multis and Purge, and get more of a benefit from using Spotter since your crits are stronger. But the main benefit is that you can use Dex+Luk just as well with any other class, whereas with Str+Dex half your stats are wasted with anything but Ranger.




elixxon -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (12/11/2017 3:13:16)

@Rorshach

The way I know it a longbow overpowers a crossbow(of that era and place).
The reason why crossbowmen were used instead of longbowmen is because they take a long time of training an was very expensive since they had to be archers professionally while crossbowmen were far easier to train and did not need specific workout to be able to use the weapon.

I don't dispute that there are crossbows that are on par with a longbow, since there were pretty monstorous ones(they took forever to reload tho), but the reason crossbows pushed out warbows from the battlefield is the cheapness and easy use.


For a ranger like the one in the game a crossbow would be pretty bad choice. If you want a "trick under the sleeve" single shot weapon a crossbow just doesn't work with the all the space it takes up. Better borrow a pistol from Osprey Cove or one of them fancy shurikens of he ninjas.... or just stay immersive and use a throwing knife or chakram. ;)


EDIT: OMG did I seriously necro a 2yrs old post... didn't notice till it's too late.




Greyor_42 -> RE: =DF= Ranger Discussion Thread (12/11/2017 3:45:44)

@elixxon

quote:


The way I know it a longbow overpowers a crossbow(of that era and place).
The reason why crossbowmen were used instead of longbowmen is because they take a long time of training an was very expensive since they had to be archers professionally while crossbowmen were far easier to train and did not need specific workout to be able to use the weapon.

I don't dispute that there are crossbows that are on par with a longbow, since there were pretty monstorous ones(they took forever to reload tho), but the reason crossbows pushed out warbows from the battlefield is the cheapness and easy use.


actually, a standard medieval crossbow had a draw weight of 740 pounds, as opposed to the 64 pound draw weight of the medieval longbow, and the projectiles traveled at a speed on 138.7fps, which was five higher than a longbow. however, since the weight of the quarrel was lower(a crossbow quarrel weighed only half as much as an arrow at 1.25 ounces), they were actually about equal on the damage they dealt.

in fact, those "monstrous ones" you mentioned, the heavy crossbows, actually OUTPERFORMED the longbow in both damage and range, being the main driving force for plate mail armor getting heavier as the era went on.

but yes, the reason there were more crossbowmen was because they were easier to train(not needing any real training at all), which made them easier to replace, and, by extension, cheaper to use, while still giving more or less the same exact results as a soldier trained to use a longbow(aside from the superior firing rate and efficiency of the longbow).




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