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=AQW= Reevaluating the Rarity of Certain Items

 
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4/18/2017 23:24:25   
Christophoses
AQW Tester
&
Lore Adept


I know this is a controversial topic, but please bear with me.

Rares are a huge part of AQW. It's both a business decision and something that allows collectors to stand out from the rest of the crowd. It works about 85% of the time, but there's that remaining 15% that is somewhat of a problem. In short, it's somewhat unfair and a bit of a slap in the face.

Recently, certain items that were sold in the past -- like way in the past -- are being featured in newer storylines. I'm not talking about Quibble items here. They were just random items that people didn't purchase because they thought it had no significance. For the collectors who value lore specific items, this isn't fair because it makes players feel foolish for not purchasing absolutely every item that is released out of fear of missing out on a potentially significant item.

This problem also applies to a handful of Quibble shops. There have been many items sold by Quibble that are likely to appear in future AQW stories or hold significance to players who have also experienced some of the other major AE games.

Does anyone think that certain items should have their rarity reevaluated and possibly make a comeback? Do you have any specific items in mind? If so, why do you think these items should make a return?

=Tagged= Interesting discussion, I'll keep an eye on this. - Alina

< Message edited by Alina -- 4/19/2017 12:40:49 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 1
4/18/2017 23:39:11   
Aura Knight
Member

The only thing I have been wishing would be exempt from the exclusivity of being rare are classes. If something has an impact on gameplay it should not be available for a limited time. Obviously there are going to be those that disagree and they've got their reasons. I personally don't agree with most those reasons but who am I to decide whether one's views on something are right or wrong? The most disappointing thing about rare classes is that new players can miss out on some unique skillsets. I think there should be ways to bring such skillsets back. I'd be okay if they were altered. While I'm guessing there are players upset over VoT and The Collector, I think that was a step in the right direction.

But if you're talking about random items like weapons, armors, helms and capes, I don't care if I missed those usually. However, there are exceptions. But the things I'd like another chance to get won't sit well with others so it's probably best not to mention them.

One thing that comes to mind is Snowball Amberarms. While that pet is rare, the NPC from which it was bought seems to indicate that it should have been seasonal. It may be a legend only pet but I see no reason why it had to leave, especially if the NPC selling it implies that we can get it again the following year.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 2
4/18/2017 23:57:11   
Christophoses
AQW Tester
&
Lore Adept


@above

I definitely agree about classes not going rare. Seasonal classes are totally acceptable, but classes going rare altogether isn't fair for players who happen to join the game a bit later.

As for the other items going rare, in some cases, it seems like an artificial rarity is being created. Some items have no purpose of going rare.
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 3
4/19/2017 0:25:41   
Ninjaty
Member

I disagree on the whole "classes should not be able to go rare" thing. Classes, just like any other item, is something a player actually needs to have in their inventory, and thus contributes to the overall collecting value. If classes shouldn't be able to be rares, then that is as good as saying that rare collectors shouldn't have classes at all; and as has already been pointed out, classes offer functionality, they are literally required to play. So by extension of that argument, rare collectors shouldn't be able to play, unless they are willing to play on the terms that non-rare collectors set, which would not be fair either.

When it comes to rares, there will always be two sides, just as with any other argument. There are also those people that will never have the time to do PvP in any serious capacity, or do end game quests in any serious capacity, and so will never realistically have the time required to get those items. This should also mean that desirable items, such as classes, should never be allowed to be obtained through farming, as otherwise some people will miss out there as well. People will always miss out on stuff, that is just part of life. Every single day, we each miss out on billions upon billions of events, and no human being (to my knowledge) has ever managed to have a complete collection of everything that exists in the universe. No one can simply have everything, so those, in my opinion, are not good arguments. We will always be limited in one way or another.

Unless classes are removed from being items, and instead are loaded from NPCs or other such means, as I see it, there can never be a fair argument to not having those be rare, along with the other rares. Even if the absolute strongest class in the entire game ended up being a perma rare item, that class still wouldn't be required in order to play or enjoy the game, you could still get the second strongest. There will always be other classes to get, as long as not all of them falls into one of the two types; rares or available, and thus, there will always be something for everyone.



As for bringing any other rares back, again, I feel that would be a very poor decision on AE's part. Cutting down on new rares being created, I am perfectly fine with, but no need to punish people that have already invested the time and money obtaining the current rares. As long as something have been confirmed to be perma rare, either by default through one of the guaranteed rarities, or by direct word of staff, I don't believe there can ever be a reasonable argument for bringing them back, no more than there would be reason for AE to just delete an item like VHL from the game, after so many have obtained it.

< Message edited by Ninjaty -- 4/19/2017 0:27:43 >
Post #: 4
4/19/2017 0:55:20   
Aura Knight
Member

Well, we obviously have differing opinions and though I still don't like the way you think, I won't hate on someone for what they believe. Still, I think missing out on unique skillsets is a good enough reason to consider bringing some classes back. I'd even be okay if they were altered so that the ones already rare don't lose their "value". While you're not wrong in saying we don't need to get every class and that if the strongest one is perma rare, we can get the next strongest, I still feel disappointed when I miss out on something like a class. However, if the skills of a class can be reused in future classes somehow, things won't be so bad.

I can't think of many items that aren't classes which I'd like to see return if possible. A few pets come to mind but such a thing wouldn't be fair to those who already have them. It's a bit shocking for me to say such a thing since I usually don't care what rare hoarders think.

If there is a possible way to have certain items return and not cause any issues, then I'd be all for such a thing. Unfortunately, I have doubts this can happen. Human greed and selfishness known no bounds and in regards to this game, it's no different. Such a thing does sadden me.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 5
4/19/2017 0:58:07   
xstreamshadow
Member

Personally, i think skill sets shouldn't go rare, not classes. For example, unlucky leprechaun is rare, but not evolved leprechaun. Or collector and VoT despite the difference in power.

AQW  Post #: 6
4/19/2017 1:05:46   
Christophoses
AQW Tester
&
Lore Adept


@Ninjaty

quote:

I disagree on the whole "classes should not be able to go rare" thing. Classes, just like any other item, is something a player actually needs to have in their inventory, and thus contributes to the overall collecting value. If classes shouldn't be able to be rares, then that is as good as saying that rare collectors shouldn't have classes at all; and as has already been pointed out, classes offer functionality, they are literally required to play. So by extension of that argument, rare collectors shouldn't be able to play, unless they are willing to play on the terms that non-rare collectors set, which would not be fair either.


How did you gather that Rare collectors shouldn't be able to play at all? That's a rather bold statement that misses my point almost entirely. I'm saying that classes shouldn't be on the list of things that are meant to be collected and should only be enjoyed.

quote:

People will always miss out on stuff, that is just part of life. Every single day, we each miss out on billions upon billions of events, and no human being (to my knowledge) has ever managed to have a complete collection of everything that exists in the universe. No one can simply have everything, so those, in my opinion, are not good arguments. We will always be limited in one way or another.


People will not be able to experience every event in the world because it is physically impossible. If humans were able to achieve quantum superposition this wouldn't be the case, but we aren't able to accomplish such a feat as of yet. Obtaining certain game items isn't a similar situation. Furthermore, I said that certain items should possibly return. I never said that all items should return.

quote:

Unless classes are removed from being items, and instead are loaded from NPCs or other such means, as I see it, there can never be a fair argument to not having those be rare, along with the other rares. Even if the absolute strongest class in the entire game ended up being a perma rare item, that class still wouldn't be required in order to play or enjoy the game, you could still get the second strongest. There will always be other classes to get, as long as not all of them falls into one of the two types; rares or available, and thus, there will always be something for everyone.


Having a weaker class when you know that something better was out there is diminishing a person's experience. In most cases, the situation is that people weren't playing the game and never had the opportunity to get the items they want. Like I said before, it's a matter of creating an artificial rarity for no valid reason.

quote:

As for bringing any other rares back, again, I feel that would be a very poor decision on AE's part. Cutting down on new rares being created, I am perfectly fine with, but no need to punish people that have already invested the time and money obtaining the current rares. As long as something have been confirmed to be perma rare, either by default through one of the guaranteed rarities, or by direct word of staff, I don't believe there can ever be a reasonable argument for bringing them back, no more than there would be reason for AE to just delete an item like VHL from the game, after so many have obtained it.


Like I said, items should only return if they have a valid reason for returning. Take Quibble's 19th shop, for example. Those items should NEVER have gone rare since they a part of the AE experience as a whole. Telling players that they can't obtain iconic items from the other games that they know and love is an injustice to those who have invested time and money beyond the AQW experience. The items in that shop don't belong to AQW players. They belong to the AE player base as a whole. The same goes for every class that has ever been released.

----

@Aura Knight

quote:

I can't think of many items that aren't classes which I'd like to see return if possible. A few pets come to mind but such a thing wouldn't be fair to those who already have them. It's a bit shocking for me to say such a thing since I usually don't care what rare hoarders think.

If there is a possible way to have certain items return and not cause any issues, then I'd be all for such a thing. Unfortunately, I have doubts this can happen. Human greed and selfishness known no bounds and in regards to this game, it's no different. Such a thing does sadden me.


So rare hoarders lose out on having super exclusive items? So what? Exclusivity is what causes a lot of resentment and hate in this community. As such, there should be a certain amount of leeway to reduce these feelings. The amount of time that Alpha Pirate has caused conflict in Yulgar's Inn is ridiculous. I'm not saying that Alpha Pirate should return, but there should be some compensation elsewhere. Like you said, selfishness and greed is saddening.

I couldn't care less about item rarity and I have A LOT of rares. I wish everyone in AQW could have access to my entire inventory as a shop so they can have a little more freedom to equip whatever they want.

< Message edited by Christophisis -- 4/19/2017 1:18:14 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 7
4/19/2017 1:40:36   
Aura Knight
Member

I think having too many rares can be a bad thing. I'm not sure if it still happens but years ago I'd notice scam attempts just to get an account with a rare class or item. Alpha Pirates were one of the most targeted. Now, like you, I'm not saying to bring it back, but I do wish there were some way to make everyone happy.

Perhaps we can have a feature where we can lend someone an item for a period of time. However, to avoid loss of items, the lent item couldn't be sold, deleted or banked as long as it's with the borrower and after a select period of time, it returns to the original owner. This way, those who missed out on something can have a chance to try it out. Perhaps by doing so, they'll realize they didn't need the rare they missed at all. This would be an alternative to trade but without risk. At least, I can't think of any risk.

Players can get the same experience as others just for a limited time. There would be certain restrictions to this as well.

< Message edited by Aura Knight -- 4/19/2017 1:41:18 >
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 8
4/19/2017 1:48:25   
Christophoses
AQW Tester
&
Lore Adept


@above

Someone suggested that one of the loyalty rewards should be a token that gives you a specific item. Instead, why not have the item allow you to have access to X amount of shops of your choice where you can purchase any of the items available. You still need to purchase the items and you would only have access to a very limited amount of items of your choice. All the shops in-game have IDs so it would simply be a matter of providing players with a list of IDs and giving them this power. Alternatively, players could purchase these items outside of the game, similar to how the LQS works.
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 9
4/19/2017 10:51:50   
Asuka
AQW Designer of All Things


quote:

If classes shouldn't be able to be rares, then that is as good as saying that rare collectors shouldn't have classes at all; and as has already been pointed out, classes offer functionality, they are literally required to play. So by extension of that argument, rare collectors shouldn't be able to play, unless they are willing to play on the terms that non-rare collectors set, which would not be fair either.


UhhhhhHHHHH... I have...Concerns personally about this one very statement

quote:

Having a weaker class when you know that something better was out there is diminishing a person's experience. In most cases, the situation is that people weren't playing the game and never had the opportunity to get the items they want. Like I said before, it's a matter of creating an artificial rarity for no valid reason.


I wouldn't say it weakens the experience. For me, my main go to class is always Dragon Lord. Its not really "rare" its there always. The power of other classes doesn't really effect me as much. DL was and always will be muh baby

quote:

Someone suggested that one of the loyalty rewards should be a token that gives you a specific item. Instead, why not have the item allow you to have access to X amount of shops of your choice where you can purchase any of the items available. You still need to purchase the items and you would only have access to a very limited amount of items of your choice. All the shops in-game have IDs so it would simply be a matter of providing players with a list of IDs and giving them this power. Alternatively, players could purchase these items outside of the game, similar to how the LQS works.


I mean isnt that essentially what the loyalty rewards are. Rewards for doing a specific saga/ac purchased/etc? I see no difference here

_____________________________

DF AQW Epic  Post #: 10
4/19/2017 11:25:00   
Aura Knight
Member

Missing a class might not be so bad as not every class is necessary to have, however, it is disappointing knowing there are skillsets I'll never have a chance at. If classes are available for a limited time, isn't that a bit rude for the ones who created those classes? What's the point in making something if only few will experience it? I think too much time and effort goes into making classes so wouldn't it be nicer for everyone to get a chance at them instead of having them available for a limited time? Don't class designers take pride in knowing what they create will make future players happy? They can't if their classes are only available for a short time.

I'm surprised more designers aren't overwhelmed by the amount of things they have to create because of AQW's need to sell rares every week.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 11
4/19/2017 11:28:46   
G Man
Member

On the classes:
As an owner of several rare classes; Yeah, let them come back, I could care less. What another player uses doesn't really affect me all that much. (Unless, you know, the group needs a healer, or if they're using particularly laggy items...)

On the subject of rares in general:
Yeah.... there's already far too many for my tastes.
There's a high ratio of rares/exclusives (Seasonal/Perma rare, exclusive to other in-game items/merch) to content that is accessible to all players.
Personally: The more people that get to enjoy an item/have fun/get to experience more, the better.

Also, since this subject keeps popping up every now and then, I'll keep repeating myself; the ToS/T&C outright states AE can alter game data in any way they wish, and that you DO NOT "own" your in-game items.
Soo, yeah, if AE WANTS rares to come back, they WILL.

< Message edited by G Man -- 4/19/2017 11:34:39 >
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 12
4/19/2017 12:04:20   
Ninjaty
Member

@above: With that mentality, we may as well just make all items in the game free, both in terms of effort and money, so that all players can enjoy everything equally. All member only items have their member tags removed; all end game farming items become 0 gold items in Yulgar's shop, etc. The fastest way to lose your playerbase, is to screw over the players, especially when money or significant effort is involved. Besides, making sales based on deceptive advertisement (such as claiming a certain item can never be obtained again, which real money is involved in obtaining) is not just shady business, but is downright illegal, regardless of what your agreements say.

If AE wanted to merely sell us lies, then by all means let them go ahead. But if they truly care about their players and their own integrity as a good company, then just bringing back all rares like that will never be an option. The ToS/T&C are there to protect them from theft and in case of something accidentally happening to their data, as well as to reserve the right to punish those that break the rules; they are not there to casually screw over thousands upon thousands of players, just for the heck of it.

< Message edited by Ninjaty -- 4/19/2017 12:08:52 >
Post #: 13
4/19/2017 12:11:20   
G Man
Member

Did I ever say that people should be handed things on a silver platter?
No.
Did I say they should have an easier time or a cheaper price that the original owners?
No.
Do not assert such a thing unless it has been stated or heavily implied.
I only said that the more people having fun, and having access to content is a good thing.
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 14
4/19/2017 12:19:33   
Ninjaty
Member

And I agree completely with the notion that more items for everyone equals a generally happier environment. But your post did imply an opinion towards making rares available to be a good thing, which I then argued it is not, unless the same concept of availability be applied evenly to other player groups as well. Deliberately taking away one of the major factors for one group's continued spending money on and playing the game, for the sake of giving this factor to the other groups, could just as easily be applied to all the groups, and in fact should for a fair environment. Why should one group have to specifically suffer for the betterment of the rest of the community, when instead all groups could suffer equally, to lessen the effect and amplify the rewards?

Since you proposed that rares could have their very reason for being taken away, just so more people could enjoy them, is the same I applied to member content and farming content. By taking away their reasons for being (their criteria for being obtained and the circumstances under which they can be obtained), more items have been given to the masses, but at the expense of the player groups those very items were intended for in the first place.

For instance, items like BLoD and VHL were created specifcally to give players something to work for, and to reward the players who does so. If we take away the farming, the items have become more widely accessible, yes, but at the cost of losing their very reason for being, and at the expense of the very people such items are intended for; namely the farming part of the community.


At the end of the day, I feel it would be better not to step over any specific groups, and instead just try to even out the content distribution with new releases; that way, everyone can be happy, nobody loses.

< Message edited by Ninjaty -- 4/19/2017 12:27:17 >
Post #: 15
4/19/2017 12:37:45   
Aura Knight
Member

I don't understand what suffering the rare collecting players would have to deal with. Only thing that comes to mind is "Oh no, I can't be /afk with that one set because others can get it again." Those that missed out on something rare will never get to experience using that item. I'd say that's way more disappointing than anything those who do have the item have to deal with.

I'm just glad the game has a good amount of permanent content so that there are things all players can enjoy. And I don't think it's too bad to want some things to return.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 16
4/19/2017 12:45:57   
  Alina
Battleon Sorceress


We have been releasing too many rares the last few years, and I want to dial that back. Rare items have a definite place in our game, but we should not be making items rare just to do so. If an item goes rare, it should be for a good reason -- because it is a signifier that you were at a place (or point/event) in the game, and want a souvenir of that.

Making rare variants of everyday release gear has gotten out of hand, and should not be necessary. We are going to try cutting back on that level/quantity of rare items -- see how that works out -- and making sure that the items that do go rare deserve it.

< Message edited by Alina -- 4/19/2017 12:47:53 >
AQ DF MQ AQW  Post #: 17
4/19/2017 12:51:18   
Aura Knight
Member

There's been disappointment with some of the Quibble shops as quite a few players think the quality of the items sold aren't worth the AC's we're expected to pay for them. I don't know how pricing is decided but even I question that at times. If the game is struggling for money, isn't it easier to ask the players for help instead of making AC rares each week and hoping purchases are made?
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 18
4/19/2017 13:17:24   
Tyroniter
Member

If I may just give my small bit of input in this. I know rare classes have been discussed a bit before, and while I do agree a bit with both sides on that topic, one thing that I wanna talk about is Birthday Classes. Like, I understand the reason behind them being annual and going rare and all, but shouldn't they be kept in game as a token or something to AQW's history? I mean I don't quite know how to say it, but I just feel that the new players should also be able to take part in the birthday events of the past, and if not the rare items, atleast be able to farm the classes. Not just new players, I'm sure even old players who missed out on the classes because of inactivity would want a chance to obtain them too. And while I understand that this is true for almost all rare classes, the reason that I mentioned Birthday Classes specifically is because it's become a sort of traditional thing, and something which quite a lot of players look forward to, and something that I feel a lot of players should be given a chance to look back upon too.
AQW  Post #: 19
4/19/2017 14:31:45   
ShadowMoon
Member

quote:

if classes shouldn't be able to be rares, then that is as good as saying that rare collectors shouldn't have classes at all; and as has already been pointed out, classes offer functionality, they are literally required to play. So by extension of that argument, rare collectors shouldn't be able to play, unless they are willing to play on the terms that non-rare collectors set, which would not be fair either.

when we are referring to rare classes most of us are talking about stuff like dark castor & abyssal angel, even without those there plenty of rare classes attached to hero mart items whose rarity won't ever be touched due to heromarts ToS.
in fact, the main thing that need to come back is the classes skills, not the classes themselves. toss the skills onto a class with a different name & a different look and there shouldn't be any problem


< Message edited by ShadowMoon -- 4/19/2017 16:07:02 >
AQ DF MQ AQW Epic  Post #: 20
4/19/2017 14:47:21   
Aura Knight
Member

Are there really players that think they should only use rare classes and anything else must be avoided? This sounds like it would lead to horrible experiences in game as they're missing out on other permanent classes.
AQ DF AQW  Post #: 21
4/19/2017 15:05:48   
iDreadnaut
Member

Well, there are players that follow that "rule" for cosmetic items, so...
AQW  Post #: 22
4/19/2017 15:55:43   
xstreamshadow
Member

@aura knight

I like to afk in battleon with rare classes, but otherwise i use any class i want.

On the topic of rare classes, why not make a map where you can test out rare classes within the map? Like what they did with ptr 1?
AQW  Post #: 23
4/19/2017 17:58:01   
aaronarco
Member

Imma weigh in on this. I don't mind for others to gain something tagged/labeled as rare, especially to those newly created accounts, like my brother in faith who just started playing this. But an idea, i dunno if this is stated above cuz its kinda obvious, is to have a seasonal "throwback shop" where we bring up 50 or how many random rare items it would be reasonable to "temporarily" bring back rares. Bring it back costing more acs than before would be fair imo. I asked Alina once for the reboot of Grimlord Cloak when she announced there will be rebooted Nulgath items, and I said I'm willing to spend twice the AC for it. Probably do the throwback shop twice a year, and it woulf be awesome for people to anticipate the upcoming rare-returns.

E.g. "Throwback Shop! 100 rare items from different releases are being hauled back for a limited time (or limited quantity!) only!"

"Oh wow! I wish they would bring back that animated ninja scarf thing!"

Regarding classes, that went rare, its totally fine if they wont be included in the shop. Since aesthetically, classes arent the widest when it comes to choices of looks. But afaik, old classes are outclassed by the new ones. And collectors will be sad if they are actually braggadocious about their alpha pirate, and the next day, he sees a week old account with AlphaP and BetaB.

Regarding the price hike for rares, it would also be acceptable to label them with something to distinguish them from the old/rare/og shop. Like what they did to the starting classes, Warrior (Rare). E.g. Add the throwback to the One-Eyed Drow Helm +5 (put tag here).

Oh and all the items mentioned above are the ones I would love to have :'(

edit: and I noticed, and obviously cared for the "entitlement" of rare collectors, man, they earned it, we can't blame them if they hate to see "perma-rares" to go "semi-rares". So it would be a nice compensation for them to see that tag that says "Hah, buyback" while his rare has a (Omega-Rare-Super-Collector-Fedora-God) tag in it. Tbh, we could always settle for peace and agreement and fairness.

(so please gib aaron a voucher (non-mem) i been farming for weeks nao)


< Message edited by aaronarco -- 4/19/2017 18:13:24 >
Post #: 24
4/19/2017 18:06:48   
Christophoses
AQW Tester
&
Lore Adept


@Asuka

quote:

I wouldn't say it weakens the experience. For me, my main go to class is always Dragon Lord. Its not really "rare" its there always. The power of other classes doesn't really effect me as much. DL was and always will be muh baby


That's a very fair point. However, some people would like to be able to use a specific rare for a specific reason. Not being able to have access to those classes would mean that you can't achieve your "class dreams". Imagine if DragonLord went rare right before you joined the game and you really wanted to be able to use that class. That's how some people feel about classes like VoT, Chunin, etc.

quote:

I mean isnt that essentially what the loyalty rewards are. Rewards for doing a specific saga/ac purchased/etc? I see no difference here


Mainly. However, there are people who want to have the ability to access the OG items that they admire and never had a chance to obtain.

Having the ability to access a rare shop or two would probably be one of the higher up rewards, like 8 years of membership, for example, if this feature were ever to be introduced.

----

@G Man

quote:

As an owner of several rare classes; Yeah, let them come back, I could care less. What another player uses doesn't really affect me all that much. (Unless, you know, the group needs a healer, or if they're using particularly laggy items...)

On the subject of rares in general:
Yeah.... there's already far too many for my tastes.
There's a high ratio of rares/exclusives (Seasonal/Perma rare, exclusive to other in-game items/merch) to content that is accessible to all players.
Personally: The more people that get to enjoy an item/have fun/get to experience more, the better.


AQW should be about being able to equip whatever you want if you have the funds to buy the items or the time to farm them.

----

@Ninjaty

quote:

With that mentality, we may as well just make all items in the game free, both in terms of effort and money, so that all players can enjoy everything equally. All member only items have their member tags removed; all end game farming items become 0 gold items in Yulgar's shop, etc. The fastest way to lose your playerbase, is to screw over the players, especially when money or significant effort is involved. Besides, making sales based on deceptive advertisement (such as claiming a certain item can never be obtained again, which real money is involved in obtaining) is not just shady business, but is downright illegal, regardless of what your agreements say.

If AE wanted to merely sell us lies, then by all means let them go ahead. But if they truly care about their players and their own integrity as a good company, then just bringing back all rares like that will never be an option. The ToS/T&C are there to protect them from theft and in case of something accidentally happening to their data, as well as to reserve the right to punish those that break the rules; they are not there to casually screw over thousands upon thousands of players, just for the heck of it.


How did you go to this extreme? We're not saying that everything should be free and that certain players should be punished. People would still have to buy the rares is they made a return. This is simply about giving players the opportunity to obtain what they want through legitimate means.

quote:

And I agree completely with the notion that more items for everyone equals a generally happier environment. But your post did imply an opinion towards making rares available to be a good thing, which I then argued it is not, unless the same concept of availability be applied evenly to other player groups as well. Deliberately taking away one of the major factors for one group's continued spending money on and playing the game, for the sake of giving this factor to the other groups, could just as easily be applied to all the groups, and in fact should for a fair environment. Why should one group have to specifically suffer for the betterment of the rest of the community, when instead all groups could suffer equally, to lessen the effect and amplify the rewards?

Since you proposed that rares could have their very reason for being taken away, just so more people could enjoy them, is the same I applied to member content and farming content. By taking away their reasons for being (their criteria for being obtained and the circumstances under which they can be obtained), more items have been given to the masses, but at the expense of the player groups those very items were intended for in the first place.

For instance, items like BLoD and VHL were created specifcally to give players something to work for, and to reward the players who does so. If we take away the farming, the items have become more widely accessible, yes, but at the cost of losing their very reason for being, and at the expense of the very people such items are intended for; namely the farming part of the community.


At the end of the day, I feel it would be better not to step over any specific groups, and instead just try to even out the content distribution with new releases; that way, everyone can be happy, nobody loses.


The elitist mentality is the worst type of mentality. It causes unnecessary conflict. Certain players aren't "suffering" because other people will have access to a very small portion of these elitist items. Significantly more people would profit from this decision than those who will "suffer".

In regards to your argument about Legend tags, we're only talking about having accessibility to items. Legend items are still accessible to those who are willing to purchase a membership. The problem with Rare items is that there's an insurmountable barrier that you can't pass.

----

@Alina

quote:

We have been releasing too many rares the last few years, and I want to dial that back. Rare items have a definite place in our game, but we should not be making items rare just to do so. If an item goes rare, it should be for a good reason -- because it is a signifier that you were at a place (or point/event) in the game, and want a souvenir of that.


Like you said, Rares definitely have a place in the game. However, there are certain items that are labeled Rare that shouldn't be. Quibble's 19th shop is a prime example. That shop is full of iconic items from other AE games, most of which are currently accessible. All those items being rare means that people who play the other games can't get the iconic items they love because they weren't playing AQW at a specific time. It would be different if these items were never part of AQW or are rare in MQ, DF and AQ, but that isn't the case. The experience offered from that shop extends beyond AQW.

----

@Aura Knight

quote:

There's been disappointment with some of the Quibble shops as quite a few players think the quality of the items sold aren't worth the AC's we're expected to pay for them. I don't know how pricing is decided but even I question that at times. If the game is struggling for money, isn't it easier to ask the players for help instead of making AC rares each week and hoping purchases are made?


AC inflation has definitely been a thing in the past couple of years. Bills have to get paid, though, so there isn't much that can be done about that.

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@Tyroniter

quote:

If I may just give my small bit of input in this. I know rare classes have been discussed a bit before, and while I do agree a bit with both sides on that topic, one thing that I wanna talk about is Birthday Classes. Like, I understand the reason behind them being annual and going rare and all, but shouldn't they be kept in game as a token or something to AQW's history? I mean I don't quite know how to say it, but I just feel that the new players should also be able to take part in the birthday events of the past, and if not the rare items, atleast be able to farm the classes. Not just new players, I'm sure even old players who missed out on the classes because of inactivity would want a chance to obtain them too. And while I understand that this is true for almost all rare classes, the reason that I mentioned Birthday Classes specifically is because it's become a sort of traditional thing, and something which quite a lot of players look forward to, and something that I feel a lot of players should be given a chance to look back upon too.


You make a very good point. It makes newcomers -- who are a very important part of the game -- feel like they can't experience the histroy of AQW

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@ShadowMoon

quote:

there plenty of rare classes attached to hero mart items whose rarity won't ever be touched due to heromarts ToS.


Here's the thing, HeroMart items never actually go rare. If you have a code you can still redeem it and obtain the items. I bought the 2012 AE calendar about 3 years after the items had gone "rare" and i was still able to obtain everything upon entering the code.

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@Aura Knight

quote:

Are there really players that think they should only use rare classes and anything else must be avoided? This sounds like it would lead to horrible experiences in game as they're missing out on other permanent classes.


Not only that, but most rare classes are no longer part of the meta. That doesn't mean players shouldn't be able to use what they want, though.

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@aaronarco

A throwback shop is a brilliant idea. Bringing back 100 random Rare items a month for players to purchase at an increased price would benefit both AE and the player base.

----

Personally, I feel that any and all items that are currently rare discourage new players to join the game. If someone knows about 20 items, for example, that they really want why would they start playing if they know that it will be impossible for them to obtain any of those items?

< Message edited by Christophisis -- 4/19/2017 18:10:22 >
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