RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (Full Version)

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Variation -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (5/20/2015 19:44:46)

Static Smash seriously does need to be looked at. Mainly the fact the energy gain is horrible when it gets blocked. I'd suggest keeping it blockable, but at least make the energy gain unblockable. The fact that a Mercenary will almost always lose against a good player when Static Smash gets blocked is more than enough justification for a change to the skill. No other classes have to deal with the issues Static Smash presents.

EDIT: They could also make the value it drains/gains constant(based on skill level) and simply make it unblockable, but that does take away the uniqueness from the skill. They could have it do what I first suggested and when it does block also have it drain n times more mana -- n would be chosen so that it would realistically drain less when blocked.



The berserker killer -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (5/20/2015 23:09:45)

Ill tell you what,the recent balance changes just killed this game



Stonehawk -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (5/21/2015 23:22:39)

It's funny how mercenaries risk energy stealing to gain 75% while bounties take it for sure and gains 65%.

By the way, I would suggest Frenzy instead of double swing. Let's face it, mercs can't recover energy and double swing is made to be used repeatedly... mercs definitely needs a second energy gain ...



Ranloth -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (5/21/2015 23:39:28)

^ Nah, Frenzy won't be added to Merc's skill-tree, nor is there a need. We have other changes planned for Mercs instead - will go live later today.



T.600 -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (5/22/2015 4:20:50)

I'm pretty sure they want to remove the club requirement on static smash, isn't that right, Ranloth? This would liberate merc builds a bit, because that weapon restriction essentially mandates the use of a club with 90% of merc builds which means less stats and damage of course.

@Stonehawk: That is a very valid point. However, mercs do have powerhouse skills like Bunker Buster and Surgical Strike which BHs don't have. Adding Frenzy sounds like a decent idea in theory, but let's not forget that it's blockable too. The fact that I've seen barely any high level mercenaries in 1vs1 (throughout the ''hardcore'' missions I only saw a handful) says it all; the class definitely needs a buff. I don't think the class has been the same since passives were removed. In light of this, I wonder if reducing the energy cost on hybrid armour would help. I'll wait and see what's in store for today's update.



Ranloth -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (5/22/2015 4:46:04)

Well, I personally do - and that's my view on it. I always wanted them gone off certain skills which are necessary in PvP, and that goes back to well over a year ago.

I don't think HA needs a lower cost either. Ideally, a tank build will keep it at L4-5 which is 180-200 EP for 4 turns, and can't be debuffed by any means. It's like a reverse SA, which has its pros and cons. If we were to do a proper EP decrease, which is something along the lines of -30 EP or so, we would have to cut down the duration by a turn instead (since %'s are fine as they are, imo). Besides, Plasma and Mineral Armor would have to follow the same change, so that's another thing to consider. It's considerably better with its current cost, than it was initially - which was +30 EP more than what it is now, IIRC.



santonik -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (5/29/2015 18:55:01)

after this update.

Mercenary class need better/ stronger static smash. (or others classes energy controll skills need nerf)


Boynty hunter is much better energy controll now. Stronger effect to energy controll (destroy/leech) Static emp basic damage is much higher than mercenary static smash.

Boynty using (about) 70 support stat
And mercenary must using about 100 str stat.
Now we have same damage to energy controll.
Both classes destroy about 300 energy and gain about 200 energy. if i remember correct.


Mercenary is big hard to destroy opponent energy now. STR nerf making this broplem. perhaps is time to seek a better balance. I think there is some ideas already how to make more balance.

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Perhaps it good to buff STR skilltree skills. This give str build more damage. NOTE (all classes)
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BTW i noticed merc static smash give buff. (unblockable)
2 nerf STR nerf and skill nerf. Other nerf is ok other isnt good. Because 2 nerf combination making merc energy controll pretty weak. if you want make you character to good energy controller. NOTE it need huge STR.




Ranloth -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (5/29/2015 20:05:10)

Don't compare EP draining skills, without looking at the skill trees. At the same time, BMs need a huge buff to Parasite because it doesn't compare to Assimilation + Battery Backup combo. Mercs have decent defensive capabilities, burst damage skill, and more strategically oriented skills, if you use them carefully. BHs have an offensive debuff, no burst damage skill, and rely on weapon damage + HP return. Both classes don't need huge amounts of EP to use skills, hence why they have weaker EP control skills - unlike TMs, which rely a lot on EP.

It has been done on purpose, that Static Grenade is superior for drain (at the same amounts of Str and Support), but about the same for the return. When comparing power of these skills, look at the skill trees first; don't compare numbers alone, when EP drain/return skills take plenty of other factors into account, when it comes to balancing them.



zer00x -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (5/30/2015 0:05:51)

@Ranloth

As you said, one thing that Merc has its burst damage skills, but its just if you are abusing a stat pretty much (like every class), if you spam tech of course bunker buster will do a lot of damage and the robot as well if you are a tech 5 focus, if you spam support you will get a crazy bazooka and multi, if you spam strenght.... well, with all the nerfs strenght got i THINK that Merc was the most affected, you guys already changed gun damage to dex (Thank you for that [:)]), so i think that you should do something about strenght which is a very important stat for Merc (double strike, berzerker, maul, blood commander (?), static smash), and important to other classes aswell.



Ranloth -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (5/30/2015 4:06:25)

Oh no, I get the Strength part. I am aware of what it did to Mercs as a class, and I do have few ideas for how to add a bit more variety but also give all Strength builds a small buff - without actually overpowering them. And this goes beyond Mercenary class; other classes also took a hit with Str nerf and also have some skills which could use a small buff.

I was just talking about Static Smash, in the above post. :p



.Lord Ginger. -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (6/9/2015 17:04:33)

I love how Bounty Hunter has a better energy steal than a mercenary.



King Bling -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (6/10/2015 6:09:22)

Merc static is pathetic, so pathetic, if you go merc knowing this then your a noob .-.

[Ya you -.- ]



.Lord Ginger. -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (6/10/2015 8:43:20)

Yea, but I win...a lot.

And thanks, I am a noob. xD



.Lord Ginger. -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (6/11/2015 22:38:03)

BUFF STATIC, PEOPLE RESPIND IN THIS POST



santonik -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (6/26/2015 16:41:27)

Mercenary need BIG buff.


---Double Strike---
This need little bit buff (more damage) maybe 5%

---Berkerzer---
This need little bit buff (more damage) maybe 10% or cost less energy

---Static Smash---
Too weak skill in energy controll. Need buff ASAP. or others classes need nerf owns energy controlls.

---Intimidate---
This need buff.
Now i see STR builds but it is not so high effect. It maybe take out 80~100 damage. But opponent can rising own damage much easyer. (smoke/malf)
smoke/malf is much better than intimitade. Intimitade cant STOP damage at all. this is huge broplem. at least low defence players. (support)
I have play 189 support. When i using 1 lvl intimitade it take off 52 STR. Still opponent can strike me over 450 damage. (NOTE STR) Maybe intimitade need remake and make similar BUT

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STR Merc Broplems is

Bad skill tree skills. Too low damage STR skills. Including static smash.

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Focus Merc Broplems is

Bad energy controll and very high cost skills.

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Support Merc Broplems is

It lost every opponent who is tank. Support merc losing every opponent who using overpowered aux special (azrael torment)



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Game makers is nerf MERCENARY class too much now. Bunkker is nerfed. static smash get buff/NERF= nerf. other classes gets buff even they donest need buff.


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MERCENARY class need better skills in overall (skillstree) OR other classes need nerf.






Stonehawk -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (8/16/2015 7:56:35)

quote:

THis class is overnerfed now. (Feeling strongly)


Mercenary class isnt (good) STR builds.
--- This broblems is weak and very high cost skills in skilltree.
--- VERY BAD ENEGRY CONTROLL (ever never see this weakness) even STR buff dosent help ;(...............
--- some skill need Club

Mercenary class isnt (good) DEX builds.
THis is pretty much laaa laaa laaa builds. because mercenary is zero skill in here.


Mercenary class isnt (good) TECH builds.
--- VERY BAD ENEGRY CONTROLL (ever never see this weakness) even STR buff dosent help ;(...............
--- This broblems is weak and very high cost skills in skilltree.

Mercenary class isnt (good) SUP builds.
--- This broblems is weak and very high cost skills in skilltree.
--- VERY BAD ENEGRY CONTROLL (ever never see this weakness) even STR buff dosent help ;(...............



Mercenary energy control is EXTREME WEAK. IT need big buff or other 5 classes need big nerfs to energy controll.



For the first time I fought a mercenary after update and the first thing I said when he drained my energy was: Dude, max this skill, lol. He took 200 energy from me and it gave him 158 energy (Focus build). This is wrong. Battery backup doesn't need stats to heal a lot more, while mercenaries need to use a skill that costs 200 at max in order to drain decent energy, and probably not enough to get the energy back again to be able to blood commander again and use another skill (I'm not even considering the other player taking the energy back).

If this is the new static smash, I suggest 3 or even 2 cooldown, otherwise mercenaries will be just a joke and not a class to be used anymore. Err, 3 cooldown is fine, or just make it worth it. Don't forget battery gives 333 energy at the cost of nothing and without requirements!



Alkimos -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (8/16/2015 15:32:12)

The amount of players who even play this class speaks for itself. The only good mercs that still play would be G00NY ( who still hasn't changed class), .Lord Ginger. ( when he actually chooses to play one), Punkki, and Me.

5 Focus Mercenary is garbage now, mercenary as a whole to be honest. It is impossible to beat a 5 focus Tech Mage because static does not take enough and they can keep Battery Boosting. I assume static was nerfed because of stat abusing support mercs. Now mercs who played 5 focus only get punished. Being competitive in 1v1 is impossible now.

As much as I would simply like to switch classes, I have always stuck it out and found strategies. But this is the nail in the coffin. This class has no creativity what-so-ever, & you end up getting punished for it. The amount of players who even play this class speaks for itself,

quote:


and probably not enough to get the energy back again to be able to blood commander again and use another skill

This is a HUGE problem. Blood Commander is essential for all mercenary builds at this point. Your only option is too use it first turn (which is sooo easy to counter), or use it strategically in later rounds ( by the time all the energy control is done you will be short by a few points). Static needs to deal damage & take more energy.



kittycat -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (8/16/2015 16:26:08)

Well maybe program Mercenary's double strike into a new skill that gives a set amount of energy when used, like 75 energy per use, and have its damage scaling changed to dealing only 100% Primary Damage to 118% Primary Damage



.Lord Ginger. -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (8/16/2015 21:28:56)

Static needs the buff definetely, or double strike...club use and then TLM could use it. It steals a minimal amount, it's pretty sad. Vandrak received 165 energy with 45 strength, used to give me 199-206 with 45 strength, and that wasn't even that great of a energy regeneration.

Definetely needs buff, it's basically like pyro fly... without good energy move, you're most likely dead...



Dark Worshgiper -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (8/17/2015 0:03:39)

Adrenaline Rush : Deals 85% damage;instantly grant a percentage of their maximum Rage and steal a percentage from you opponent.
Level 1: 24% Rage gained , 12% Rage Stolen
Level 2: 28% Rage gained , 14% Rage Stolen
Level 3: 32% Rage gained , 16% Rage Stolen
Level 4: 36% Rage gained , 18% Rage Stolen
Level 5: 40% Rage gained , 20% Rage Stolen
Level 6: 44% Rage gained , 22% Rage Stolen
Level 7: 48% Rage gained , 24% Rage Stolen
Level 8: 52% Rage gained , 26% Rage Stolen
Level 9: 56% Rage gained , 28% Rage Stolen
Level 10: 60% Rage gained , 30% Rage Stolen
What is happening i am posting this at =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread but it posts here why ?



kittycat -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (8/17/2015 2:21:58)

I would veto against your revamp of Adrenaline Rush because that would devalue Platinum Pride's special. Adrenaline Rush should lose rage draining or gaining abilities to make room for gaining energy in my opinion.



nowras -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (8/17/2015 3:04:16)

Static Smash <<<<< simple buff make it improve with technology ^^



Stonehawk -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (9/5/2015 8:13:07)

quote:

Static Smash <<<<< simple buff make it improve with technology ^^


bunker + static smash + surgical strike = everyone will use that build because it would be the only with a good energy drain.


If it is to keep static smash with such low energy drain/gain, just decrease cooldown to 3. It worked with Static Charge. ;)



nowras -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (9/5/2015 9:01:06)

the other move should be adrenaline rush


Increases your rage and energy pool by a % it should no longer do damage

Cooldown: 4 turns

level 1 - 8%

level 2 - 11%

level 3 - 14%

level 4 - 17%

level 5 - 20%

level 6 - 23%

level 7 - 26%

level 8 - 29%

level 9 - 32%

level 10 - 35%


= 217 energy if u don't invest in energy at all and more energy if u do + rage ;)


but there's a disadvantage with this change

SUPPORT BUILDS ARE GOING TO BE SO OP

so extra change: Life steal from blood commander = 7% for each focus level = 35% life steal if u have 5 focus that's actually fair..



santonik -> RE: =ED= Official Mercenary Balance Discussion Thread (9/5/2015 15:58:43)

NOTE : This is ONLY high support mercenary balance.




I have play very much mercenary and i can tell you this. High SUPPORT mercenary is very strong side and very weak side.

Best (support build) what i have found is 189 support whit 1012 HP. Yes it is REALLY HEAVY BOMBARD. But it is REAL class gannon. (so many weakness in defence)


High SUPPORT Mercenary weakness is these. High HP opponent whit STR and good medic heal. very hard to beat them. mercenary NEED luck to beat them. whitout luck mercenary lose. deflects/blocks ruining alot. Sometime I can make good damage it is still not enough. Becouse opponent doing much faster damage than me (dont look 2 fisrt turn alone) I dont have defence/resistance. I have only attack.

High SUPPORT Mercenary SUPER WEAKNESS is AZRAEL SET. YES both GUN and AUX special. GUN special making you strike (you can you this advantage) and AUX special destroy mercenary blood commander skill. When blood commander is ruined high SUPPORT mercenary is Very easy to defeat. Only way how mercenary can beat opponent in this situation is this. Opponent making FATAL ERROR. otherway high support cant beat opponent. I have so many matchess in this high support builds.

Yeti bots is pretty good against all support build. People dont use it because there is better bots. (against others build)

PRO tip how you can counter High support mercenary. Use shield. this can be stop primary damage or even artillery strike.

PRO tip. Dont give high SUPPORT players get full rage meter and artillery strike. That is very powerful. Artiller strike whit full rage is killing blow. No need nerf artillery strike. Opponent is making mistake or it is natural weakness to opponent.

PRO tip. Destroy high support player energy. Mercenary is very hard to recover energy. (even whit blood commander)

PRO tip. Use PYRO FLY. It can DESTROY 1 skill totally. Perhaps something really important.
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I can tell you what high support normally beating.

Almoust all 5 focus builds.



5 Focus
High SUPPORT mercenary can beat this if luck is merc side. (high SUPPORT is gambling build) If opponent is over than 1000 HP. High support player is trouble. If FOCUS player have pyro fly and using that special. That can give insta win or lose. Really depend what skill that took away.

If 5 focus player making AUX special (azrael torment) this is PRETTY MUCH INSTA WIN. Because this AUX special is freaking overpowered against HIGH SUPPORT mercenary. (only mercenary is super weak against this) AUX special destroy VERY EFFECTIVE WAY in that BLOOD COMMANDER benefits. STR and heal buff. Damage is heal.

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There is some skill combo what need check (balance)

Boynty hunter. Mark of Blood, Smoke Screen, Shadow Arts and Static Grenade. This 4 skills is very powerful against high support players.

---Mark of blood: give very MUCH HP back (about 140 HP PER turn)

---Smoke Screen: This destroy tempotary opponent defence. Very powerfyl agaisnt high support player. High support player defence is only (about) 80. THis giving over strong hit. high support Mercenary cant counter this. If boynty use Mark of blood and bot. Then game is over.

---Shadow Arts: This skill is mercenary killing skill. Super defence against all sources. Even static smash going even weaker. it is already weak. I think Shadow art need nerf. It is better than hybrid armor. Because it is 2 benefit what isnt hybrid armour.
Shadow art can decreased energy damage. Shadow art can decreased opponent rage (slower damage is lower rage)

--- Static Grenade: This is something what i dont undertand always (super) strong skill against high support players. even boynty is so low stats to support. Shadow art , static grenade and mark of blood combo is devastating. almoust imbosible counter that.(support merc)

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Techmage is STR builds assimilation is game breaking skill. It is doing more/equal damage to energy than static smash but assimilation is much more benefit. So this 1 skill (assimilation) need fix to better balance.

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Cyber hunter emp can 1 turn shutdown high support mercenary. hard to counter but not imbosible.

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Stregth Tcl merc poison grenade. This kill very fast high support builds. Only pure luck high support mercenary can beat those builds. imbisible if Tclmerc using azrael set. (GUN/AUX) High SUPPORT merc get usually 300~400 damage to grenade damage+poison (poison 3x130). This making STR build poison grenade too effective. Even ULTIMATEs CANT DOING SUCH DAMAGE.

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Bloodmage and Mercenary is easyest to counter. Because they lacking something. These is easyest classes to counter . Of course i lose them too. Because high SUPPORT BUILDS IS GAMBLING build.




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